FNG wrote:Lip, I'm not so sure about your first point above. I think it depends on which part of the ownership group would bear the brunt of the lux tax. If Glen is absolved, I don't know that the lux tax is off the table. Glen and ALore are both billionaires, but that's where the similarities end. Glen is smart and strategic to be sure, but he also has a Midwestern cautiousness inherent in him that would never allow himself to pay such a punitive tax...even if it didn't have a material impact on his net worth. Lore and ARod are cut from an entirely different cloth. They are brash and willing to take on significant risk in order to meet their goals. Look at some of the things Lore has done in his life, and you see a guy who likes living on the edge and will do whatever it takes to come out on top. That's why so many of us were excited when they announced they were getting involved. If TC wants Ayton, Gobert, or heck even Simmons, and says that's the piece that can put us over the top, I don't know that the new ownership group will let a tax get in the way. Of course they would have to find a way to protect Glen for a cash outlay, but if they can do it, I don't think the lux tax will be a barrier. And thank God for that if it's true!
Sure if the Wolves are adding a game changing player sure I think Glen will have no problem going into the luxury tax. The Wolves aren't gonna go into the luxury tax for guys that are mostly likely just rotation players. One reason to kee that line in the sand is you can also use it as a negotiation tactic with FA who might try and get as much as they can. Obviously Lore and Arod will be more aggressive than Glen going forward in most every way.
TheFuture wrote:I would do anything I could to go get Ayton. D'Lo, Naz, and next years protected pick or two. Offer Nowell 4 years/22 mil. Go after Patty Mills or Tyus for around 9 mil per over 3 years. Offer Javale McGee, Jalen Smith, or Isaiah Hartenstein 6 mil per over 3.
Mills or Tyus/Beverley/Jmac
Edwards/Beasley/Nowell
McDaniels/Prince/Moore
KAT/Vando
Ayton/Smith/Kessler
I could like that.
There is a thing called a salary cap. I understand that you are saying though
I believe a sign and trade for ayton, exceptions on say Tyus and Smith, nowell extension after would all work.
Your suggested moves would be legal, but they would push Minnesota over the luxury tax threshold. That's something to consider from a financial standpoint.
Basketball-wise, I'm not sure that team is better than one that keeps the current roster and signs Isaiah Hartenstein.
Actually there is no exception that would allow the Wolves to sign Tyus (I assume you are using the mid-level) for 9 million and then one of those bigs for for 6 million. The bi-annual exception is for about 4 million.
TheFuture wrote:I would do anything I could to go get Ayton. D'Lo, Naz, and next years protected pick or two. Offer Nowell 4 years/22 mil. Go after Patty Mills or Tyus for around 9 mil per over 3 years. Offer Javale McGee, Jalen Smith, or Isaiah Hartenstein 6 mil per over 3.
Mills or Tyus/Beverley/Jmac
Edwards/Beasley/Nowell
McDaniels/Prince/Moore
KAT/Vando
Ayton/Smith/Kessler
I could like that.
There is a thing called a salary cap. I understand that you are saying though
I believe a sign and trade for ayton, exceptions on say Tyus and Smith, nowell extension after would all work.
Your suggested moves would be legal, but they would push Minnesota over the luxury tax threshold. That's something to consider from a financial standpoint.
Basketball-wise, I'm not sure that team is better than one that keeps the current roster and signs Isaiah Hartenstein.
This front office has obviously calibrated really carefully to ensure they can fill all their roster spots and use the full MLE without exceeding the luxury tax threshold. Therefore, I don't see the Wolves making any moves this summer that would push them over that line. I have two key take aways so far on the strategic framework the Wolves front office is working within:
1. The Wolves will not make any moves that put them over the luxury tax threshold this summer. They might be willing to do that in a year or two, but they've clearly determined that this franchise is not yet at a point where it makes sense to pay the luxury tax and face the resulting loss of financial flexibility. I agree with this approach.
2. The Wolves will not mortgage their future by trading away multiple 1st-round picks. Knowing that they declined to do so to get Murray, I don't see them doing so for any potential trade target this summer. Again, I agree with this approach, although it was really tempting to give up those assets for Murray - a 25 year old PG with two very team-friendly years left on his contract who just averaged 20 points, 8 rebounds, 9 assists and 2 steals per game last season.
What do you three think about moving on Ayton?
A ball-handling guard does nothing for this franchises development. It obviously is contingent on Ant, who is at his very best with the ball in his hands. Murray, Dlo, Shai, etc. All are best controlling the ball. That slows down Ant. Get a decisive, catch and shoot, lob-throwing, intelligent team defender pg and roll on.
FNG wrote:Lip, I'm not so sure about your first point above. I think it depends on which part of the ownership group would bear the brunt of the lux tax. If Glen is absolved, I don't know that the lux tax is off the table. Glen and ALore are both billionaires, but that's where the similarities end. Glen is smart and strategic to be sure, but he also has a Midwestern cautiousness inherent in him that would never allow himself to pay such a punitive tax...even if it didn't have a material impact on his net worth. Lore and ARod are cut from an entirely different cloth. They are brash and willing to take on significant risk in order to meet their goals. Look at some of the things Lore has done in his life, and you see a guy who likes living on the edge and will do whatever it takes to come out on top. That's why so many of us were excited when they announced they were getting involved. If TC wants Ayton, Gobert, or heck even Simmons, and says that's the piece that can put us over the top, I don't know that the new ownership group will let a tax get in the way. Of course they would have to find a way to protect Glen for a cash outlay, but if they can do it, I don't think the lux tax will be a barrier. And thank God for that if it's true!
The luxury tax isn't just about the money. It's about the loss of financial flexibility to make moves and adjust. It includes a reduced MLE as well. And I actually don't think our new owners are brash. Going after Connelly was aggressive, but not brash. They were pursuing one of the top three NBA executives in the League. And the money they gave him is a tiny fraction of the organization's overall budget. I don't know about A-Rod, but Lore's strongest attribute is probably the fact that he's smart. Like any successful entrepreneur he obviously has an appetite for risk and is inclined to be action, but only in a carefully calculated way. My point isn't that they won't ultimately be willing to go into the luxury tax zone. Almost every championship team in the NBA eventually has to do that. Its' just a matter of timing. And I don't think Lore, Connelly or Gupta believe this is the right time in the team's development to take that kind of a swing for fences. And I think they're absolutely right in that regard.
FNG wrote:Lip, I'm not so sure about your first point above. I think it depends on which part of the ownership group would bear the brunt of the lux tax. If Glen is absolved, I don't know that the lux tax is off the table. Glen and ALore are both billionaires, but that's where the similarities end. Glen is smart and strategic to be sure, but he also has a Midwestern cautiousness inherent in him that would never allow himself to pay such a punitive tax...even if it didn't have a material impact on his net worth. Lore and ARod are cut from an entirely different cloth. They are brash and willing to take on significant risk in order to meet their goals. Look at some of the things Lore has done in his life, and you see a guy who likes living on the edge and will do whatever it takes to come out on top. That's why so many of us were excited when they announced they were getting involved. If TC wants Ayton, Gobert, or heck even Simmons, and says that's the piece that can put us over the top, I don't know that the new ownership group will let a tax get in the way. Of course they would have to find a way to protect Glen for a cash outlay, but if they can do it, I don't think the lux tax will be a barrier. And thank God for that if it's true!
The luxury tax isn't just about the money. It's about the loss of financial flexibility to make moves and adjust. It includes a reduced MLE as well. And I actually don't think our new owners are brash. Going after Connelly was aggressive, but not brash. They were pursuing one of the top three NBA executives in the League. And the money they gave him is a tiny fraction of the organization's overall budget. I don't know about A-Rod, but Lore's strongest attribute is probably the fact that he's smart. Like any successful entrepreneur he obviously has an appetite for risk and is inclined to be action, but only in a carefully calculated way. My point isn't that they won't ultimately be willing to go into the luxury tax zone. Almost every championship team in the NBA eventually has to do that. Its' just a matter of timing. And I don't think Lore, Connelly or Gupta believe this is the right time in the team's development to take that kind of a swing for fences. And I think they're absolutely right in that regard.
Not brash? Maybe Stupid? They paid a guy top 10 money to run their organization, gave equity, all before they even came up with the money to buy out the team.
FNG wrote:Lip, I'm not so sure about your first point above. I think it depends on which part of the ownership group would bear the brunt of the lux tax. If Glen is absolved, I don't know that the lux tax is off the table. Glen and ALore are both billionaires, but that's where the similarities end. Glen is smart and strategic to be sure, but he also has a Midwestern cautiousness inherent in him that would never allow himself to pay such a punitive tax...even if it didn't have a material impact on his net worth. Lore and ARod are cut from an entirely different cloth. They are brash and willing to take on significant risk in order to meet their goals. Look at some of the things Lore has done in his life, and you see a guy who likes living on the edge and will do whatever it takes to come out on top. That's why so many of us were excited when they announced they were getting involved. If TC wants Ayton, Gobert, or heck even Simmons, and says that's the piece that can put us over the top, I don't know that the new ownership group will let a tax get in the way. Of course they would have to find a way to protect Glen for a cash outlay, but if they can do it, I don't think the lux tax will be a barrier. And thank God for that if it's true!
The luxury tax isn't just about the money. It's about the loss of financial flexibility to make moves and adjust. It includes a reduced MLE as well. And I actually don't think our new owners are brash. Going after Connelly was aggressive, but not brash. They were pursuing one of the top three NBA executives in the League. And the money they gave him is a tiny fraction of the organization's overall budget. I don't know about A-Rod, but Lore's strongest attribute is probably the fact that he's smart. Like any successful entrepreneur he obviously has an appetite for risk and is inclined to be action, but only in a carefully calculated way. My point isn't that they won't ultimately be willing to go into the luxury tax zone. Almost every championship team in the NBA eventually has to do that. Its' just a matter of timing. And I don't think Lore, Connelly or Gupta believe this is the right time in the team's development to take that kind of a swing for fences. And I think they're absolutely right in that regard.
Not brash? Maybe Stupid? They paid a guy top 10 money to run their organization, gave equity, all before they even came up with the money to buy out the team.
Not even close to brash and clearly not stupid. Again, what they're paying Connelly is a rounding error in the overall basketball budget. It's less than the MLE for one player. The equity stake is overstated. As I read about it, it's a bonus paid out based on the increased valuation of the team. That's new to compensation for NBA basketball executives, but hardly a significant risk. As for the fact Lore and A-Rod don't yet own the team, so what. In that sense, maybe that just makes them extra smart - i.e., spending Glen's money. :)
TheFuture wrote:A ball-handling guard does nothing for this franchises development. It obviously is contingent on Ant, who is at his very best with the ball in his hands. Murray, Dlo, Shai, etc. All are best controlling the ball. That slows down Ant. Get a decisive, catch and shoot, lob-throwing, intelligent team defender pg and roll on.
Respectfully, the numbers would indicate otherwise on an individual and team basis as both Anthony Edwards and the team performed much better when D'Angelo Russell was on the floor versus off. Maybe one day Edwards will be that lead guard who doesn't need another high usage guard next to him, but he's not that player yet.
Also, there's no good reason to handcuff your team by limiting the amount of ball-handlers and shot creators that you roster, especially because you want one player to handle the rock more. That's an outdated way to build a team, in my opinion.
FNG wrote:Lip, I'm not so sure about your first point above. I think it depends on which part of the ownership group would bear the brunt of the lux tax. If Glen is absolved, I don't know that the lux tax is off the table. Glen and ALore are both billionaires, but that's where the similarities end. Glen is smart and strategic to be sure, but he also has a Midwestern cautiousness inherent in him that would never allow himself to pay such a punitive tax...even if it didn't have a material impact on his net worth. Lore and ARod are cut from an entirely different cloth. They are brash and willing to take on significant risk in order to meet their goals. Look at some of the things Lore has done in his life, and you see a guy who likes living on the edge and will do whatever it takes to come out on top. That's why so many of us were excited when they announced they were getting involved. If TC wants Ayton, Gobert, or heck even Simmons, and says that's the piece that can put us over the top, I don't know that the new ownership group will let a tax get in the way. Of course they would have to find a way to protect Glen for a cash outlay, but if they can do it, I don't think the lux tax will be a barrier. And thank God for that if it's true!
The luxury tax isn't just about the money. It's about the loss of financial flexibility to make moves and adjust. It includes a reduced MLE as well. And I actually don't think our new owners are brash. Going after Connelly was aggressive, but not brash. They were pursuing one of the top three NBA executives in the League. And the money they gave him is a tiny fraction of the organization's overall budget. I don't know about A-Rod, but Lore's strongest attribute is probably the fact that he's smart. Like any successful entrepreneur he obviously has an appetite for risk and is inclined to be action, but only in a carefully calculated way. My point isn't that they won't ultimately be willing to go into the luxury tax zone. Almost every championship team in the NBA eventually has to do that. Its' just a matter of timing. And I don't think Lore, Connelly or Gupta believe this is the right time in the team's development to take that kind of a swing for fences. And I think they're absolutely right in that regard.
Not brash? Maybe Stupid? They paid a guy top 10 money to run their organization, gave equity, all before they even came up with the money to buy out the team.
Not even close to brash and clearly not stupid. Again, what they're paying Connelly is a rounding error in the overall basketball budget. It's less than the MLE for one player. The equity stake is overstated. As I read about it, it's a bonus paid out based on the increased valuation of the team. That's new to compensation for NBA basketball executives, but hardly a significant risk. As for the fact Lore and A-Rod don't yet own the team, so what. In that sense, maybe that just makes them extra smart - i.e., spending Glen's money. :)
OK, that makes sense if you care about people running a business who have no interest in you vs. something you hope, talk about, and want to cheer about.
People love to trash on Glen, but you should be glad he owns the Wolves. Otherwise you would have nothing to go on about.
TheFuture wrote:I would do anything I could to go get Ayton. D'Lo, Naz, and next years protected pick or two. Offer Nowell 4 years/22 mil. Go after Patty Mills or Tyus for around 9 mil per over 3 years. Offer Javale McGee, Jalen Smith, or Isaiah Hartenstein 6 mil per over 3.
Mills or Tyus/Beverley/Jmac
Edwards/Beasley/Nowell
McDaniels/Prince/Moore
KAT/Vando
Ayton/Smith/Kessler
I could like that.
There is a thing called a salary cap. I understand that you are saying though
I believe a sign and trade for ayton, exceptions on say Tyus and Smith, nowell extension after would all work.
Your suggested moves would be legal, but they would push Minnesota over the luxury tax threshold. That's something to consider from a financial standpoint.
Basketball-wise, I'm not sure that team is better than one that keeps the current roster and signs Isaiah Hartenstein.
This front office has obviously calibrated really carefully to ensure they can fill all their roster spots and use the full MLE without exceeding the luxury tax threshold. Therefore, I don't see the Wolves making any moves this summer that would push them over that line. I have two key take aways so far on the strategic framework the Wolves front office is working within:
1. The Wolves will not make any moves that put them over the luxury tax threshold this summer. They might be willing to do that in a year or two, but they've clearly determined that this franchise is not yet at a point where it makes sense to pay the luxury tax and face the resulting loss of financial flexibility. I agree with this approach.
2. The Wolves will not mortgage their future by trading away multiple 1st-round picks. Knowing that they declined to do so to get Murray, I don't see them doing so for any potential trade target this summer. Again, I agree with this approach, although it was really tempting to give up those assets for Murray - a 25 year old PG with two very team-friendly years left on his contract who just averaged 20 points, 8 rebounds, 9 assists and 2 steals per game last season.
What do you three think about moving on Ayton?
A ball-handling guard does nothing for this franchises development. It obviously is contingent on Ant, who is at his very best with the ball in his hands. Murray, Dlo, Shai, etc. All are best controlling the ball. That slows down Ant. Get a decisive, catch and shoot, lob-throwing, intelligent team defender pg and roll on.
