Thoughts on Simmons-Harden Deal

[Lipoli390]

I thought I'd start a thread to discuss the biggest, most talked about trade deadline deal. Morey got his guy, James Harden. In exchange he gave up Simmons, Curry, Drummond and two future 1st-round picks. The 2022 pick is unprotected and can be deferred to 2023 at the Nets' option.

It's hard to say who got the better of this deal. In the short run, it looks like the Sixers got the best of it because they're getting a superstar to plug in right away and help them pursue a championship this season. They're currently only 2.5 games out of first place and Simmons wasn't playing as we know. Assuming Harden is healthy, I see him putting the Sixers in the mix to come out on top in the East and play in the NBA finals. However, in the long run there's no doubt in my mind that the Nets got the better end of the deal. Simmons is young and on long term deal that's much cheaper than Harden's. And that unprotected first round pick looms large given that the Nets can defer it to 2023. Embiid is always on the edge of missing a lot of games or even an entire season and if James Harden seems content to be an overweight, repeating name on the injury report, then I can easily see the Sixers 2023 first-round pick being borderline lottery if not an outright lottery pick. And even in the short term, Simmons, Curry and Drummond could help the Nets and might turn out to be better for them than the often sidelined, disinterested James Harden. It will be interesting to watch.

I can see why Morey waited. He wasn't going to settle for anything less than a proven star and, to his credit, he ended up getting one. But he paid a pretty steep price. Moreover, you have to consider the deals they could have done before the season started - the really good players Morey could have added while also adding future picks and prospects. The players he could have gotten could have helped the team all season. Instead of being 2.5 games out of first, perhaps they could have been 4 - 5 games ahead. Of course, we'll never know. But we do know that Morey ended up losing a key perimeter shooter and valuable future assets for a guy who hasn't played like a superstar for quite some time. And one more thing I'll add. I'd love to see the NBA thoroughly investigate Morey for tampering. I strongly suspect that he's been directly or indirectly in regular contact with Harden and knew all along that Harden would ultimately push for a trade to the Sixers. And that's probably why Morey was so so confident and cocky about holding out until the deadline. I I know I'm speculating, but there's a bit of a rotten smell radiating from this outcome.

In any event, the big take-away for me is how it impacts who I'll be pulling for or rooting against. I haven't liked the Nets since they put together their big three of Durant, Irving and Harden. I don't like super-teams built with mercenaries and I've never liked Irving or Harden. But I like Durant and I like Simmons. I also like Curry and Drummond. And I'd love to see the Nets do better than the Sixers following this trade because of my disdain for the Sixers. This trade has increased my disdain for the Sixers substantially. I can't stand the always smug Darryl Morey and I don't like the arrogant Embiid. Adding a jerk like Harden to that team deepens my disdain and will encourage me to root against them even more.

So there you have it. I'm interested in other takes on this deal, including any laments over the fact that Simmons didn't end up with the Wolves. :)

[Shumway]

Agree on all accounts Lip. You make it pretty tough to add to the discussion when you cover all the points like that.

Like you, I'll be rooting for James Harden's disinterested approach to torpedo the Sixers chances.

[Monster]

I'm still cheering for other eastern conference teams. Both the Nets and the Sixers it will end interesting how things go. Is Harden all ready to roll? How long will it take Simmons to get going?

Ultimately the Nets I think did pretty well. The question about Simmons is whether or not he stays healthy. Can the Nets eventually find another good player to help bridge the gap when Durant and Kyrie are gone or slowing down?

Meanwhile the Cavs ended up with Lavert and Jarrett Allen and might face either of these teams in the playoffs.

[Tactical unit]

I'm shocked that they gave up that much for Harden as he hasn't been an MVP type of player. The price was extremely high IMO. I think it makes the nets better now and in the future. Would love for Simmons to have been working on his shot while sitting out and perform at a higher level than Harden.

Good job Nets!

[Monster]

FWIW I would bet that the Sixers would have given up the same deal they did for Harden for a healthy Lilliard. They probably would have done it months ago if they could have.

One guy that got talked about for the wrong reasons that may benefit from Harden is Tobias Harris. He seems like a guy that would benefit from an actual PG. The Sixers have basically been playing without an actual pg (which makes their success additionally impressive) but now they will have one in Harden. Having said that looking at Tobias splits he has been shooting the heck out the ball the last few weeks. It will be interesting to see if the Sixer D slips and if Harden helps improve their offense. I think the big thing about adding Harden is that his value will increase once it's the playoffs and you need a guy that can get a bucket etc.

[D-Mac [enjin:19736340]]

I'm shocked that they gave up that much for Harden as he hasn't been an MVP type of player. The price was extremely high IMO. I think it makes the nets better now and in the future. Would love for Simmons to have been working on his shot while sitting out and perform at a higher level than Harden.

Good job Nets!

Yeah, they gave up way too much. Should have been straight up one for one with maybe a 1 protected 1st

[AbeVigodaLive]

Kinda find the entire ordeal disgusting.

James Harden has blatantly and obviously QUIT on two different franchises in barely one year. And yet... here he is... getting his wish to join another top contender. And the worst part is that now that his "injured hamstring" is magically healed, he will try harder and he will post big stats.

And he will be celebrated for it.

I don't know if the NBA has ever been in a better place than it is right now for talent. Unfortunately, an increasing number of those players have a sense of entitlement to everything they do that's very off-putting.

An even larger problem is that I think part of this extends beyond basketball. It's more of a generational thing. Count me in the old man with a hose running the kids off my lawn camp... but I can't relate to many of these guys...

... nor the type of NBA fan that eats up the TMZ-style discussions about their next forced move to their next desired destination.

1. Make the best of the situation you're dealt... learn more from adversity than success... grow and build internally.

vs.

2. Use your leverage to put yourself in the best situation to win... put yourself first... let others deal with the consequences, that's not really your concern.

-------

I'm not suggesting that everybody needs to follow my lead or thinking. Not at all. But it's how I was raised and it's shaped how I live my life. So, it shapes how I view people and situations sometimes.

Likewise, others prefer #2. And that's fine for them and works for them. People can probably assign pluses and minuses to either approach.

I simply prefer #1 and will continue to bristle at those who are hard advocates for #2.

Now get off my lawn before I strike you down with a frozen hose!

[Lipoli390]

Kinda find the entire ordeal disgusting.

James Harden has blatantly and obviously QUIT on two different franchises in barely one year. And yet... here he is... getting his wish to join another top contender. And the worst part is that now that his "injured hamstring" is magically healed, he will try harder and he will post big stats.

And he will be celebrated for it.

I don't know if the NBA has ever been in a better place than it is right now for talent. Unfortunately, an increasing number of those players have a sense of entitlement to everything they do that's very off-putting.

An even larger problem is that I think part of this extends beyond basketball. It's more of a generational thing. Count me in the old man with a hose running the kids off my lawn camp... but I can't relate to many of these guys...

... nor the type of NBA fan that eats up the TMZ-style discussions about their next forced move to their next desired destination.

1. Make the best of the situation you're dealt... learn more from adversity than success... grow and build internally.

vs.

2. Use your leverage to put yourself in the best situation to win... put yourself first... let others deal with the consequences, that's not really your concern.

-------

I'm not suggesting that everybody needs to follow my lead or thinking. Not at all. But it's how I was raised and it's shaped how I live my life. So, it shapes how I view people and situations sometimes.

Likewise, others prefer #2. And that's fine for them and works for them. People can probably assign pluses and minuses to either approach.

I simply prefer #1 and will continue to bristle at those who are hard advocates for #2.

Now get off my lawn before I strike you down with a frozen hose!

I feel exactly the same way, Abe!

[FNG]

Yeah, good analysis Lip. Clearly this makes Philly better in the short run because they pick up a ridiculously-efficient score in Harden while only giving up Drummond and Curry. But Brooklyn gets better short-term also by unloading an unhappy player and adding the playmaking and defense of Simmons and the 3-point shooting of Curry. The Nets are going to be very good on the road the rest of the season with Irving playing, and unstoppable when Durant returns. There's a reason they are now the odds-on favorite in Vegas to win it all this year (slightly ahead of the Warriors) despite a 29-26 record.

Long-term I agree this is a huge win for the Nets. Harden is Harden, and he will soon be unhappy in Philly. And Durant/Simmons/Irving is a Big Three that is very formidable, especially with their strong role players.

[D-Mac [enjin:19736340]]

Kinda find the entire ordeal disgusting.

James Harden has blatantly and obviously QUIT on two different franchises in barely one year. And yet... here he is... getting his wish to join another top contender. And the worst part is that now that his "injured hamstring" is magically healed, he will try harder and he will post big stats.

And he will be celebrated for it.

I don't know if the NBA has ever been in a better place than it is right now for talent. Unfortunately, an increasing number of those players have a sense of entitlement to everything they do that's very off-putting.

An even larger problem is that I think part of this extends beyond basketball. It's more of a generational thing. Count me in the old man with a hose running the kids off my lawn camp... but I can't relate to many of these guys...

... nor the type of NBA fan that eats up the TMZ-style discussions about their next forced move to their next desired destination.

1. Make the best of the situation you're dealt... learn more from adversity than success... grow and build internally.

vs.

2. Use your leverage to put yourself in the best situation to win... put yourself first... let others deal with the consequences, that's not really your concern.

-------

I'm not suggesting that everybody needs to follow my lead or thinking. Not at all. But it's how I was raised and it's shaped how I live my life. So, it shapes how I view people and situations sometimes.

Likewise, others prefer #2. And that's fine for them and works for them. People can probably assign pluses and minuses to either approach.

I simply prefer #1 and will continue to bristle at those who are hard advocates for #2.

Now get off my lawn before I strike you down with a frozen hose!

This is great. Amen