The Final. Definitive. Scientific Comparison ---Towns/Okafor

[Papalrep]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wN05VafFtYo

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

My guess is that this won't be the last FInal. Definitive. Scientific Comparison. God it's a long time between the lottery and actual draft. At least after the draft, things get rolling soon thereafter with free agency, summer league, potential trades, etc.

The video above shows a few times where Towns has problems holding position in the post. That is my one big question mark with him defensively. He seems to be light in the legs and trunk, which makes it hard to hold position in the paint. We've witnessed Dieng, Payne, and Hamilton get absolutely taken to the woodshed whenever they were taken down low, mostly because they lacked a strong base.

(I'm still a Towns guy though).

[Hicks123 [enjin:6700838]]

I like Towns a lot...mostly, I love his tenacity in going after the ball on the defensive end. But I think we sometimes don't give Okafor enough credit on the offensive end. I think that while Towns may be passable on offense early in career, Okafor is simply on another level. Same can be said in reverse when talking defense. Love both of these guys, and I can honestly say I will be happy with either.

[thedoper]

I am sure we will be getting definitive, apparently scientific of these 2 guys at every point of the rest of their basketball career. They are linked to each other from here on out. The video is good though because of the side by side cutting. Every time I watch film it just makes me want Okafor more and more. He just seems like such a natural basketball player. I see McHale in him more than any of the modern comparisons (Like Al or Brooks Lopez).

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

I am sure we will be getting definitive, apparently scientific of these 2 guys at every point of the rest of their basketball career. They are linked to each other from here on out. The video is good though because of the side by side cutting. Every time I watch film it just makes me want Okafor more and more. He just seems like such a natural basketball player. I see McHale in him more than any of the modern comparisons (Like Al or Brooks Lopez).

McHale was an All-NBA defender... but funny how Okafor supporters (for No. 1) tend to bury that end of the floor deep in their minds...

[Hicks123 [enjin:6700838]]

Cam, I don't think that is accurate. Most of us fully understand how poor Okafor's defense is. I think my personal issue is that you, and some others, tend to do the exact opposite and diminish his offense skills and try to put Towns in a "similar" box utilizing efficiency rating and other metrics. I think there is as big a gap in their offense as exists in their defense. Okafor is simply a WAY better offensive player at this point.

[GymRat [enjin:6592663]]

I'm going to preface this diatribe with admitting I do believe I can be happy with either player, and both will improve our team significantly in the long-run, but I am largely in favor of Towns over Okafor due to the following, most of which was shown very well in the video.

While I see Okafor holding up better than Towns in post defense, Okafor's inability to consistently protect against guards in the PnR and basket attacks reminds me of how awful our team already is at defending those things. Okafor is painfully slow, like Roy Hibbert slow. He won't be able to contain the PnR, causing coverage issues all over, and he's a slow jumper. Attackers are going to draw fouls on him often by creating contact before he can even get off the floor or in position. If he lays back in the PnR like he had to at Duke he can't defend against guards with any quickness or shooting ability. Do you want to watch Okafor trying to contain the Hardens, Westbrooks, or Parkers of the world?

I want a big man that can defend the PnR and protect the rim with good anticipation and athleticism. Many people on this board have clamored for a more athletic version of Pek over the last couple years (and a healthy one). This means a guy that is big, strong, quick, rebounds well, has a solid (not great) offensive game and accurate shot, but can also play PnR and block shots. Obviously Towns has a much higher ceiling, but this is the skillset you get from Towns minus the strength, Pek+PnR+BLK-Str. To me that's a huge upgrade.

I'm going to make this comparison. Kevin Love had a really well rounded offensive game. He didn't have the array of post moves Okafor has, but he could step out and bury jumpers and 3's with consistency and hit his FTs. This made him efficient and versatile. He was never, nor will he ever be, anything more than an average defender. Too slow, too ground bound, and a bit lazy. Okafor presents the same problems defensively, is not as efficient or versatile offensively due to his poor shooting away from the rim, and he actually might be slower than Love. We already saw what that type of player brings to a team, and some of you want another one? Let's try something new!

Maybe I'm being too harsh on Okafor. I'm just tired of us bringing in players that are poor defensively in favor of offense because it's glamorous. I want Flip to stick to his two-way mantra. If he doesn't, I'll swallow that pill and get on board the Okafor train and try to enjoy the ride (or Russell!).

[Monster]

Cam, I don't think that is accurate. Most of us fully understand how poor Okafor's defense is. I think my personal issue is that you, and some others, tend to do the exact opposite and diminish his offense skills and try to put Towns in a "similar" box utilizing efficiency rating and other metrics. I think there is as big a gap in their offense as exists in their defense. Okafor is simply a WAY better offensive player at this point.

If you are just talking pure scoring. Okafor is way ahead but imo what narrows the gap at least to a certain extent is Towns has a diverse skillset. He has range on his jumper is a very good FT which helps him flat out score more points and makes him really valuable at the end of games. By my eye test Town is a better passer partly because he just has done ability to be on the perimeter more because of his jump shot. This feels so much like the debate last year about Parker or wiggins although because Wiggins got the opportunity he had shown more on offense by the time the college season was over. It's far from a perfect comp but there are some similarities to the conversation.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

I'm going to preface this diatribe with admitting I do believe I can be happy with either player, and both will improve our team significantly in the long-run, but I am largely in favor of Towns over Okafor due to the following, most of which was shown very well in the video.

While I see Okafor holding up better than Towns in post defense, Okafor's inability to consistently protect against guards in the PnR and basket attacks reminds me of how awful our team already is at defending those things. Okafor is painfully slow, like Roy Hibbert slow. He won't be able to contain the PnR, causing coverage issues all over, and he's a slow jumper. Attackers are going to draw fouls on him often by creating contact before he can even get off the floor or in position. If he lays back in the PnR like he had to at Duke he can't defend against guards with any quickness or shooting ability. Do you want to watch Okafor trying to contain the Hardens, Westbrooks, or Parkers of the world?

I want a big man that can defend the PnR and protect the rim with good anticipation and athleticism. Many people on this board have clamored for a more athletic version of Pek over the last couple years (and a healthy one). This means a guy that is big, strong, quick, rebounds well, has a solid (not great) offensive game and accurate shot, but can also play PnR and block shots. Obviously Towns has a much higher ceiling, but this is the skillset you get from Towns minus the strength, Pek+PnR+BLK-Str. To me that's a huge upgrade.

I'm going to make this comparison. Kevin Love had a really well rounded offensive game. He didn't have the array of post moves Okafor has, but he could step out and bury jumpers and 3's with consistency and hit his FTs. This made him efficient and versatile. He was never, nor will he ever be, anything more than an average defender. Too slow, too ground bound, and a bit lazy. Okafor presents the same problems defensively, is not as efficient or versatile offensively due to his poor shooting away from the rim, and he actually might be slower than Love. We already saw what that type of player brings to a team, and some of you want another one? Let's try something new!

Maybe I'm being too harsh on Okafor. I'm just tired of us bringing in players that are poor defensively in favor of offense because it's glamorous. I want Flip to stick to his two-way mantra. If he doesn't, I'll swallow that pill and get on board the Okafor train and try to enjoy the ride (or Russell!).

Wiggins seems to be the one young guy Flip has brought in that truly lives up to the two-way mantra he espouses, and even he had some struggles last year defensively. But otherwise the rest of his moves involving young guys don't seem to back up his talk: Dieng, Shabazz, LaVine, and Payne are all defensive liabilities right now. A part of that is youth/lack of experience, a part of that is poor coaching, and a part of that is inherent to the players themselves. Either way, Flip owns the problem.

[khans2k5 [enjin:6608728]]

If Towns couldn't stay in front of Kaminsky why do people think he's going to be a really good PnR defender staying in front of guards? Just curious because people talk up his athleticism, but I don't see it as the elite level guys like AD have and use to be PnR defensive terrors. I don't think Towns is particularly quick which is what good PnR defensive bigs use to shut down the PnR. I think he'll be fine, but I don't think he's a premier defensive PnR defender. Also guys like Marc Gasol, Hibbert, Bogut, etc. are all big and not particularly quick yet they anchor some of the best defenses in the league. They learned how to wall up without fouling and are elite rim protectors because of it. You don't need to be a great athlete to protect the rim. Hell even Duncan can barely move yet he is still one of the best rim protectors in the game. You just need the size which Okafor has and a lesson in how to challenge shots without fouling. I don't see Okafor being a terrible athlete so I don't see why it's unreasonable to think he can be an acceptable defender given time to learn. I don't buy into the argument that he's reached his defensive potential as a 19 year old when most guys have to learn to play defense in the NBA as it is a different beast than any other level. I think Towns' defense is being a little bit oversold as a savior level while Okafor is being given little room to improve.