Minnesota Sports Forum

I haven't been on here much lately, and haven't seen this posted on the momentary glance I took, but the following brief article is music to every Wolves fans ears.

https://www.twincities.com/2019/01/13/heres-ryan-saunders-innovative-approach-to-improving-timberwolves-shot-selection/

Yeah, there hasn't been a lot of discussion about this, hockey, but I like it. Ryan learned a lot from his dad, but it also seems like he understands his dad's offense relied too much on the Long Two. The first step a communicative coach makes is to tell his team what he expects them to do...in this case, focus on more efficient shots. A better follow on step then is to actually drill that expectation into them through a game like this. Players are competitive and "points motivated" so an exercise like this goes a long way toward changing their mind set. There were probably several reasons why the Wolves took 14 more 3's than the Pels Saturday night, but I would submit this was one of them. Love the creativity, Ryan!

Thanks for posting, Hockey. And glad to see you back on the Board. I had heard about this, but hadn't read the article until you posted it here.

There are some on this Board who have pointed out that the Wolves have had some games this season where they took a lot of threes. But the overall numbers tell the tale. The Wolves have gone from last in 3-point attempts a year ago to 27th this season. And that's in spite of several games in which the Wolves took a lot of threes. So it's clear that the 3-point shot has not been a priority under Thibodeau. If it were, the Wolves wouldn't have been consistently near the bottom in 3-point attempts. As the article points out, the Wolves have also been near the top in long two-point attempts. It's been a double whammy. You could see it on the court with Wolves players repeatedly hesitating on 3-point attempts with pump fakes and then stepping in only to launch a long two.

Some of it might be the roster -- which Thibodeau put together. Some of it is clearly coaching. But the common denominator is Tom Thibodeau. The fact that Ryan was using this technique in practices underscores the fact that Thibodeau the head coach was not emphasizing the three or sufficiently de-emphasizing the long two. It's great to see that Ryan recognizes the critical importance of correcting this tendency. It's also great to see him implement some creative mechanisms in practice to foster a change. A caution for all of us is that it will take time for the players to unlearn the bad habits and develop new good habits. It will also take some time for them to get used to playing without getting play-by-play instructions from their head coach during games. But I have no doubt that, over time, the team's play will improve.

Well it's about damn time we had a coach that understood that three is greater than two! It's really not hard to change a team and player's shot selection. Milwaukee went from 25th in 3PTAs last season to 2nd this season, mostly with the same roster, but with a new coach. It basically took one training camp to make this huge leap.

What is innovative is the way Ryan is trying to go about changing habits. That is a very good sign of some fresh thinking in this organization......finally!!!

Q12543 wrote:Well it's about damn time we had a coach that understood that three is greater than two! It's really not hard to change a team and player's shot selection. Milwaukee went from 25th in 3PTAs last season to 2nd this season, mostly with the same roster, but with a new coach. It basically took one training camp to make this huge leap.

What is innovative is the way Ryan is trying to go about changing habits. That is a very good sign of some fresh thinking in this organization......finally!!!

Q you did not mention Brook Lopez at C. Adding him was a pretty big factor in the 3 point uptick.

monsterpile wrote:

Q12543 wrote:Well it's about damn time we had a coach that understood that three is greater than two! It's really not hard to change a team and player's shot selection. Milwaukee went from 25th in 3PTAs last season to 2nd this season, mostly with the same roster, but with a new coach. It basically took one training camp to make this huge leap.

What is innovative is the way Ryan is trying to go about changing habits. That is a very good sign of some fresh thinking in this organization......finally!!!

Q you did not mention Brook Lopez at C. Adding him was a pretty big factor in the 3 point uptick.

Good point, but they upped their 3pta by 14 attempts! He certainly is a part of that, but it's mostly coaching, as most players on the roster are at career highs in 3pta, including Lopez himself.

I'm not a fan of forcing up a bunch of contested 3's or passing up wide open 2's for contested 3's (this is what Houston often does) because I think that can be exploited in a long playoff series. But what we can't be doing is taking two dribbles in and then pulling up for a contested 2 (one of Wiggins' favorite shots). That shot needs to be completely extinguished unless we're in a shot clock situation.

Q12543 wrote:Well it's about damn time we had a coach that understood that three is greater than two! It's really not hard to change a team and player's shot selection. Milwaukee went from 25th in 3PTAs last season to 2nd this season, mostly with the same roster, but with a new coach. It basically took one training camp to make this huge leap.

What is innovative is the way Ryan is trying to go about changing habits. That is a very good sign of some fresh thinking in this organization......finally!!!

Milwaukee is fascinating to me. I've watched a handful of games. The spacing they create is unreal. Their players have great driving lanes to get to the rim. Having shooters space the floor with the ability to drive just puts so much pressure on the defense. Crazy prediction, Lopez finishes top 10 in the MVP race. If he doesn't he should. They space the floor around Giannis, he's unstoppable at the rim and a willing passer. If you haven't watched them I recommend you do.

lipoli390 wrote:

There are some on this Board who have pointed out that the Wolves have had some games this season where they took a lot of threes. But the overall numbers tell the tale. The Wolves have gone from last in 3-point attempts a year ago to 27th this season. And that's in spite of several games in which the Wolves took a lot of threes. So it's clear that the 3-point shot has not been a priority under Thibodeau. If it were, the Wolves wouldn't have been consistently near the bottom in 3-point attempts. As the article points out, the Wolves have also been near the top in long two-point attempts. It's been a double whammy. You could see it on the court with Wolves players repeatedly hesitating on 3-point attempts with pump fakes and then stepping in only to launch a long two.

The Wolves are 23rd right now in three point attempts at 28.7 per game... That means they were shooting 28.5 per game for Thibs.

With Cleveland currently 27th in three point attempts at only 26.0... and NOP at 24th at only 28.1 per game... how could the Wolves have been 27th in the league?
___________

Regardless...the point is valid. YES... the three pointer has not been a big enough part of the Wolves offense. And as noted, even more importantly, the long INEFFICIENT two pointer has been too much of the offense... for many, many years under both the Saunders/Mitchell and Thibodeau regimes.

3fga ranking by year:

30th (2018)
30th (Thibs)
29th (Mitchell)
30th (Saunders)
16th (Adelman)
21st (2013, Adelman)

I cringe to know where this squad stands with the number of long two pointers it takes. Where do we find that?

Duke13 wrote:

Q12543 wrote:Well it's about damn time we had a coach that understood that three is greater than two! It's really not hard to change a team and player's shot selection. Milwaukee went from 25th in 3PTAs last season to 2nd this season, mostly with the same roster, but with a new coach. It basically took one training camp to make this huge leap.

What is innovative is the way Ryan is trying to go about changing habits. That is a very good sign of some fresh thinking in this organization......finally!!!

Milwaukee is fascinating to me. I've watched a handful of games. The spacing they create is unreal. Their players have great driving lanes to get to the rim. Having shooters space the floor with the ability to drive just puts so much pressure on the defense. Crazy prediction, Lopez finishes top 10 in the MVP race. If he doesn't he should. They space the floor around Giannis, he's unstoppable at the rim and a willing passer. If you haven't watched them I recommend you do.

Yes, I have watched them. Lopez has been really important because he draws a big man out with his 3-point shot, which to your point helps open things up for Giannis. Brogdon is another guy that has become an invaluable piece (2nd rounder by the way). And Middleton is suddenly shooting like Michael Redd once did.

I'm happy for Milwaukee, which has sort of been in no man's land for a lot of years. Giannis has turned into the best case scenario when he was drafted and they have done a brilliant job surrounding him with supporting pieces and the right coach.

Q12543 wrote:

monsterpile wrote:

Q12543 wrote:Well it's about damn time we had a coach that understood that three is greater than two! It's really not hard to change a team and player's shot selection. Milwaukee went from 25th in 3PTAs last season to 2nd this season, mostly with the same roster, but with a new coach. It basically took one training camp to make this huge leap.

What is innovative is the way Ryan is trying to go about changing habits. That is a very good sign of some fresh thinking in this organization......finally!!!

Q you did not mention Brook Lopez at C. Adding him was a pretty big factor in the 3 point uptick.

Good point, but they upped their 3pta by 14 attempts! He certainly is a part of that, but it's mostly coaching, as most players on the roster are at career highs in 3pta, including Lopez himself.

I'm not a fan of forcing up a bunch of contested 3's or passing up wide open 2's for contested 3's (this is what Houston often does) because I think that can be exploited in a long playoff series. But what we can't be doing is taking two dribbles in and then pulling up for a contested 2 (one of Wiggins' favorite shots). That shot needs to be completely extinguished unless we're in a shot clock situation.

I'm certainly not saying coaching isn't a big part but the roster is part of it too and they added some 3 point shooting with Lopez was pretty massive. Only 9 players have made more 3's than Lopez this year and the guy isn't just making corner 3's or toeing the line...he is making them from well beyond the 3 point line he did a step back 3 on Drummond. If they don't add Lopez the Bud effect wouldn't be as hyped. I thought it was a good move at the time but it turned out to be one of the signings of the offseason.

The Wolves need to add some more 3 point shooting (especially in the draft and maybe a low cost FA here and there) and I would bet their 3 point shooting numbers went down recently in part because Covington wasn't playing. However it also didn't seem like they were getting them up like they were earlier in the season under Thibs (even before Covington arrived). It did start to feel more like previous Wolves seasons while earlier it seemed like we were headed in at least a more positive direction especially since we were playing with more pace. I think one thing that will help Ryan is that Thibs did let loose (relatively speaking lol) this year and actually had them playing uptempo and changed some of his defensive principals. We were at least moving in the more modern direction already and now Ryan can run with it even more...pun intended! :)