Minnesota Sports Forum

Very disappointing loss tonight in front of a smaller but more lively crowd than Tuesday night's game. If the Wolves are going to make the playoffs this season they're going to have to win their home games against teams like the Nuggets. The Wolves didn't get it done tonight and there's plenty of blame to go around.

The pattern from the first two games returned tonight with the Wolves building a 15 point lead in the 1st quarter and holding onto a decent lead by halftime only to fall apart again in the 3rd. This has to stop!

I can say this without any reservation. The Wolves win this game if Ricky is playing. Dunn's horrible shooting, 1-6, shows up clearly in the box score. But what doesn't show clearly in the box score or perhaps even on TV was his horrendous decision-making. You might have noticed his horrible decisions on at least two breaks. But I suspect you couldn't see on TV how often he missed open players in the half court offense or waited way too long to feed players in the post. It was night and day between Dunn's inability to feed his teammates in the best position at the right time and Ricky's ability to do that better than perhaps anyone in the League. With Ricky starting rather than Dunn, the Wolves would have likely won by 5 points in spite of a terrible shooting night from Zach and Gorgui's pathetic overall play.

Beyond Ricky's absence and Dunn's poor play there was one player in particular who really dragged us down tonight -- namely Gorgui Dieng. His peformance tonight was totally unaccceptable even at his current salary. It wasn't just his poor shooting, caused in part by him hesitating on open mid-range shots and then making a bad pass or settling for an inferior shot. It was more so the way he allowed Nurkic to get under his skin, leading to a number of reckless/mindless plays by Gorgui and culminating in his ridiculous flagrant foul.

It was great to see KAT play more like his former self tonight. His dad was at the game sitting pretty close to me. His dad's very vocal. When KAT's on the line, his dad shouts "money" every time he takes a free throw. And his dad gets pissed when his son or anyone else on the team screws up on the defensive end. KAT missed a couple of free throws and missed some shots he typically made last season. But I can't find fault with him. He played hard and led us with 30+ points, 14 boards and 2 blocks. He didn't have any help inside from Gorgui.

Other than KAT, the best player for the Wolves tonight was Belly. He almost single-handidly got the Wolves back in the game in the 4th. He showed more mental toughness tonight than anyone else on this roster so far this season. I think it was fatigue that caused his 3-pointers late in the 4th to come up short. But I have nothing but praise for the way Belly played tonight.

Wiggins was Wiggins. He scored 20+ points and did so efficiently. And it was nice to see him hit all 5 of his free throws. But he had only 3 rebounds and 1 assist with zero steals. Then there was his huge choke late in the game when he put up an air ball in the paint. And he also had a few huge defensive lapses, including the time he completely lost Gallinari in the 1st and then didn't even bother to close out on him. Thibs called a time out after than and really let into Wiggins -- rightly so. I continue to get frustrated with Wiggins losing concentration and his all too frequent lack of intensity.

Zach shot terribly but he did what you want a player to do on a poor shooting night. He played well defensively, picking up where he left off Tuesday night. He also contributed 5 boards, 3 assists, 1 steal and zero turnovers.

I have to give Tyus some credit tonight. Like Dunn, he missed opportunities to get the ball to teammates when they were well positioned for a great shot, especially when KAT would initially get great low post one-on-one position. But otherwise, Tyus's decision-making was overall much better than Dunn's. And I love Tyus's toughness. He gets everything he has out of himself. He's limited and as a tandem with Dunn at this point in Dunn's career, it's not a good situation for the Wolves. But I loved his effort tonight.

Aldrich hustles, but these last two games have underscored how frustratingly slow he is. I wanted us to sign him and was really happen when we did, but I'm starting to have some buyer's remorse and a better understanding of why the Clippers didn't scrap to keep him.

Rush looked like he was sleep-walking tonight. Watching him tonight I wondered if he was toking up late last night with Jordan Hill. No excuse for Rush's lethargic performance tonight.

I liked Bazz's hustle and I don't understand why Thibs didn't give him more than 13 minutes. It sure looks like Bazz has substantially improved his defense. He had a great steal tonight and really got after it on the defensive end. And while he always seemed to give defensive effort last season, he seems a lot smarter on that end of the court this season.

I'm disappointed, but still not alarmed. This is a work in progress and we have to give Thibs time to get these guys playing the way he wants them to play consistently game to game and quarter to quarter. I am a bit worried about Thibs distracting and stifling his young players with his constant barking and micro-managing from the bench. We'll see how that goes over the next couple months. Thibs may need to tone it down and let up on the reins a bit to get the most out of such a talented group of youngsters who need whose best assets are their athleticism and instincts.

That's it for now. I'll be out of town and miss the next couple home games. I'll be checking in on-line to see Cool's 2/1 for those games. Maybe someone else can also file reports from Target Center.

Excellent report, Lip. I didn't pick up on the missed opportunities by our PGs, so thanks for providing that insight. I'm guessing that Thibs noticed something he didn't like in Dunn though, because he didn't play at all in the 4th quarter...even though Tyus wasn't exactly lighting it up (just 1 assist).

I know I'm close to beating a dead horse with my next comment, but the team needs to figure out what's happening in the locker room to create the Jekyll and Hyde performance we're continuing to see in the third quarter. For the 4th time this year, the team came out free and easy and built a double digit lead. But then for the third time in 4 games, they came out tight in the third quarter and played nothing like the team we enjoyed in the first half...and the result was another 33-14 disaster. It seems like they are thinking too much, rather than just being instinctive and letting their natural talent shine through.

Why is this happening? Well, we don't know, but I have a theory. Thibs is known as a master technician with an intense knowledge of the x's and o's. But I wonder if he is filling this young team's heads with too many things at halftime, which leads to the stagnant play we are seeing in the third quarter. Lip, I note your comment that perhaps Lip needs to let up on the reins a bit and allow our guys' natural abilities to shine through (like it seems to in the first quarter every game). I think that is right on. Again, we don't know, but I sense that our 3rd quarter debacles may be due to overcoaching.

Your point about Rubio is right on...we win this game if he's playing. And this is nothing against Dunn and Jones...I think Dunn is potentially a stud, and Tyus does some things well too. But they just can't run an offense like Ricky does. We need Ricky to come back, and Kris (or Tyus) to move to a more comfortable role backing him up.

I'm at the Laker game, so I'll do the game report...any volunteers for the Clippers game?

OK this is more like it--a game report after losing to a bad team at home. Smh.

I agree that Belly showed a lot of heart and helped us get back into it, but he also made plays down the stretch that helped us lose it: couldn't grab an easy rebound, refused to shoot a wide open 3, and a bad turnover in the open court to name a few. Both him and Tyus helped us climb back in, but they were also gassed by the last part of the 4th. This is hindsight but I would have came back with Dunn with about 3 minutes left, especially for D, and also given Belly a brief blow around the 4 to 6 minute mark--probably brought in Aldrich as Dieng was out to lunch.

We have had some dumb 3rd quarters already but this was the dumbest. We took a few punches and all of a sudden our whole offense shut down. Everyone playing one on one and terrible shot selection--also Lavine wasn't even touching the ball. This would be easy to blame on the rookie Dunn, but he actually played a strong first half and our offense looked pretty good. So to all of sudden start playing like this just because the other team is on a run is baffling--how can we switch styles so abruptly? Yeah we're young blah blah blah but so are they! We just looked beat psychologically out there. Dunn was one of the culprits but no one else was moving the ball either.

It's hard to judge this team right now. On one hand they have only played 3 legitimate NBA teams and they lost to all 3. On the other hand they have led all four games by 15 or more points and looked dominant and ready to blow out all 4 teams (one they actually did). I'd like to hope at some point this season we will look more like the dominant team regularly, but right now it's hard to see that happening any time soon.

I can't help but think that the quick starts might be contributing to the slow 3rd quarters. The starters are absolutely jacked when the game starts and are going on to play most of the first half. Is going full blast for so long and sitting during half time draining them too much?

I don't know if we win this game or not with Rubio, as we witnessed similar meltdowns in Games 1 & 2 when he was playing. Teams ramp up the defensive intensity in 3rd quarters, which impacts our offense, and then in turn we don't match their intensity on defense and they score 30+ points.

I still come back to the inattention to details on the defensive end and how that leads to open shots or easy buckets. Denver shot 48% from the field in this game. That's just unacceptable for a team that has shot barely over 40% on the season. Our defense has got to get better so that we can weather stretches where our offense stagnates. Shooting can come and go - it's hard to consistently put up 25+ points every quarter. But defensive focus and intensity is totally within the control of the players.

Here is a funny stat. Those of you who listened to Thibs' multiple interviews before the season heard him say time and again that we had to be top 10 in offensive and defensive efficiency. Well, guess what? We are! These are the weird things that happen when your 3 losses are all very close and your one win is a total blowout.

I'm pretty sure that if you eliminate that one win, our offense would still be in the upper half of the league and our defense would be near the bottom.

longstrangetrip wrote:Excellent report, Lip. I didn't pick up on the missed opportunities by our PGs, so thanks for providing that insight. I'm guessing that Thibs noticed something he didn't like in Dunn though, because he didn't play at all in the 4th quarter...even though Tyus wasn't exactly lighting it up (just 1 assist).

I know I'm close to beating a dead horse with my next comment, but the team needs to figure out what's happening in the locker room to create the Jekyll and Hyde performance we're continuing to see in the third quarter. For the 4th time this year, the team came out free and easy and built a double digit lead. But then for the third time in 4 games, they came out tight in the third quarter and played nothing like the team we enjoyed in the first half...and the result was another 33-14 disaster. It seems like they are thinking too much, rather than just being instinctive and letting their natural talent shine through.

Why is this happening? Well, we don't know, but I have a theory. Thibs is known as a master technician with an intense knowledge of the x's and o's. But I wonder if he is filling this young team's heads with too many things at halftime, which leads to the stagnant play we are seeing in the third quarter. Lip, I note your comment that perhaps Lip needs to let up on the reins a bit and allow our guys' natural abilities to shine through (like it seems to in the first quarter every game). I think that is right on. Again, we don't know, but I sense that our 3rd quarter debacles may be due to overcoaching.

Your point about Rubio is right on...we win this game if he's playing. And this is nothing against Dunn and Jones...I think Dunn is potentially a stud, and Tyus does some things well too. But they just can't run an offense like Ricky does. We need Ricky to come back, and Kris (or Tyus) to move to a more comfortable role backing him up.

I'm at the Laker game, so I'll do the game report...any volunteers for the Clippers game?

So the theory basically is we are losing because of coaching? Sorry I just don't buy it. This team is losing the way young teams lose. They don't trust playing together as a team on both sides of the ball.

In addition people are so amped up about this team they forget the opponents. Denver is a team with the talent to be fighting for a playoff spot too.

I guess I am taking a longer view I'm just not in the playoffs or bust group. I want to see it happen but I still think I can feel good about this team's future even if we don't make it.

monsterpile wrote:

longstrangetrip wrote:Excellent report, Lip. I didn't pick up on the missed opportunities by our PGs, so thanks for providing that insight. I'm guessing that Thibs noticed something he didn't like in Dunn though, because he didn't play at all in the 4th quarter...even though Tyus wasn't exactly lighting it up (just 1 assist).

I know I'm close to beating a dead horse with my next comment, but the team needs to figure out what's happening in the locker room to create the Jekyll and Hyde performance we're continuing to see in the third quarter. For the 4th time this year, the team came out free and easy and built a double digit lead. But then for the third time in 4 games, they came out tight in the third quarter and played nothing like the team we enjoyed in the first half...and the result was another 33-14 disaster. It seems like they are thinking too much, rather than just being instinctive and letting their natural talent shine through.

Why is this happening? Well, we don't know, but I have a theory. Thibs is known as a master technician with an intense knowledge of the x's and o's. But I wonder if he is filling this young team's heads with too many things at halftime, which leads to the stagnant play we are seeing in the third quarter. Lip, I note your comment that perhaps Lip needs to let up on the reins a bit and allow our guys' natural abilities to shine through (like it seems to in the first quarter every game). I think that is right on. Again, we don't know, but I sense that our 3rd quarter debacles may be due to overcoaching.

Your point about Rubio is right on...we win this game if he's playing. And this is nothing against Dunn and Jones...I think Dunn is potentially a stud, and Tyus does some things well too. But they just can't run an offense like Ricky does. We need Ricky to come back, and Kris (or Tyus) to move to a more comfortable role backing him up.

I'm at the Laker game, so I'll do the game report...any volunteers for the Clippers game?

So the theory basically is we are losing because of coaching? Sorry I just don't buy it. This team is losing the way young teams lose. They don't trust playing together as a team on both sides of the ball.

In addition people are so amped up about this team they forget the opponents. Denver is a team with the talent to be fighting for a playoff spot too.

I guess I am taking a longer view I'm just not in the playoffs or bust group. I want to see it happen but I still think I can feel good about this team's future even if we don't make it.

I'd buy your premise, monster, if they really were losing the way I think young teams typically lose...by not executing at crunch time. But that isn't really their pattern. They have lost three games in exactly the same fashion...building a huge lead because they are better than their opponents and come out playing loose, and then succumbing to bizarre epic collapses in the third quarter. I could ignore it when it happened in the opener, it raised my eyebrows when it happened again in game 2, but it really got my attention when it happened a third time...in jst 4 games! Something is happening during the break that causes them to totally abandon the style that built them a big lead, and they need to figure out what it is and fix it. If it was entirely due to them just being young and not trusting each other, then why didn't we see so many of these third quarter collapses last season when we were even younger? No, something is different this year. Maybe Jordan Hill has something to do with it :) .

I assist coaching teenagers in a sport (not basketball). I sit next to the head coach during games and fill his head with my observations about things the kids need to be doing differently, but he will only impart 1 or 2 things to them during breaks. When I asked him why he only mentioned A and B, but left out C, D and E, he says "they're kids...if I fill their heads up with too many things, it's going to stifle their natural ability". He's right...my tendency would be to over coach, and I'm just wondering if that is Thibs' style too, because this club certainly looks like an over coached team in the third quarters. I don't think it's youth. I think it's more what Lip suggests in the OP...Thibs needs to loosen the reins a little and let these talented kids play, and they'll be fine.

I like what Q has to say in this thread. Wig doesn't suck. Belly wasn't great. Ricky might not have saved the day. It's attention to detail on defense and playing 48 minutes. I'll also add that our 2nd unit is losing PT because they simply aren't giving us enough.

Saw only bits and pieces of the game. But I did see the 3rd quarter. Lucky me!

Besides the general disarray we've seen previously, one thing was glaring to me. Where was Zach Lavine? He all but disappeared from the offense during that run. As the team's best shooter, it would be good to see him take a shot.

Or even get the ball. This offense has maddening long stretches with minimal ball movement.