Minnesota Sports Forum

I just spoke with my friend who's close to an associate of Jerry Riensdorf. He said the Butler deal was primarily about money. Jerry didn't want to be in a position where they had to offer Butler a super max contract, so he wanted the organization to move Butler sooner rather than later. Apparently, getting the 16th pick from Chicago was an easy get because Chicago didn't want to take on another rookie contract. According to this source, the Bulls actually offered the 16th pick without prompting and they were pretty sure Thibs would do the deal even without getting the #16 pick in return. I find that hard to believe, but that's what he said.

Riensdorf is really pissed that Wade picked up the option on his contract. The Bulls were hoping that trading Butler would persuade Wade NOT to pick up his option -- another motivating factor is dealing Butler now rather than waiting for a potentially better deal.

Apparently, Boston had absolutely no interest in Butler and there were no other serious suitors for Jimmy. So the Wolves were the only serious game in town other than Cleveland and Cleveland couldn't offer the types of assets the Bulls wanted. So the Bulls feel thankful they got as much as they did from the Wolves.

As for the money issue, some of it is Jerry Riensdorf simply being a cheap SOB. But beyond that, the Bulls want maximum cap space next summer to take a run at Westbrook in the event he opts out of his contract with the Thunder.

I trust this source. This is the guy who said with absolute certainty months ago that Butler would definitely become a Timberwolf.

Why wouldn't he want a rookie contract? That doesn't jive with the rest of the money saving measures. Sure, if they don't sign anyone else during free agency they save money, but obviously they're signing someone. That player(s) are going to be much more expensive than 16.

is this the same source that told you the Bulls were confident they were going to extract quite a bit from Thibs? I started typing this to make light fun of your source but then I remembered how stupid Garpax really is, maybe they really are in love with Dunn

Thanks for the info Lip. If that was how things went down they came out pretty good.

I just met with the guy that manages my retirement through my job today and I was wearing a Wolves hat. He said "So you are a Wolves fan?" And then he basically slumped into his chair because he was a Bulls fan disappointed in losing him. We chatted about the deal a bit and I talked up Lavine a bunch to cheer him up.

I don't get these teams that don't want to add young players to their roster when they aren't going anywhere. It's hard to believe that they couldn't find someone in the 2nd round that was more valuable than that 3+ million but oh well.

They are going to make a run at Westbrook? How is Chicago going to be more appealing than OKC? I'm sorry but that seems a bit like a joke. So like what are they going to do with all those guards? I just looked and Grant's number actually ended up being pretty decent. He was pretty brutal in the playoffs though.

My thoughts about Zach LaVine are different than almost every other poster here, so I'm not surprised that your source is convinced Thibs would have done this deal even without getting back #16. I still think in Thibs' mind this deal was about two things...bringing in Jimmy Butler, and getting rid of Zach LaVine, and #16 was irrelevant. I think we overvalue Zach here more than any T-Wolf I can remember...our perception of his ability is far from how he is perceived nationally (and by Bulls fans), far from what the analytics say about him, and far from how I believe Thibs perceives him. Thibs has the reputation of being a great defensive coach, but I think he is a great defensive coach...when he has players like Butler, Noah and Deng on the court. Thibs had to notice how much better our defense became when Rush replaced Zach in the starting lineup...the prevailing narrative here was that the players were finally starting to "get" Thibs' system, but I think it had much more to do with Rush vs. Zach.

Zach was one of my favorite players on the losing teams of the past three years because of his work ethic, quirky personality, athleticism and ability to get hot from the outside, but I also never trusted his basketball IQ and worried that he would never be a key part of a championship team. I hope I'm wrong and Zach has a great career in Chicago because he seems like a really good guy, but I think he is what he is and that the analytics will never be his friend. But that's not our concern anymore. We have Jimmy Butler, and Thibs is now a very good defensive coach again...because you win with players. I'm looking forward to a season where we at least get to the second round of the playoffs.

Thanks Lip. Always genuinely appreciate any insights you have. I know you're somewhat sceptical on the trade, but it's growing on you. But I sense in some of the details that you see the negative context. If the Wolves were the only viable trade partner, we could imply that we had more leverage and perhaps could have made a deal without giving up as much as we did. But the alternate perspective is that we only managed to secure the deal we did and gave up as little as we did because we were the only viable suitor.

If this was predominantly about money, then I think that points even further towards the Bulls being a desparate seller and suggests we got great value in the deal.

Well, if they really want maximize cap room next year, getting rid of the 16th pick saves them about 1.5 mil...

I completely agree with this. From a fan's standpoint, Zach was fun to watch and cheer for. He still has a ton of potential and is so young. But I am not sure he is anything more than what he is...an athletic shooter/scorer.

My other biggest fear was that KAT, Wiggs and Zach would have stalled out in a year or two (in terms of wins) and might not mesh with Thibs. Then, we would make an unnecessary trade where we get screwed or we panic and fire Thibs, only to start over again. I think this move proves to KAT and Wiggs that Thibs is serious, this is a business, and defense wins championships. Its a shot in the arm that was very necessary and worth the gamble.

BloopOracle wrote:is this the same source that told you the Bulls were confident they were going to extract quite a bit from Thibs? I started typing this to make light fun of your source but then I remembered how stupid Garpax really is, maybe they really are in love with Dunn

I too have a hard time believing some of this. But then consider the fact that the Bulls, supposedly in full rebuild mode, sold their 38th pick isn't eh draft for frickn cash!!

monsterpile wrote:Thanks for the info Lip. If that was how things went down they came out pretty good.

I just met with the guy that manages my retirement through my job today and I was wearing a Wolves hat. He said "So you are a Wolves fan?" And then he basically slumped into his chair because he was a Bulls fan disappointed in losing him. We chatted about the deal a bit and I talked up Lavine a bunch to cheer him up.

I don't get these teams that don't want to add young players to their roster when they aren't going anywhere. It's hard to believe that they couldn't find someone in the 2nd round that was more valuable than that 3+ million but oh well.

They are going to make a run at Westbrook? How is Chicago going to be more appealing than OKC? I'm sorry but that seems a bit like a joke. So like what are they going to do with all those guards? I just looked and Grant's number actually ended up being pretty decent. He was pretty brutal in the playoffs though.

I can't see Westbrook going to Chicago. But just because the Bulls want to pursue him doesn't mean they're desire is realistic. I still can't great over how idiotic it was for a rebuilding team like the Bulls to sell the 38th pick in a deep draft for cash. Bulls fans have good reason to be upset with their team's front office/ownership.