Minnesota Sports Forum

There's another thread asking whether there's another young core we'd prefer over our core three of KAT, Wiggins and LaVine. I thought I'd revisit the topic with a brief note on how impressive our young core have been so far this season.

We are the only NBA team with 3 players among the top 30 scorers in the League. KAT and Wiggins are in the 20-25 range while Zach is 29th. All three are averaging more than 20 PPG. Importantly, the only young players above them in the scoring list are both older and have more NBA experience. KAT, Zach and Wiggins are all 21 years old with 1 or 2 years of NBA experience. None of the players currently ranked above them in scoring are as young as or have as little NBA experience. Young players above them in the scoring column include McCollum (25 years old, 3 yrs exp.), Beal (23 yrs old, 4 yrs exp), Kemba Walker (26 yrs old, 5 yrs exp), Leonard (25 yrs old, 5 yrs exp), Lillard (26 yrs old, 4 yrs exp), Cousins (26 yrs old, 6 yrs exp), Anthony Davis (23 yrs old, 4 yrs exp), Giannis (22 yrs old, 3 yrs exp.). I'd take Anthony Davis over any of our core three and I'd take Giannis over Andrew Wiggins and maybe over LaVine. But note that both Giannis and Davis are older and more experienced than any of our core three.

KAT, in particular, stacks up impressively against the other young players in the League, all of whom are older and more experienced that he. KAT is 24th in scoring and 8th in rebounding. Only one player in the League above him in scoring is also above him in rebounding - Anthony Davis. I'm not just talking about young players, I'm talking about all NBA players. Only one player is above KAT in both scoring and rebounding. And KAT is 21 years old in only his second season.

Why am I bothering with this? I'm doing it as a reminder to myself (and anyone else who might be interested) that our disappointment with the team's performance so far this season and with individual players has to be tempered by an understanding of just how young our key players are relative to the rest of the best players in the League. It's a reminder to me, as I get frustrated with Wiggins in particular, that he's the League's 23rd leading scorer at age 21 with only 2 full NBA seasons and 1 college season under his belt. And he's probably never been challenged by a coach the likes of Thibs before. Can he keep his motor running hot more than he does and start rebounding consist with his length and athleticism? Those are questions yet to be answered. But as a 21 year old in his 3rd season scoring 22 points per game, I'm not going to allow myself to get unduly frustrated by his failures or setbacks this season. We've seen recent improvement from him and others lately and I'm excited about what we will eventually see from these three next season and thereafter.

I'm still not taking anyone over Towns, and that includes Davis. They're similar players with a few key differences. The biggest differences as I see it are Davis' athleticism and Towns' post game. For me, I still like KAT's overall game better going forward.

Camden wrote:I'm still not taking anyone over Towns, and that includes Davis. They're similar players with a few key differences. The biggest differences as I see it are Davis' athleticism and Towns' post game. For me, I still like KAT's overall game better going forward.

Some consideration for durability could be added to the analysis. Davis has yet to play 70 games in a season. Of course, it's a pretty small sample size for KAT...

There is no question we still have a lot of promise and talent.

My biggest concern continues to be whether Wiggins and LaVine are too redundant. Both are gifted scorers, with one being more of a pure shooter and the other being more of an all-around scoring threat. The problem is what else do they do well? When their shots aren't falling, what can they rely on to help the team win? Right now neither are good rebounders or play makers and their defense is incredibly inconsistent.

I by no means suggest we need to do anything rash, but it's the thing that keeps lingering when I think about this team over the next 6-18 months. I don't think having two wings that are great scorers, but can't do much else helps us more than one great scorer and a 3&D "do shit" type player, especially since we know KAT can be elite offensively too.

I think if they are going to be our core three everyone else we sign or put around them have to be amazing one on one and team defenders. I don't the Ricky and G are that although both have merits on the defensive side of the ball.

We just saw Wiggins dribble the ball of his own foot the end of the 3rd. But I can't get on Andrew for that. He is what he is at this point in his career- a terrible ball handler by NBA wing standards. The issue I have is with Thibs and his stubborn insistence on using Wiggins as a primary ball handler.

This game is why I love Gorgui. All-out effort all the time, a great nose for the ball and a nice offensive skill set.

60WinTim wrote:

Camden wrote:I'm still not taking anyone over Towns, and that includes Davis. They're similar players with a few key differences. The biggest differences as I see it are Davis' athleticism and Towns' post game. For me, I still like KAT's overall game better going forward.

Some consideration for durability could be added to the analysis. Davis has yet to play 70 games in a season. Of course, it's a pretty small sample size for KAT...

You both make great points.

lipoli390 wrote:We just saw Wiggins dribble the ball of his own foot the end of the 3rd. But I can't get on Andrew for that. He is what he is at this point in his career- a terrible ball handler by NBA wing standards. The issue I have is with Thibs and his stubborn insistence on using Wiggins as a primary ball handler.

I can't believe you went there today. Well, actually I can. You do it after every game. But you picked out the one bad play he had while handling the ball and had to make an issue of it. I wish all of our players could be so perfect that one mistake is worth mentioning.

Goodness gracious this is tired.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

lipoli390 wrote:We just saw Wiggins dribble the ball of his own foot the end of the 3rd. But I can't get on Andrew for that. He is what he is at this point in his career- a terrible ball handler by NBA wing standards. The issue I have is with Thibs and his stubborn insistence on using Wiggins as a primary ball handler.

I can't believe you went there today. Well, actually I can. You do it after every game. But you picked out the one bad play he had while handling the ball and had to make an issue of it. I wish all of our players could be so perfect that one mistake is worth mentioning.

Goodness gracious this is tired.

Yeah I'll take 4 assists to 2 turnovers any day with Andrew running 20% of the plays. The real question is why did Thibs take the ball out of Wiggins hands in the 4th? No FGA in the 4th for our best 4th quarter scorer. That was strange to me. Force feeding Wiggins was what got it close in the 3rd.

Wiggins will always be divisive here. Just like Rubio. I think it's like falling in or out of love. At first glance many of us loved Rubio and still want those feelings to be true (ie he plays with passion, he is creative, high BBIQ). Those first feelings are powerful, they echo what has been said about Wiggins from the beginning, Wiggins is lazy, has no vision, no handle. As I see it at least Wiggins is improving. If Rubio had half of Wiggins' off season work ethic he may have developed a jumper by now. Rubio keeps getting worse yet elects to ride the pine for Spain every summer rather than really developing strength or a jumper. This season has been strange by all accounts. Things go wrong and we slip into the same narratives.

Here's how I see the season:

Wiggins only slightly improved - This is frustrating based on his core skills
KAT regressed statistically so far - this is frustrating -
Lavine made huge strides offensively but still is an awful defender - this may be the only positive thing so far this year
G is a great glue guy but is not a starter (as I see it) and is definitely not a starting center
Ricky has regressed - This is Ricky's fault not Thibs sorry I can't see it any other way
Our bench needs help

We can't expect to be much better if the improvements of our core three is only slight. One great signing could change this team around. I think that could be our bench but I hope it is in G's spot as a starter. G could play either big in the second unit.