Compare 2019 Wolves to 2020 Wolves
Compare 2019 Wolves to 2020 Wolves
I think it would be interesting to compare the Wolves as they were assembled to start last season with what they have this season. We don't know exactly what the roster will look like with McLaughlin not signed and then if he is then someone won't be on the team. If you want make your prediction and go from there.
Re: Compare 2019 Wolves to 2020 Wolves
monsterpile wrote:I think it would be interesting to compare the Wolves as they were assembled to start last season with what they have this season. We don't know exactly what the roster will look like with McLaughlin not signed and then if he is then someone won't be on the team. If you want make your prediction and go from there.
Interesting question. A couple days ago I watched the Wolves 2019 opener in Brooklyn against the Nets. You might remember that the Wolves won in overtime. It was a fun one to watch. Several things stood out in that win.
1. KAT really is an elite player. He's an almost unstoppable scorer in the post, but also an exceptional shooter from behind the arc. Of course, he's also an elite rebounder. He really put the team on his back that game.
2. Okogie is a highly valuable player in the rotation. His relentless and disruptive defense along with his rebounding and nose for the ball provide a huge positive that doesn't always show up in the box score. And while his perimeter shooting is problematic, he's actually pretty good on the offensive end. He keeps the ball moving and generally makes the right pass at the right time. He moves well without the ball and his ballhandling is adequate.
3. Wiggins really is talented. He had some major buckets for the Wolves that game.
4. Covington was a really important player on this team and he played a key role in the Wolves win over the Nets in last season's opener.
Looking ahead to this upcoming season, KAT is back and should be healthy. DLO should give the team more than they got from Wiggins. He's a much better ball-handler and playmaker than Wiggins and also a much better perimeter shooter. Okogie should be at least as good as last season and I would think he'll be significantly better, which is typical of players entering their third NBA season. If Beasley stays out of prison, he'll definitely improve the team's overall 3-point shooting even if his shooting reverts to his pre-Wolves career in Denver. And I definitely think Rubio will make the team better.
So there are a number of reasons why this team should be better. But the team really needs a 3 & D guy like Covington. RHJ gives us some of Covington's D, but none of his 3. And even if we're better, we were a 19-win team last season. So this team will have to be a whole lot better to be within sniffing distance of the playoffs.
Re: Compare 2019 Wolves to 2020 Wolves
Alright I'll do my comparison. It might not be exactly what everyone else will do player to player but it's what makes sense to me. :)
I'll score the 2019 player compared to the 2020 with either and "ADVANTAGE" To one year or another or "EVEN". If there is a player with "POTENTIAL" for the season and or beyond that will be noted. "VET" Credit for very establish players will be given for a couple spots.
Holdover players:
Towns. If he is healthy he should be at least as good as last year. EVEN
Okogie. Last year we had hope for him to improve meaningfully. I think he did but he didn't blow up. He is a better player than he was a rookie and we can hope he will progress more but it's uncertain. EVEN with POTENTIAL to be better like last year.
Culver. It's not hard to imagine Culver being better at both ends of the floor than his rookie year. At the very least I expect him to be better on defense. ADVANTAGE 2020 with POTENTIAL both this year and beyond. You can argue that the expectations are lower this year than last year so...we'll I'm still giving Culver of 2020 the higher value.
Jake Layman. Another guy if he stays healthy should be expected to be a similar player to what he was the previous year EVEN
Naz Reid was a 2-way player we didn't really know what we were actually getting with him and when he played he looks like he can be an NBA rotation player. ADVANTAGE 2020 because we have seen him play NBA basketball games and he did some positive things POTENTIAL of some sort is there as well
Nowell if he is on the team EVEN if he is on the roster He should be bette than last year actually but I'm not sure he will be here.
New players:
Wiggins vs Beasley I'm going to give Wiggins a bit of an ADVANTAGE 2019 here because of him being a less bad defender and because Beasley is likely to get suspended. The POTENTIAL for Beasley to be more useful for the money is higher though.
Teague Vs Russell. It's ADVANTAGE 2020 here easily with POTENTIAL
Napier vs Rubio. Another ADVANTAGE 2020. I compared these guys because they are advanced stats guys but obviously Rubio being a much better player. Rubio gets the VET designation
Graham vs Edwards Going with Slight ADVANTAGE 2019 in that Graham even though flaws may hurt you less than Edwards. POTENTIAL is obviously waaaaay Way higher for Edwards both this year and beyond.
Bell vs McDaniels Meaningless ADVANTAGE 2019 as I'm not sure Bell is even on a roster this season . Most of us considered him a legit NBA player when we signed him last year. McDaniels has POTENTIAL but we don't know when it will come to fruition.
Vonleh Vs Davis Overall I see this as EVEN Although he had a down year last year Davis is proven Vonleh was more of a potential guy last year. Davis gets a VET distinction
Covington vs Juancho Obvious ADVANTAGE 2019. Covington is also a VET. Juancho represents some sort of POTENTIAL but it's highly unlikely to exceed Covington or even just sold started status which honestly would be a win if Juancho achieved that.
Dieng vs RHJ idk I guess EVEN with a little POTENTIAL for RHJ to become a little more of something and he is just younger.
KBD be Vanderbilt idk EVEN maybe Vanderbilt is POTENTIAL maybe KBD should have an advantage because he actually played some NBA games the previous year. Vanderbilt is still just 21. Not enough to swing the balance at this point I'll stay at EVEN.
If McLaughlin is in the roster it's an ADVANTAGE 2020 with POTENTIAL
So I have Rubio and Covington's advantages canceling themselves out and then you have Russell likely being meaningfully better than Teague was and then some smaller stuff here and there. How much better this roster is compared to last year comes down to improvement of young players how the roster fits together etc etc. interestingly the roster in terms of length and size probably isn't that much different than last year. It might be interesting to do a comparison of players from last year to this year in terms of defensive ability or lack thereof. What about 3 point shooting? It's gonna be interesting to watch this team I'm trying not to have much expectations just enjoy the ride. There are plenty of things to consider along the way and I think a few different paths to making this roster a team that we can get at least somewhat excited about for a few years. :)
I'll score the 2019 player compared to the 2020 with either and "ADVANTAGE" To one year or another or "EVEN". If there is a player with "POTENTIAL" for the season and or beyond that will be noted. "VET" Credit for very establish players will be given for a couple spots.
Holdover players:
Towns. If he is healthy he should be at least as good as last year. EVEN
Okogie. Last year we had hope for him to improve meaningfully. I think he did but he didn't blow up. He is a better player than he was a rookie and we can hope he will progress more but it's uncertain. EVEN with POTENTIAL to be better like last year.
Culver. It's not hard to imagine Culver being better at both ends of the floor than his rookie year. At the very least I expect him to be better on defense. ADVANTAGE 2020 with POTENTIAL both this year and beyond. You can argue that the expectations are lower this year than last year so...we'll I'm still giving Culver of 2020 the higher value.
Jake Layman. Another guy if he stays healthy should be expected to be a similar player to what he was the previous year EVEN
Naz Reid was a 2-way player we didn't really know what we were actually getting with him and when he played he looks like he can be an NBA rotation player. ADVANTAGE 2020 because we have seen him play NBA basketball games and he did some positive things POTENTIAL of some sort is there as well
Nowell if he is on the team EVEN if he is on the roster He should be bette than last year actually but I'm not sure he will be here.
New players:
Wiggins vs Beasley I'm going to give Wiggins a bit of an ADVANTAGE 2019 here because of him being a less bad defender and because Beasley is likely to get suspended. The POTENTIAL for Beasley to be more useful for the money is higher though.
Teague Vs Russell. It's ADVANTAGE 2020 here easily with POTENTIAL
Napier vs Rubio. Another ADVANTAGE 2020. I compared these guys because they are advanced stats guys but obviously Rubio being a much better player. Rubio gets the VET designation
Graham vs Edwards Going with Slight ADVANTAGE 2019 in that Graham even though flaws may hurt you less than Edwards. POTENTIAL is obviously waaaaay Way higher for Edwards both this year and beyond.
Bell vs McDaniels Meaningless ADVANTAGE 2019 as I'm not sure Bell is even on a roster this season . Most of us considered him a legit NBA player when we signed him last year. McDaniels has POTENTIAL but we don't know when it will come to fruition.
Vonleh Vs Davis Overall I see this as EVEN Although he had a down year last year Davis is proven Vonleh was more of a potential guy last year. Davis gets a VET distinction
Covington vs Juancho Obvious ADVANTAGE 2019. Covington is also a VET. Juancho represents some sort of POTENTIAL but it's highly unlikely to exceed Covington or even just sold started status which honestly would be a win if Juancho achieved that.
Dieng vs RHJ idk I guess EVEN with a little POTENTIAL for RHJ to become a little more of something and he is just younger.
KBD be Vanderbilt idk EVEN maybe Vanderbilt is POTENTIAL maybe KBD should have an advantage because he actually played some NBA games the previous year. Vanderbilt is still just 21. Not enough to swing the balance at this point I'll stay at EVEN.
If McLaughlin is in the roster it's an ADVANTAGE 2020 with POTENTIAL
So I have Rubio and Covington's advantages canceling themselves out and then you have Russell likely being meaningfully better than Teague was and then some smaller stuff here and there. How much better this roster is compared to last year comes down to improvement of young players how the roster fits together etc etc. interestingly the roster in terms of length and size probably isn't that much different than last year. It might be interesting to do a comparison of players from last year to this year in terms of defensive ability or lack thereof. What about 3 point shooting? It's gonna be interesting to watch this team I'm trying not to have much expectations just enjoy the ride. There are plenty of things to consider along the way and I think a few different paths to making this roster a team that we can get at least somewhat excited about for a few years. :)
Re: Compare 2019 Wolves to 2020 Wolves
I give the advantage to the Wolves this year. I was really down on the Wolves roster last year. Thought it was one of the worst rosters in NBA last year. Just thought outside of Kat nobody scared you on the wolves.
I feel like on this wolves team you have to be scared of Kat, Dlo and Beasley for just going off and changing the game. Feel like Rubio is a game changer for this team and I feel like can make a bigger impact then Cov did. I like Cov but he is a little overrated. He is just an ok on ball defender and he might be one of the most overrated shooters in NBA history. Cov doesn't scare you. He is an elite off ball defender though maybe the best in the NBA.
Just feel like the Wolves have legit X factors in Edwards, Naz and Culver. We'll see what they can bring but those 3 in my opinion determine the ceiling for this team. Hopefully one can pop into a legit starting caliber player.
So in conclusion feel like the Wolves have more top end talent with a tad more X factors in this lineup this year.
I feel like on this wolves team you have to be scared of Kat, Dlo and Beasley for just going off and changing the game. Feel like Rubio is a game changer for this team and I feel like can make a bigger impact then Cov did. I like Cov but he is a little overrated. He is just an ok on ball defender and he might be one of the most overrated shooters in NBA history. Cov doesn't scare you. He is an elite off ball defender though maybe the best in the NBA.
Just feel like the Wolves have legit X factors in Edwards, Naz and Culver. We'll see what they can bring but those 3 in my opinion determine the ceiling for this team. Hopefully one can pop into a legit starting caliber player.
So in conclusion feel like the Wolves have more top end talent with a tad more X factors in this lineup this year.
Re: Compare 2019 Wolves to 2020 Wolves
I see the 5 players I expect Ryan to run out there for the opening tap to be far superior to the team that started last year against the Nets. I don't recall having much excitement about the start of the season last year, and reviewing the starting lineup reminds me why.
2020 Towns vs. 2019 Towns: Same guy, but with one more year of experience and maturity, and more importantly, now paired with an elite distributing PG. Advantage 2020.
Covington vs. who knows: This is the one position that was in better shape at the beginning of 2019, but perhaps not by much. I was a big RoCo fan, but frankly his offensive and rebounding numbers last year were not good...less than the league average on 3-point percentage and only 6 rebounds a game. I would prefer a defensive presence at PF like Davis or RHJ over Juancho, but in any case this is Advantage 2019:
Edwards vs. Graham: I recognize the uncertainty with starting a rookie, but the number 1 pick in the draft is going to be a huge upgrade over a journeyman whose career bests in his 4 years were a sterling 5.3/3.1, combined with what I would deem slightly below average defense. Big Advantage 2020, unless Edwards is the biggest #1 flop since Kwame Brown.
Russell vs Wiggins: Similar players in that I see both as underachievers, but I just looked at Wigs' box score in last year's opener, and I won't be able to eat breakfast for at least a couple hours. It's a microcosm of his career here. And even though I'm not (yet) on the D-Lo train, he has to be a big upgrade over Wig. Advantage 2020.
Rubio vs, Teague: Teague was much maligned by many Wolves fans, but I actually kind of liked him. That said, I much prefer pass-first distributors at PG, and I note Teague's whopping 4 assists in the opener last year. Just one game, you say? Well, Teague only averaged 5 assists for the entire season, compared to almost 9 for Ricky. Ricky also scored better than Teague last year and almost doubled him in rebounding, while also providing better defense. By any measure this is a Huge Advantage 2020.
Bench: Layman, Okogie and Culver are young players who, with the normal progression, should be improved in 2020. More importantly though is the 3-point shooting future felon Malik Beasley can bring if he's not behind bars. If he can be anywhere near his 20.7 PPG on 42.6% 3-point shooting, he wlll be in the running for 6th man of the year. The only bench player from last year I will miss is Gorgui, but I like the additions of Naz and J-Mac, and see our new PFs as an upgrade over Vonleh. Big Advantage 2020.
Rose colored glasses? Perhaps. But evaluating 2020 vs 2019 position by position helps me understand why my excitement level is much higher this year than it was last. I see a Big Advantage at PG and SF, an Advantage at SG, C and bench depth, and a step back only at PF. This year's roster is much stronger than the 2019 version.
2020 Towns vs. 2019 Towns: Same guy, but with one more year of experience and maturity, and more importantly, now paired with an elite distributing PG. Advantage 2020.
Covington vs. who knows: This is the one position that was in better shape at the beginning of 2019, but perhaps not by much. I was a big RoCo fan, but frankly his offensive and rebounding numbers last year were not good...less than the league average on 3-point percentage and only 6 rebounds a game. I would prefer a defensive presence at PF like Davis or RHJ over Juancho, but in any case this is Advantage 2019:
Edwards vs. Graham: I recognize the uncertainty with starting a rookie, but the number 1 pick in the draft is going to be a huge upgrade over a journeyman whose career bests in his 4 years were a sterling 5.3/3.1, combined with what I would deem slightly below average defense. Big Advantage 2020, unless Edwards is the biggest #1 flop since Kwame Brown.
Russell vs Wiggins: Similar players in that I see both as underachievers, but I just looked at Wigs' box score in last year's opener, and I won't be able to eat breakfast for at least a couple hours. It's a microcosm of his career here. And even though I'm not (yet) on the D-Lo train, he has to be a big upgrade over Wig. Advantage 2020.
Rubio vs, Teague: Teague was much maligned by many Wolves fans, but I actually kind of liked him. That said, I much prefer pass-first distributors at PG, and I note Teague's whopping 4 assists in the opener last year. Just one game, you say? Well, Teague only averaged 5 assists for the entire season, compared to almost 9 for Ricky. Ricky also scored better than Teague last year and almost doubled him in rebounding, while also providing better defense. By any measure this is a Huge Advantage 2020.
Bench: Layman, Okogie and Culver are young players who, with the normal progression, should be improved in 2020. More importantly though is the 3-point shooting future felon Malik Beasley can bring if he's not behind bars. If he can be anywhere near his 20.7 PPG on 42.6% 3-point shooting, he wlll be in the running for 6th man of the year. The only bench player from last year I will miss is Gorgui, but I like the additions of Naz and J-Mac, and see our new PFs as an upgrade over Vonleh. Big Advantage 2020.
Rose colored glasses? Perhaps. But evaluating 2020 vs 2019 position by position helps me understand why my excitement level is much higher this year than it was last. I see a Big Advantage at PG and SF, an Advantage at SG, C and bench depth, and a step back only at PF. This year's roster is much stronger than the 2019 version.
Re: Compare 2019 Wolves to 2020 Wolves
FNG wrote:I see the 5 players I expect Ryan to run out there for the opening tap to be far superior to the team that started last year against the Nets. I don't recall having much excitement about the start of the season last year, and reviewing the starting lineup reminds me why.
2020 Towns vs. 2019 Towns: Same guy, but with one more year of experience and maturity, and more importantly, now paired with an elite distributing PG. Advantage 2020.
Covington vs. who knows: This is the one position that was in better shape at the beginning of 2019, but perhaps not by much. I was a big RoCo fan, but frankly his offensive and rebounding numbers last year were not good...less than the league average on 3-point percentage and only 6 rebounds a game. I would prefer a defensive presence at PF like Davis or RHJ over Juancho, but in any case this is Advantage 2019:
Edwards vs. Graham: I recognize the uncertainty with starting a rookie, but the number 1 pick in the draft is going to be a huge upgrade over a journeyman whose career bests in his 4 years were a sterling 5.3/3.1, combined with what I would deem slightly below average defense. Big Advantage 2020, unless Edwards is the biggest #1 flop since Kwame Brown.
Russell vs Wiggins: Similar players in that I see both as underachievers, but I just looked at Wigs' box score in last year's opener, and I won't be able to eat breakfast for at least a couple hours. It's a microcosm of his career here. And even though I'm not (yet) on the D-Lo train, he has to be a big upgrade over Wig. Advantage 2020.
Rubio vs, Teague: Teague was much maligned by many Wolves fans, but I actually kind of liked him. That said, I much prefer pass-first distributors at PG, and I note Teague's whopping 4 assists in the opener last year. Just one game, you say? Well, Teague only averaged 5 assists for the entire season, compared to almost 9 for Ricky. Ricky also scored better than Teague last year and almost doubled him in rebounding, while also providing better defense. By any measure this is a Huge Advantage 2020.
Bench: Layman, Okogie and Culver are young players who, with the normal progression, should be improved in 2020. More importantly though is the 3-point shooting future felon Malik Beasley can bring if he's not behind bars. If he can be anywhere near his 20.7 PPG on 42.6% 3-point shooting, he wlll be in the running for 6th man of the year. The only bench player from last year I will miss is Gorgui, but I like the additions of Naz and J-Mac, and see our new PFs as an upgrade over Vonleh. Big Advantage 2020.
Rose colored glasses? Perhaps. But evaluating 2020 vs 2019 position by position helps me understand why my excitement level is much higher this year than it was last. I see a Big Advantage at PG and SF, an Advantage at SG, C and bench depth, and a step back only at PF. This year's roster is much stronger than the 2019 version.
Wouldn't you say Anthony Bennett is the biggest flop since Kwame? Hell I'd say Kwame was even better than Fultz has been.
I'm not taking KAT or Dlo for granted but I'm most excited to see how Edwards and Rubio perform this season.
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AbeVigodaLive
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- Joined: Thu Jul 11, 2013 12:00 am
Re: Compare 2019 Wolves to 2020 Wolves
I'd hope this season's squad is significantly better.
Because if we moved all that deck furniture -- and we're still a crappy team capable of multiple 10+ game losing streaks -- this franchise should cut its losses, replace everybody and start anew.
Again.
Because if we moved all that deck furniture -- and we're still a crappy team capable of multiple 10+ game losing streaks -- this franchise should cut its losses, replace everybody and start anew.
Again.
Re: Compare 2019 Wolves to 2020 Wolves
AbeVigodaLive wrote:I'd hope this season's squad is significantly better.
Because if we moved all that deck furniture -- and we're still a crappy team capable of multiple 10+ game losing streaks -- this franchise should cut its losses, replace everybody and start anew.
Again.
Does anyone actually rearrange deck furniture? Wait I think I may have posted in the wrong thread. :)
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AbeVigodaLive
- Posts: 10272
- Joined: Thu Jul 11, 2013 12:00 am
Re: Compare 2019 Wolves to 2020 Wolves
monsterpile wrote:AbeVigodaLive wrote:I'd hope this season's squad is significantly better.
Because if we moved all that deck furniture -- and we're still a crappy team capable of multiple 10+ game losing streaks -- this franchise should cut its losses, replace everybody and start anew.
Again.
Does anyone actually rearrange deck furniture? Wait I think I may have posted in the wrong thread. :)
Only on the Titanic/Wolves.
Re: Compare 2019 Wolves to 2020 Wolves
AbeVigodaLive wrote:monsterpile wrote:AbeVigodaLive wrote:I'd hope this season's squad is significantly better.
Because if we moved all that deck furniture -- and we're still a crappy team capable of multiple 10+ game losing streaks -- this franchise should cut its losses, replace everybody and start anew.
Again.
Does anyone actually rearrange deck furniture? Wait I think I may have posted in the wrong thread. :)
Only on the Titanic/Wolves.
Lol Did you know that the Titanic was actually also on fire before it even left port? I just learned that a couple weeks ago. So not only are you referring to the Wolves as a sinking ship but also a VERY expensive dumpster fire. Bravo! Well done.