Minnesota Sports Forum

I thought we needed a thread for general discussion about what’s happening or rumored around the League with the draft two days away and trade talk heating up. A few storylines around the League:

1. Blazers. The threshold question is whether the Blazers will trade Lillard and start a rebuild or trade their #3 picks (perhaps their #23 pick too) to acquire top vets to pair with Lillard for one last win-now move with their soon to be 34 year old star PG. Most reports indicate that the Blazers want to take one last shot with Lillard. Among the players the Blazers are reported interested in are Bam, Ingram, and Siakam. There were earlier reports of an interest in Ayton, but those rumors have cooled recently. Apparently, Portland hasn’t been talking to the Wolves about KAT. Of course, that doesn’t mean the Blazers aren’t interested in KAT. It seems like the price for Bam will be too high - requiring the Blazers to part with Sharpe and Simons along with the #3 pick. I don’t see Portland meeting that price and I don’t see the Heat having much interest in moving Bam for the #3 pick given Miami’s clear “win-now” situation even if Simons and Sharpe were included. I can’t see the Pelicans moving Ingram for #3. Ingram is their best player and the situation with Zion is too precarious. So I think Portland’s options will ultimately narrow to Siakam, Ayton and maybe Jaylen Brown. At that point, perhaps the Blazers make TC an offer for KAT that knocks TC’s socks off. I still think the Wolves should offer Rudy for #23 and other assets if the Blazers end up swapping #3 for someone like Ingram, Siakam or Jaylen Brown. The Blazers had the #23 defense last season I believe. They could certainly use Rudy and I think they’d be willing to give up quite a bit if to pair him with Lillard and one of the three wings I mentioned.

2. Heat. The Miami Heat is another team looking for win-now vets to pair with Butler, Bam and Herro. It’s being reported that the Heat are aggressively pursuing Lillard. Perhaps the Blazers will finally relent and start their inevitable rebuild. I think that would be the smart move for them. I just don’t see the Blazers forming a championship contender around the aging Lillard by trading the #3 pick. I’m predicting that Lillard ends up with the Heat.

3. Pelicans. While the Blazers would apparently love to get Ingram, the Pelicans are reportedly shopping Zion. The question is whether they’ll get much for him. I doubt they will.

4. Lakers. What will the Lakers do this summer? They did a nice job upgrading their roster at the February deadline this past season. I thought the Lakers front office was impressive. They don’t have a 1st round pick other than #17 or a lot of future picks to give up. We’ll see.

5. Knicks. My sense is that the Knicks are going to make a big move this summer. They looked good last season but it should be clear that they’ve hit their ceiling. They need a top player next to Brunson. There are some reports suggesting that Zion might end up with the Knicks, but I don’t think they’ll take a risk on him. I honestly believe they’d love to have KAT so we’ll see if anything develops in the next couple weeks. I could see a sensible package taking shape around Quickly and some of the Knicks’ bevy of future 1st round picks.

6. Teams with Multiple First Round Picks. The teams to pay particular attention to between now and the end of Thursday’s draft are the ones with multiple first-round picks: Charlotte (## 2, 27), Portland (##3, 23, Houston (##4, 20), Orlando (6, 11), Indiana (7, 26, 29), Utah (9, 16, 28), Brooklyn (21, 22). I would expect most if not all those teams to deal at least one of their picks. Charlotte, Houston, Orlando and Utah have plenty of young players and picks coming up in future years. Indiana seems ready to make a move towards winning and there’s no way they’ll keep all three or even two of their three picks. If Portland keeps Lillard, then I would expect them to deal both their 1st-round picks. I don’t see Brooklyn keep both their 1st-round picks either. It will be interesting to see what happens with these teams on and leading up to draft day.

Lip thanks for listing out the teams with multiple picks. I could see a couple of those teams package those picks to move up. I can’t remember for sure but it seems like then it may even be more likely those picks get moved again. What team wants to pick 21 and 22? Are there any twins in this drafts? Lol

Just like in FA or trades around the league it feels like the more movement there is the more opportunities there are to get something worthwhile that wasn’t really a thing before. Maybe some team is willing to take some future 2nds for a late first rounder because they previously traded a bunch away and it would save them money. It’s handy that the Wolves got some 2nds in that Russell trade. Again I’m not getting my hopes up and I like the idea of aging 2nd round picks most years but I know in previous drafts there are guys I would have given up future 2nd rounders to get.

Looking back at the 2021 draft maybe there is even a tiny bit of reason to have some hope for 53 to be a worthwhile player. Garza went 52 Aaron Wiggins 55 and Jericho Sims 58. Maybe none of those guys ends up being worthwhile players but all have shown some signs of being worthwhile players. I’d be happy to have someone at 53 that showed what those guys have so far in their careers. Heck you could probably trade one of them for multiple 2nd rounders. That’s exactly what Connelly did with Joffrey Lauvergne a few years ago after picking him 55 in the 2014 draft and having too many bigs. The guys he picked with those 2nd rounders he acquired were Monte Morris and Vlatko Čančar. Not too shabby.

Monster wrote: ↑Tue Jun 20, 2023 5:51 pm Lip thanks for listing out the teams with multiple picks. I could see a couple of those teams package those picks to move up. I can’t remember for sure but it seems like then it may even be more likely those picks get moved again. What team wants to pick 21 and 22? Are there any twins in this drafts? Lol

Just like in FA or trades around the league it feels like the more movement there is the more opportunities there are to get something worthwhile that wasn’t really a thing before. Maybe some team is willing to take some future 2nds for a late first rounder because they previously traded a bunch away and it would save them money. It’s handy that the Wolves got some 2nds in that Russell trade. Again I’m not getting my hopes up and I like the idea of aging 2nd round picks most years but I know in previous drafts there are guys I would have given up future 2nd rounders to get.

Looking back at the 2021 draft maybe there is even a tiny bit of reason to have some hope for 53 to be a worthwhile player. Garza went 52 Aaron Wiggins 55 and Jericho Sims 58. Maybe none of those guys ends up being worthwhile players but all have shown some signs of being worthwhile players. I’d be happy to have someone at 53 that showed what those guys have so far in their careers. Heck you could probably trade one of them for multiple 2nd rounders. That’s exactly what Connelly did with Joffrey Lauvergne a few years ago after picking him 55 in the 2014 draft and having too many bigs. The guys he picked with those 2nd rounders he acquired were Monte Morris and Vlatko Čančar. Not too shabby.

Nice analysis, Monster. I totally agree that we’ll probably see some of those teams use their multiple picks to move up followed by more deals by the teams that trade down. And I agree that the more movement the more opportunities potentially for the Wolves. Ultimately, if we’re predicting, I’d predict the Wolves don’t trade into the first round and stay at 53. I could also see the Wolves trading #53 for a future 2nd-round pick and pursuing an undrafted free agent they like rather than using the #53 pick to get him. I’d love to know who TC likes in the draft. I could see him swapping #53 along with a future 2nd and some case to move higher in the second round to get someone he really likes.

“It was out there that Miami decided not to bite on Beal because they were playing for (Portland’s Damian) Lillard,” a league source told Heavy Sports. “It really wasn’t that; it was tax consequences with Beal that really caused them to back off. The new tax is much more onerous. “And I think part of it was that Beal said he wouldn’t give up the no-trade clause in his contract (after the initial deal was complete).”
Source: Steve Bulpett @ Heavy.com

Further confirmation that good organizations, even proven championship contenders in full win-now mode like the Miami Heat built around their 34 year old star (Jimmy Butler), will be sure to avoid the luxury tax (especially the second apron) under the new CBA. As a team that just finished 2 games over .500 and building around the 21 year old Ant and 22 year old Jaden, it’s awfully hard to see how the Wolves will be able to justify keeping both KAT and Rudy beyond next season. But we’ll see.

Lipoli390 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 20, 2023 11:08 pm “It was out there that Miami decided not to bite on Beal because they were playing for (Portland’s Damian) Lillard,” a league source told Heavy Sports. “It really wasn’t that; it was tax consequences with Beal that really caused them to back off. The new tax is much more onerous. “And I think part of it was that Beal said he wouldn’t give up the no-trade clause in his contract (after the initial deal was complete).”
Source: Steve Bulpett @ Heavy.com

Further confirmation that good organizations, even proven championship contenders in full win-now mode like the Miami Heat built around their 34 year old star (Jimmy Butler), will be sure to avoid the luxury tax (especially the second apron) under the new CBA. As a team that just finished 2 games over .500 and building around the 21 year old Ant and 22 year old Jaden, it’s awfully hard to see how the Wolves will be able to justify keeping both KAT and Rudy beyond next season. But we’ll see.

Note that what you quoted the no trade clause was a factor. Imagine paying a guy all that money and potentially isn’t any good but you can’t trade him anywhere unless he says it’s ok. That could be a really big deal. He is the only guy in the league with a no trade clause and it’s a big deal. Look at what the Wizards got for him in a trade and there is still some hope he can be good again. Imagine how bad it would be if he was at best only a decent rotation player and you wanted to move him to save money but you had to get his permission first? Brutal. Of course if there was an organization that could recover from that the Heat would be it. Lol

Monster wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2023 9:29 am

Lipoli390 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 20, 2023 11:08 pm “It was out there that Miami decided not to bite on Beal because they were playing for (Portland’s Damian) Lillard,” a league source told Heavy Sports. “It really wasn’t that; it was tax consequences with Beal that really caused them to back off. The new tax is much more onerous. “And I think part of it was that Beal said he wouldn’t give up the no-trade clause in his contract (after the initial deal was complete).”
Source: Steve Bulpett @ Heavy.com

Further confirmation that good organizations, even proven championship contenders in full win-now mode like the Miami Heat built around their 34 year old star (Jimmy Butler), will be sure to avoid the luxury tax (especially the second apron) under the new CBA. As a team that just finished 2 games over .500 and building around the 21 year old Ant and 22 year old Jaden, it’s awfully hard to see how the Wolves will be able to justify keeping both KAT and Rudy beyond next season. But we’ll see.

Note that what you quoted the no trade clause was a factor. Imagine paying a guy all that money and potentially isn’t any good but you can’t trade him anywhere unless he says it’s ok. That could be a really big deal. He is the only guy in the league with a no trade clause and it’s a big deal. Look at what the Wizards got for him in a trade and there is still some hope he can be good again. Imagine how bad it would be if he was at best only a decent rotation player and you wanted to move him to save money but you had to get his permission first? Brutal. Of course if there was an organization that could recover from that the Heat would be it. Lol

Good point, Monster. The no-trade clause was definitely a big factor and it was a big reason why the Wizards got so little in return from the Suns.

On the draft side of things...

It's been a few years since I bothered researching 2nd round picks. But I've spent some time on it this year, and there are a lot of intriguing prospects that ought to be available at pick #53 (and as undrafted FAs as well). Most of them are older, so don't have as much upside, but possess skills that could be useful off the bench, either this year, or down the road.

With TC being touted for his draft acumen, I am looking forward to seeing who we grab at #53. Will it be someone projected to go earlier who falls? Will it be someone nobody really looked at? Will it be a young guy, ala Minott? Or an older guy that might have a shot at becoming bench fodder?

Could Amari Bailey, a freshman, fall?

I find both Isaiah Wong and Craig Porter Jr. at the guard position intriguing.

And there are certainly some wings and bigs that could be useful.

Anyone have a few favorites they would like to see at #53?

Heavy rumors of

Porzingis to Bos
Marcus Morris and picks to Wash
Brogdon to LAC

kekgeek wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2023 2:39 pm Heavy rumors of

Porzingis to Bos
Marcus Morris and picks to Wash
Brogdon to LAC

Sounds like this is going to happen

The Portzingis to Boston move might put pressure on teams like the Knicks and Hawks to explore trades for KAT, and increase TC’s leverage …

Brogdon to the Clips is not good news