Minnesota Sports Forum

We've dissected the Wiggins possibility, but with the news that the Bulls are interested, I'd be curious to see people do a straight up comparison of these two potential trading partners for Love.

We don't know exactly what either offer would look like in the end, but a guess would be:

Wiggins, Bennett, Future First

Gibson, Butler, Mirotic (I'm going with Butler here because I've heard this somewhere and I think if the Wolves pushed they could get him instead of McD, if that's not the case, it makes the Bulls offer less attractive to me)

Without going deeply into this yet, I think I might lean toward the Bulls offer. I'll break it down roughly by parts.

Wiggins vs. Butler
Wiggins will likely be better than Butler, but we don't really KNOW that yet, and I think Butler is one of those underrated players who is already very good defensively, and poised to make a big step offensively. His shooting fluctuations worry me, he had a good shooting year 2 years ago and a bad one this past year. Wiggins had a pretty good shooting year last year (didn't blow anybody away), but that's one year of college. Remember Derrick Williams shot something like 55% from 3 in college. And for all the talk of Wiggins being an excellent defensive player (I think he will definitely be very good), we already KNOW Butler is. I think Butler could fairly reasonably become a poor man's Kawhi Leonard or Paul George. Not as good as those guys, but still a good wing. And Butler's ready to contribute right now. For a team with Pek, Rubio a few years in, etc., I think Butler would be a good fit if we want to get better now as opposed to down the road.

Bennett vs. Gibson
This is Gibson all the way. Bennett was a huge disappointment last year and has bust written all over him. He looks like another tweener with skills that helped him produce at his size in college, but he just can't get it done at this level of competition. Now he could turn it around, but it's more likely he ends up being a guy like Diogu, Aminu, or Derrick Williams. Gibson on the other hand, is a great defender and a pretty good offensive player. He doesn't need a ton of touches to score (lots of put back dunks) and he's got a very good midrange shot (although he obviously can't stretch the floor like Love). And his contract is remarkably friendly for his production. Plus he's ready to contribute right now, which again, I think fits where we'd be with Pek and Rubio on the squad.

Future First vs. Mirotic
This is a tossup, and less important than the other four players, but if the future first belongs to the Cavs with LeBron and Love and Irving, it will not be a very good pick at all. Whereas Mirotic could become a great stretch four, great fit with Rubio.

I'm still taking the chance on Wiggins, above all, being a great player but if we did do a Bulls deal, I wouldn't just put McD to the side, Butler or no Butler.

If there's no McDermott in the Bulls offer, then this isn't even close.

I agree with Cam. McDermott AND Mirotic need to be in the package along with Butler and Gibson. The only one I might do without as part of the Bulls package would be Gibson. And while I like Butler, he doesn't look like a shooter to me. He's had one good year shooting, but watching him makes me suspect it was an aberration. He looks like an undersized Gerald Wallace -- a high energy defensive specialist with a marginal shot. While I like McDermott and Mirotic, they have less upside than Wiggins and, if they succeed, they will both be largely one-way relatively unathletic players.

I'll take the Cleveland deal. But I'll note that I believe the Cleveland deal will include two future first round picks and that one of them will be Miami's 2015 pick, which is only top 10 protected. I would expect that pick to end up in the 12 -16 range. And I still think the player package from Cleveland will be better than simply Wiggins and Bennett. Instead, I see it ending up as one of the following:

1. Wiggins, Bennett and Waiters
2. Wiggins, Bennett and Thompson
3. Wiggins, Waiters and Thompson
4. Wiggins, Bennett and Thaddeus Young in a 3-team deal

Wiggins and cavs all the way.

Ive said it many times. I really dont care who else we get from the cavs, wiggins is the only player that I want in return and any other pieces would be bonus for me.

I think its time we go for a home run. Yeah, its nice to have solid pieces on your team but for a team and market like us. The only way we are going to get a superstar is tru draft. We drafted 2 in kg and love but failed to build a contender with them for various reasons but most of all because of wasting draft picks. ( we lost 3 1st for joe smith fiasco, then we have ebi, mccants, flynn, wes, dw, corey over noah and foye over roy and gay). We drafted a keeper in rubio. Drafted well with pek, dieng and lavine looks promising. Now we get the chance to add the number 1 pick with wiggins, we go for it.

Wiggins has the most potential of all players involved in love trade talks. Yes, there will be concerns and doubts whether he reach that potential. But for me, I see wiggins floor being rudy gay and his ceiling being paul george/scottie pippen mix. Will he reach that ceiling? Thats on him, flip and the coaching staff. Il take wiggins 100%.

world, I agree with 99% of your post above. The 1% that I don't is just this...

Rudy Gay as a floor for Andrew Wiggins is head-scratching. Two VERY different players. At the very least, Wiggins should still be a top tier defender in the NBA. Gay's never been anything above average on that end, plus he's a decent ball handler with the ability to get all the way to the rim, whereas Wiggins is a straight line driver only. Could change if his handle improves a lot, but I'm very skeptical. Could you elaborate on why Gay is his floor, in your opinion?

Camden wrote:world, I agree with 99% of your post above. The 1% that I don't is just this...

Rudy Gay as a floor for Andrew Wiggins is head-scratching. Two VERY different players. At the very least, Wiggins should still be a top tier defender in the NBA. Gay's never been anything above average on that end, plus he's a decent ball handler with the ability to get all the way to the rim, whereas Wiggins is a straight line driver only. Could change if his handle improves a lot, but I'm very skeptical. Could you elaborate on why Gay is his floor, in your opinion?

Physically, athletically and demeanor wise, they are quite similar. They have the same concerns about them when they enter the league(motor). Also gay is not a bad defender although wiggins projects to be much better than him. Also gay improved his ball handling and passing throuout his career. He wasnt as good as he is now in those areas when he first enter the league.

Also, seeing wiggins with his stepback jumper that seems to be his go to move in the summer league kind of remind me a bit of gay. While not quite similar moves but gay does have the midrange jumper that he goes to frequently. Both rebound the ball well for their position. I just see some similarities in their games.

World -- I think you nailed it. The Cleveland deal is a home run swing and that's what this franchise needs to do. We can't just try to make contact with the ball and expect to get anywhere beyond mediocrity. We have to swing hard That's why I loved the LaVine pick. And that's why I'm hoping for the Cleveland deal. For all we know, Flip may like the Bulls deal better. He may think that he hit the long ball with LaVine and that now he needs to dial down a bit and get something less ambitious but maybe more certain like the Bulls package. We'll see.

By the way, don't believe reports that the Warriors have made a final decision on whether to offer Klay Thompson. Also, I am certain that the Celtics are still trying to come up with a package. Flip isn't going to pull the trigger on anything until he knows he has the best possible deal.

Another thing about Flip. He doesn't blow smoke. That's part of why I think he's been so effective in these negotiations. Others front office executives around the League know Flip is a straight shooter. So when he tells them an offer isn't enough or tells them he's prepared to keep Love, they know he's serious. They've tested him, but his firm resolve has confirmed what they already pretty much knew about him. Flip is honest and firm -- no pretense, no smoke screens, no BS.

The contrast between Flip and his predecessor is striking. Keep doing what you're doing, Flip!!

I do enjoy seeing Lip happy with some of the moves and patience of Flip this off-season. Almost a complete 180.

Camden wrote:I do enjoy seeing Lip happy with some of the moves and patience of Flip this off-season. Almost a complete 180.

Not quite a 180, but close. I praised his Dieng pick last year and wasn't quite as down on the Shabazz pick as a few others. But I didn't care for his free agent signings last year and I was definitely down on Taylor's choice of Flip as our President of Basketball Operations. I criticized Flip pretty harshly at times, and although I've acknowledged Flip's coaching credentials from the beginning, I was disappointed that Flip named himself head coach rather than hiring some fresh blood.

So what's happened? Flip has really won me over through the moves he's made and the way he's conducted himself over the past 6 weeks. I like how he's played things close to the vest and avoided saying things publicly that could hurt his bargaining position or reduce the trade value of any of his players. I like how he really drilled down in his analysis of draft prospects. I loved his two picks this year -- LaVine and GRII picks. I also love the patience and resolve he's shown throughout these negotiations. My view is based on more than what we've all seen publicly. I can't say anything more than the fact that I got a behind the scenes look that really impressed me.

I don't know how the Love situation will end up. But I'll go out on a limb before the final result and say that, regardless of the outcome, Flip has won me over. Yes, I'll still disagree with him from time to time. But I'll always acknowledge that he knows what he's doing and is doing everything he can to make this team better.