Udonis Haslem, Building Culture, and the Wolves

[Lipoli390]

Q - I think you're on to something even though I don't put as much stock as others do in "culture thing". A big with a championship ring or two who has some gravitas and can command the respect of the younger players would be a nice addition. But I also think he'd have to be able to help on the floor as well. Miami's culture is solidly in place - formed through many years when Haslem and others were making a difference on the floor. I can't think of anyone gettable who would fit the mold.

Derrick Favors might be that guy. He's played on a winning team with a winning culture for years. But he has two years left on his contract with the Jazz at around $10M per year. Would the Jazz like to get Ricky back? Rubio for Favors?

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

Q - I think you're on to something even though I don't put as much stock as others do in "culture thing". A big with a championship ring or two who has some gravitas and can command the respect of the younger players would be a nice addition. But I also think he'd have to be able to help on the floor as well. Miami's culture is solidly in place - formed through many years when Haslem and others were making a difference on the floor. I can't think of anyone gettable who would fit the mold.

Derrick Favors might be that guy. He's played on a winning team with a winning culture for years. But he has two years left on his contract with the Jazz at around $10M per year. Would the Jazz like to get Ricky back? Rubio for Favors?

interesting idea. Favors has been a solid player for the Jazz for a lot of years now.

[Porckchop]

I think it's funny that when Rubio got traded back into the fold and everyone on here said he would be the veteran influence to make a difference. And I said no no, he's not a winner and he doesn't produce. I'm labeled a hater. And then you get a thread like this!!
I love it.
It's like we all of a sudden had an original thought where a veteran player that doesn't need to contribute that much on the court but still finds a way to make a difference in the W column. Isn't that what you guys have been saying about Ricky since day one?

[Lipoli390]

Q - I think you're on to something even though I don't put as much stock as others do in "culture thing". A big with a championship ring or two who has some gravitas and can command the respect of the younger players would be a nice addition. But I also think he'd have to be able to help on the floor as well. Miami's culture is solidly in place - formed through many years when Haslem and others were making a difference on the floor. I can't think of anyone gettable who would fit the mold.

Derrick Favors might be that guy. He's played on a winning team with a winning culture for years. But he has two years left on his contract with the Jazz at around $10M per year. Would the Jazz like to get Ricky back? Rubio for Favors?

interesting idea. Favors has been a solid player for the Jazz for a lot of years now.

I'm assuming the Jazz would not be interested in taking Rubio back in a trade. Remember, Favors only averaged about 15 minutes per game this past season. So I wouldn't think Utah has him on their high priority retention list. I can think of several potential combinations that might be enough to land Favors:

Juancho + Layman for Favors: Wolves would save 1.2M in salary space next season with this deal. So we'd get a little more salary flexibility under the luxury tax threshold in addition to getting a solid established veteran big. Utah is all about three-point shooting and that what Juancho and Layman bring to the table. They're already an excellent defensive team, so they can afford to add a couple marginal defenders. And actually, Layman's not a terrible defender.

Culver + Layman for Favors + a future 2nd round pick: I think Utah would definitely do this deal. My fear is that Culver would become a star with the Jazz. The Wolves would save about $600K in this deal.

Juancho + Culver for Favors and Azubuike: This would be my favorite. We'd get the "culture" vet in Favors and a young big with upside. We'd also save about $1.6M in salary next season.

[Monster]

We need to develop and keep our own guy like Haslem.

If they are going to bring in one of these mentor guys IMO they need to be someone that is going to be around a while not a 1 year signing that ends up sitting on the bench. They basically added Ed Davis for what has been discussed here (he doesn't have a ring but is revered around the league) and it didn't seem to be a great move. Also I looked up Omari Spellman the other day. No team picked him up. I wonder if he has some attitude problems that make teams stay away. There were a lot of half decent players that were available for teams to sign including RHJ.

I'd love to add a Tayshaun Prince type guy. He works in the Grizzlies front office now.

[TheFuture]

I remember Andrei Kirilenko being one of the most underrated signings for the Wolves back in the day. I would think that type of guy would be a huge benefit here.

Well, Kirilenko was actually a really good player still. I'm talking about potentially finding someone that may not even be able to play that effectively anymore, but carries a big stick in the lockerroom and personifies all of the habits needed to create winning culture. Its basically an Ed Davis or Anthony Tolliver with a ring.

I know this does not fit your champion criteria but I'm predicting JJ Reddick will be a wolf next year. He almost signed under flip. He mentioned Rosas presentation to him when he was a FA 2 years ago was the most impressive thing he has ever had. He is now a minimum player and I'm predicting he will be a wolf

I question whether he's a minimum player... and I don't know if he plays for the minimum. I think those two things are connected. It's no secret that Redick has sucked this season. And... it MIGHT not be a coincidence that he's been unhappy this season.

He signed on with a supposedly surging young team -- and it failed. Meanwhile, he was upset he was so far removed from his kids in Brooklyn. Do we really think he's signing in another similar situation so far away from his kids again?

There's a price for those services. And it's not the minimum... he can make that much off the court with his kids in the next room. So if he takes the minimum, I think it's as a ring chaser in Brooklyn, Philly, NY... where he gets the family + championship shot.

Agreed, and besides that, we do not have room for another SG.

It has to be a forward.

[AbeVigodaLive]

I remember Andrei Kirilenko being one of the most underrated signings for the Wolves back in the day. I would think that type of guy would be a huge benefit here.

Well, Kirilenko was actually a really good player still. I'm talking about potentially finding someone that may not even be able to play that effectively anymore, but carries a big stick in the lockerroom and personifies all of the habits needed to create winning culture. Its basically an Ed Davis or Anthony Tolliver with a ring.

I know this does not fit your champion criteria but I'm predicting JJ Reddick will be a wolf next year. He almost signed under flip. He mentioned Rosas presentation to him when he was a FA 2 years ago was the most impressive thing he has ever had. He is now a minimum player and I'm predicting he will be a wolf

I question whether he's a minimum player... and I don't know if he plays for the minimum. I think those two things are connected. It's no secret that Redick has sucked this season. And... it MIGHT not be a coincidence that he's been unhappy this season.

He signed on with a supposedly surging young team -- and it failed. Meanwhile, he was upset he was so far removed from his kids in Brooklyn. Do we really think he's signing in another similar situation so far away from his kids again?

There's a price for those services. And it's not the minimum... he can make that much off the court with his kids in the next room. So if he takes the minimum, I think it's as a ring chaser in Brooklyn, Philly, NY... where he gets the family + championship shot.

Agreed, and besides that, we do not have room for another SG.

It has to be a forward.

If it's a big... Cool's suggestion of Gasol makes sense.

I don't know if Gasol bites (unless he still believes he wants 25+ mpg)... but he's a smart veteran big man with a ring who knows how the game works on and off the court.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

Yup, Gasol would be a fantastic addition. Basically wins wherever he goes - arguably the most important cog on those Memphis teams that just kept winning 50+ games year after year. The problem is he's signed for cheap for next season too.

[bleedspeed]

I remember Andrei Kirilenko being one of the most underrated signings for the Wolves back in the day. I would think that type of guy would be a huge benefit here.

Well, Kirilenko was actually a really good player still. I'm talking about potentially finding someone that may not even be able to play that effectively anymore, but carries a big stick in the lockerroom and personifies all of the habits needed to create winning culture. Its basically an Ed Davis or Anthony Tolliver with a ring.

Yes, but I think it is important that leaders start and play. I think the good cheerleader on the bench player is not nearly as impactful.

[Monster]

I a big fan of Haslem and Miami has a terrific culture...but just to look at the other side of things you can easily make an argument that Haslem being on the roster the last couple years has simply been a waste. He has played 5 games in the last 2 years and a total of 44 games in the last 5 seasons. I do think having vet players around is important and I'm not completely knocking him being around but...maybe it wasn't actually worth it. He is a guy that's been through 3 separate finals runs as a player with the Heat he is Mr Heat.

Meanwhile whoever the Wolves bring in for this role isn't going to have that franchise history. Like it was stated in another thread Rubio is one of 4 Wolves players to play 7 seasons with the team. This franchise simply hasn't kept guys around for a myriad of reasons. Obviously we don't have the franchise success so the idea is we implant it from somewhere else. The thing is that guy has to buy in and the coaching staff and to the system and...it's a lot to ask for some older guy to make that type of impact when they may not have a reason to buy in.

Having said that if the Wolves did deal Rubio and didn't get a vet back the most experienced player in the team would he Towns. It does feel like it would be worthwhile to have someone else on the roster that's been around sort of an adult in the room. You know who would actually be really great for this? Paul Millsap. Still can play but not full time minutes (other guys would be able to have an opportunity) and wouldn't cost a ton. Fills a need on the roster too. The problem is even if he would take a 1 year mid-level offer or less...the Wolves are up against the Lux tax. I'll say this if the Wolves went over the Lux tax because they kept their pick and signed Millsap (maybe even if they just signed Millsap) I would probably say just do it.