Minnesota Sports Forum

The wolves I believe are 28th in turnover rate. How do we fix it? Is it as simple as Ant growing up or do we desperately need a 2nd pg like Tyus jones on the roster. I kept thinking about this last night after the game and couldn’t come up with an answer.

Here are some quotes on the turnovers from Dane Moore Twitter

Chris Finch: "You’re not beating good teams with 21 turnovers, particularly the way we turned it over."

Naz Reid: "At some point, we have to read the defense and just make the right play... We just gotta do it. The recipe is there, we just gotta do it."

Rudy Gobert: "We got to fight ourselves to just space for one another, and then make the simple, early, right play. When we did it, they couldn’t really guard us, every time we did it. When we didn’t, a lot of time it leads to turnovers."

Karl-Anthony Towns: "Just gotta be simpler with the game. Don’t be cute. Just do what we can to still drive with aggression, but just be a little smarter."

Asked Anthony Edwards, as a leader of the team, how he goes about getting the Wolves to get past their turnover issues:

"I got to look in the mirror. Because it’s me who generates most of the turnovers. You got to look in the mirror. I’m gonna figure out a way to stop turning the bitch over, I promise. I’m definitely looking at film trying to figure out what am I doing? The majority come from me trying to make the right play. It’s not really there. I’ll be better."

Everyone is saying the right things but is it even possible for them to fix it. I don’t know if it’s players to blame or is it scheme or is it Finch. Most likely it’s probably a mix of all 3 but with this turnover rate there not going to do shit in the playoffs.

I actually found ANT's response the most encouraging. Remember, the Wolves have put him on an accelerated development path, so we are experiencing some of those bumps in the road. It won't be an overnight fix, but if he can steadily improve over the remainder of the season, the Wolves could still flourish in the playoffs. As FNG pointed out in the GDT, there were SO many things that did not go the Wolves way -- bad calls, Conley 1-10, turnovers galore, especially at the end -- yet that game was still there for the taking.

It's definitely an issue, jester...as you pointed out, we have the third most turnovers in the league, and one of the teams behind us is Detroit! But still despite this problem, we have led the West most of first half of the season. Would
I like us to protect the ball better? Of course. But is there a team out there that is good at everything? We're the best defensive team in the Association, the third best rebounding team, have the third best 3-point percentage and the 6th best overall shooting percentage...and we rank in the middle of the pack in assists. Boston is an elite rebounding team and protects the ball very well. But they don't rank very high in shooting percentage or assists...and yet they still have the best record in basketball. We would be a better team if we protected the ball better, but that doesn't seem to be our identity...and our identity has led to a very good first half of the season. I like that the team recognizes this is a problem and vows to get better, but I'm skeptical that anything is going to change. Ant and KAT are going to continue to have the ball poked away on their frequently successful drives to the basket, and are both going to be susceptible to turnovers on sloppy passes also...and the last thing Finchie wants is for either of them to be less aggressive offensively. But nobody else on the team averages more than 1.7 turnovers per game, and that's pretty good.

One change that could be helpful though is to quit forcing the ball into Rudy...this has been a big problem for SloMo, Ant and KAT. If Finchie gets them to deemphasize this, I think we will be fine even with KAT and Ant continuing to be sloppy with the ball.

"The majority come from me trying to make the right play." - Ant

That's the key quote. I mentioned it in the game thread, but there are two goals that are in tension with each other: 1) make the right play, which often involves driving to the hoop or getting off the ball with a quick pass, and 2) not turning it over.

If Ant did what his instinct told him, he'd just rise up and shoot it nearly every time. But he's being coached (rightly so) to try to get to the hoop and pass the ball. Because he isn't a clinical ball handler or passer, he often makes sloppy plays.

KAT has a different problem, which is he over-uses the drive, which leads to at least one or two offensive fouls per game, which count as turnovers. But that's a big part of his identity, so I don't see him suddenly becoming only a spot up shooter.

Bottom line....There is no easy fix. Yes, having Conley or JMac on the floor most of the time helps, but obviously it hasn't been enough.

FNG wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2024 11:23 am It's definitely an issue, jester...as you pointed out, we have the third most turnovers in the league, and one of the teams behind us is Detroit! But still despite this problem, we have led the West most of first half of the season. Would
I like us to protect the ball better? Of course. But is there a team out there that is good at everything? We're the best defensive team in the Association, the third best rebounding team, have the third best 3-point percentage and the 6th best overall shooting percentage...and we rank in the middle of the pack in assists. Boston is an elite rebounding team and protects the ball very well. But they don't rank very high in shooting percentage or assists...and yet they still have the best record in basketball. We would be a better team if we protected the ball better, but that doesn't seem to be our identity...and our identity has led to a very good first half of the season. I like that the team recognizes this is a problem and vows to get better, but I'm skeptical that anything is going to change. Ant and KAT are going to continue to have the ball poked away on their frequently successful drives to the basket, and are both going to be susceptible to turnovers on sloppy passes also...and the last thing Finchie wants is for either of them to be less aggressive offensively. But nobody else on the team averages more than 1.7 turnovers per game, and that's pretty good.

One change that could be helpful though is to quit forcing the ball into Rudy...this has been a big problem for SloMo, Ant and KAT. If Finchie gets them to deemphasize this, I think we will be fine even with KAT and Ant continuing to be sloppy with the ball.

I don't see it happening because Rudy usually thinks he's open and wants the ball in these situations. If he gets looked off too often, you start to lose him a bit. Plus isn't the goal to punish teams for going small?

We talk about Rudy "hot hands" nights. Last night wasn't one of them, but he has had games where he catches nearly everything. But yeah, ultimately it's his constant runs to the rim that makes things crowded in there. Whenever Ant finds Rudy in the pick and roll, my first reaction is surprise....

Whenever we get into a post-Rudy "second window", I really hope whoever is coaching at that time installs a 5-out offense. It's really what would maximize what Ant brings to the table. He is not advanced enough to operate in small spaces.

Q-is-here wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2024 11:41 am

FNG wrote: ↑Sun Jan 21, 2024 11:23 am It's definitely an issue, jester...as you pointed out, we have the third most turnovers in the league, and one of the teams behind us is Detroit! But still despite this problem, we have led the West most of first half of the season. Would
I like us to protect the ball better? Of course. But is there a team out there that is good at everything? We're the best defensive team in the Association, the third best rebounding team, have the third best 3-point percentage and the 6th best overall shooting percentage...and we rank in the middle of the pack in assists. Boston is an elite rebounding team and protects the ball very well. But they don't rank very high in shooting percentage or assists...and yet they still have the best record in basketball. We would be a better team if we protected the ball better, but that doesn't seem to be our identity...and our identity has led to a very good first half of the season. I like that the team recognizes this is a problem and vows to get better, but I'm skeptical that anything is going to change. Ant and KAT are going to continue to have the ball poked away on their frequently successful drives to the basket, and are both going to be susceptible to turnovers on sloppy passes also...and the last thing Finchie wants is for either of them to be less aggressive offensively. But nobody else on the team averages more than 1.7 turnovers per game, and that's pretty good.

One change that could be helpful though is to quit forcing the ball into Rudy...this has been a big problem for SloMo, Ant and KAT. If Finchie gets them to deemphasize this, I think we will be fine even with KAT and Ant continuing to be sloppy with the ball.

I don't see it happening because Rudy usually thinks he's open and wants the ball in these situations. If he gets looked off too often, you start to lose him a bit. Plus isn't the goal to punish teams for going small?

We talk about Rudy "hot hands" nights. Last night wasn't one of them, but he has had games where he catches nearly everything. But yeah, ultimately it's his constant runs to the rim that makes things crowded in there. Whenever Ant finds Rudy in the pick and roll, my first reaction is surprise....

Whenever we get into a post-Rudy "second window", I really hope whoever is coaching at that time installs a 5-out offense. It's really what would maximize what Ant brings to the table. He is not advanced enough to operate in small spaces.

I was chronicling the number of failed alley oops to Gobert in a few recent DVR reviews.

There were three more TOs in the 1st half of yesterday's game trying to get Gobert the ball.

Teams are crowding the pant A LOT right now. That makes things harder for Edwards, Towns... and getting the ball to Gobert.

I keep looking back at that Utah team two seasons ago where they were the #1 offense with 2/5ths of our existing starting lineup on their squad (Rudy and Mike Conley). If you then think that Mitchell = Edwards; Bogdanovic = KAT; and O'Neale = Jaden, you start scratching your head and wondering how the hell they were so much better on offense.

The difference of course is largely turnovers - they turned it over less. But I think a related metric is 3 point attempts. They attempted a lot more 3's as a team (ranked 2nd in 3PTA that year), which of course helps with spacing and punishes defenses that constantly collapse.

Also, if you are launching more 3's and putting the ball on the floor less, it's less likely to result in a turnover. So taking more 3's and having fewer turnovers seem related.

https://theathletic.com/5216222/2024/01 ... ign=601983

Jon K joins the board conversation with his usual excellent writing. In this case though, I don't agree with his conclusion that the turnover issue stands to torpedo a possible championship season. I think the OkC game proved just the opposite...that we can actually beat a very good team despite an unacceptable number of turnovers. We lost the game because our two most efficient shooters had their worst shooting nights of the season...we win easily if Bite Bite and the Tower have normal shooting nights. I'd love to see this team mature and fix its turnover issue, but right now its not their identity...their identity is a big team that defends better than any team in the Association and shoots very well, but is careless with the ball. And that identity has led them to the top of the conference. Clean up the turnovers, and I think we run away with the conference. But I'm skeptical...I think we continue to play the way they have been, and still finish on top in a close race.