FNG wrote:I noticed what Monster noticed too...that Moore and normally DLO-critic Robson both were fairly positive about him down the stretch. To Q's point, we don't know that we can rely on DLO being locked in on defense like he was in spurts toward the end of the season. Here's one thing I think we can rely on though...I will conveniently forget about what DLO has shown on defense his entire career, and only consider the final 10 games of this season to convince myself next October that he turned a corner this May and is worthy of a max contract. Yep, I feel another misguided 45-win prediction brewing inside of me...
They mentioned he was really seeing the floor well and passing the ball REALLY well. I found that interesting because I have thought since he was coming out of college that Russell was actually a pretty good passer but it hasn't felt like especially with the Wolves he has really played well as that type of guy. If you get a guy that passes well and can carry your offense as a scorer at times...that's a valuable player even if he kinda sucks on D.
FNG wrote:I noticed what Monster noticed too...that Moore and normally DLO-critic Robson both were fairly positive about him down the stretch. To Q's point, we don't know that we can rely on DLO being locked in on defense like he was in spurts toward the end of the season. Here's one thing I think we can rely on though...I will conveniently forget about what DLO has shown on defense his entire career, and only consider the final 10 games of this season to convince myself next October that he turned a corner this May and is worthy of a max contract. Yep, I feel another misguided 45-win prediction brewing inside of me...
They mentioned he was really seeing the floor well and passing the ball REALLY well. I found that interesting because I have thought since he was coming out of college that Russell was actually a pretty good passer but it hasn't felt like especially with the Wolves he has really played well as that type of guy. If you get a guy that passes well and can carry your offense as a scorer at times...that's a valuable player even if he kinda sucks on D.
I agree, Monster. DLO's passing looked really good at the end of the season. He was also making better decisions with the ball and taking better shots. If he can contribute to play that well on the offensive end next season he'll be a major net positive in spite of his traditionally poor defense. If hIs defense improves, that will be a bonus.
I agree with Cool that the best scenario for the Wolves long term will be McDaniels becoming this team's 3rd best player to compliment Ant and KAT.
May be some continuity will help a bit too (?). We'll begin the season with the same head coach and I think it's very possible we come back starting 4 out of the 5 guys that were starting at the end of the season: DLO, KAT, Edwards, and McDaniels.
Q12543 wrote:May be some continuity will help a bit too (?). We'll begin the season with the same head coach and I think it's very possible we come back starting 4 out of the 5 guys that were starting at the end of the season: DLO, KAT, Edwards, and McDaniels.
Yes, continuity will help. And we shouldn't underestimate the impact of going from Ryan Saunders to Chris Finch. Head coaching clearly matters and going from Ryan to Chris is going from someone who isn't and NBA caliber head coach to a guy who looks like he's a pretty darn good one.
Some of my main takeaways from these playoffs when it comes to the Wolves.
1) Ant needs to become our best player if the Wolves want to win at a consistent level in the playoffs. Ant is the one guy on the team who you can just give the ball to and can score at every level of the basketball court. He is the key to winning at the highest level. He has a long way to go to doing this but he has the potential to do this.
2) Im going to push back a little bit on Lip saying you can contend with a big you build around. Look at this year, the All NBA centers. Jokic out in the 2nd round, Embiid currently losing in game 7 as I type this, Gobert out in the 2nd round as a 1 seed and was exposed in the playoffs once again (I continue to say Gobert is the most overrated player in the NBA), the person who finished 4th in All NBA voting, Bam out in the 1st round. This is a trend over last 10 years with All NBA centers not making the conference finals. Last year was the only outlier season and it was a bubble season. Not saying it is not possible but just think it is hard to win when you build around a big.
3)Okogie will be unplayable in the playoffs. They are going to leave him wide open. Players like Ben Simmons are unable to make a positive impact because they can't shoot at all. We need a better Okogie. (Or Okogie becomes an above average shooter when left wide open)
4) People are going to disagree with me here but I think Dlo value has went up watching the postseason. Teams are struggling scoring in the half court set. This is probably Dlo best asset. I am less worried about our offense in a postseason situation because we in theory will have multiple players who can score in half court sets. Also the Hawks have proven you can hide a terrible defender on D, like the Hawks have done with Tre Young (Obviously Tre is a better offensive player then Tre). I think Dlo would be extremely valuable in postseason play.
Good stuff Kek. I agree with you for the most part. I do think DLO's ability as a 2-level scorer (mostly from 3 and the mid-range) makes him pretty damn valuable offensively. I do think he can be hidden, but we can't have four guys on the roster that need to be hidden between him, Edwards, KAT, and Beasley. I realize he's probably the worst of the bunch, but all these guys need to get better defensively.
The last time this team was above average defensively was when Pek was our starting Center. That's just pathetic.
1. I totally agree with you that Ant needs to become our best player if we're going to be more than a playoff team and actually be considered a contender.
2. I think you're reaching a bit in your push-back on my point that you can build a contender around a big as one of your two or three stars. It's a stretch to suggest that Denver's first round exist had anything to do with Jokic, considering that Denver was without its other star, Murray. Jokic actually made some of those games competitive. Embiid is the main reason the Sixers are in game 7 of the second round. And he's done that on one and a half knees. The Sixers would already be in the Eastern Conference Finals if the team's second star, Simmons, could shoot at all. Miami is out this year, but Bam was a big reason they made the finals last season. Atlanta's very dependent on their bigs - Collins and Capella. One could argue that Collins or Capella is one of their three top players. As for Gobert, I agree he's overrated. He's a shot-blocker and defender and that's it. He's not a scorer or even much of a rebounder. The problem with Utah isn't that one of their top two or three players is a big. The problem with Utah is that they're just not good enough. They don't have two or three stars. They have one star - Donovan Mitchell - and a lot of good or very good role players. That's not enough to advance far in the playoffs.
3. I don't agree that Okogie would be unplayable in the playoffs. He just can't be relied upon as a starter. Otherwise, his defense can be game-changing in spurts and defense matter more in the playoffs than the regular season. His strength, therefore, fits playoff basketball. And I haven't given up hope on Okogie developing a decent corner three. Having said all that that, I'd definitely prefer a better shooting version of Okogie. But our priority has to be acquiring a defensive big. We can still succeed with Okogie as part of our rotation off the bench in a playoff situation.
lipoli390 wrote:Some good points, Kek. My thoughts as follows:
1. I totally agree with you that Ant needs to become our best player if we're going to be more than a playoff team and actually be considered a contender.
2. I think you're reaching a bit in your push-back on my point that you can build a contender around a big as one of your two or three stars. It's a stretch to suggest that Denver's first round exist had anything to do with the Jokic considering that Denvers was without its's other star, Murray. Jokic actually made the some of those games competitive. Embiid is the main reason the Sixers are in game 7 of the second round. And he's done that on one and a half knees. The Sixers would already be in the Eastern Conference Finals if the team's second star, Simmons, could shoot at all. Miami is out this year, but Bam was a big reason they made the finals last season. Atlanta's very dependent on their bigs - Collins and Capella. As for Gobert, I agree he's overrated. He's a shot-blocker and defender and that's it. He's not a scorer or even much of a rebounder. The problem with Utah isn't that one of their top two or three players is a big. The problem with Utah is that they're just not good enough. They don't have two or three stars. They have one star - Donovan Mitchell and a lot of good or very good role players. That's not enough to advance far in the playoffs.
3. I don't agree that Okogie would be unplayable in the playoffs. He just can't be relied upon as a starter. Otherwise, his defense can be game-changing in spurts and defense matter more in the playoffs than the regular season. His strength, therefore, fits playoff basketball. And I haven't given up hope on Okogie developing a decent corner three. Having said all that that, I'd definitely prefer a better shooting version of Okogie. But our priority has to be acquiring a defensive big. We can still succeed with Okogie as part of our rotation off the bench in a playoff situation.
4. I actually agree with your take on DLO.
Lip I'm curious how you say Gobert isn't much of a rebounder.
lipoli390 wrote:Some good points, Kek. My thoughts as follows:
1. I totally agree with you that Ant needs to become our best player if we're going to be more than a playoff team and actually be considered a contender.
2. I think you're reaching a bit in your push-back on my point that you can build a contender around a big as one of your two or three stars. It's a stretch to suggest that Denver's first round exist had anything to do with the Jokic considering that Denvers was without its's other star, Murray. Jokic actually made the some of those games competitive. Embiid is the main reason the Sixers are in game 7 of the second round. And he's done that on one and a half knees. The Sixers would already be in the Eastern Conference Finals if the team's second star, Simmons, could shoot at all. Miami is out this year, but Bam was a big reason they made the finals last season. Atlanta's very dependent on their bigs - Collins and Capella. As for Gobert, I agree he's overrated. He's a shot-blocker and defender and that's it. He's not a scorer or even much of a rebounder. The problem with Utah isn't that one of their top two or three players is a big. The problem with Utah is that they're just not good enough. They don't have two or three stars. They have one star - Donovan Mitchell and a lot of good or very good role players. That's not enough to advance far in the playoffs.
3. I don't agree that Okogie would be unplayable in the playoffs. He just can't be relied upon as a starter. Otherwise, his defense can be game-changing in spurts and defense matter more in the playoffs than the regular season. His strength, therefore, fits playoff basketball. And I haven't given up hope on Okogie developing a decent corner three. Having said all that that, I'd definitely prefer a better shooting version of Okogie. But our priority has to be acquiring a defensive big. We can still succeed with Okogie as part of our rotation off the bench in a playoff situation.
4. I actually agree with your take on DLO.
Lip I'm curious how you say Gobert isn't much of a rebounder.
lipoli390 wrote:Some good points, Kek. My thoughts as follows:
1. I totally agree with you that Ant needs to become our best player if we're going to be more than a playoff team and actually be considered a contender.
2. I think you're reaching a bit in your push-back on my point that you can build a contender around a big as one of your two or three stars. It's a stretch to suggest that Denver's first round exist had anything to do with the Jokic considering that Denvers was without its's other star, Murray. Jokic actually made the some of those games competitive. Embiid is the main reason the Sixers are in game 7 of the second round. And he's done that on one and a half knees. The Sixers would already be in the Eastern Conference Finals if the team's second star, Simmons, could shoot at all. Miami is out this year, but Bam was a big reason they made the finals last season. Atlanta's very dependent on their bigs - Collins and Capella. As for Gobert, I agree he's overrated. He's a shot-blocker and defender and that's it. He's not a scorer or even much of a rebounder. The problem with Utah isn't that one of their top two or three players is a big. The problem with Utah is that they're just not good enough. They don't have two or three stars. They have one star - Donovan Mitchell and a lot of good or very good role players. That's not enough to advance far in the playoffs.
3. I don't agree that Okogie would be unplayable in the playoffs. He just can't be relied upon as a starter. Otherwise, his defense can be game-changing in spurts and defense matter more in the playoffs than the regular season. His strength, therefore, fits playoff basketball. And I haven't given up hope on Okogie developing a decent corner three. Having said all that that, I'd definitely prefer a better shooting version of Okogie. But our priority has to be acquiring a defensive big. We can still succeed with Okogie as part of our rotation off the bench in a playoff situation.
4. I actually agree with your take on DLO.
Lip I'm curious how you say Gobert isn't much of a rebounder.
I have no basis for that claim. :)
Hawks are currently playing Capella Collins and Gallo. Screw playing small. :)
