Kat and Dlo on the block?

[thedoper]

Quite the reach to basically insinuate that trading KAT and D-Lo would lead to a more competitive team in the short-term. I'd say there's a zero-percent chance that Glen Taylor thinks that. Whatever our biases are, it's simply not going to happen any time soon unless the players themselves request a trade.

That may come quicker than expected in my mind. How much more ineptitude can KAT live through? Sure there are points where KAT needs to take more personal responsibility but I cant see how he has been the main problem with this team.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Quite the reach to basically insinuate that trading KAT and D-Lo would lead to a more competitive team in the short-term. I'd say there's a zero-percent chance that Glen Taylor thinks that. Whatever our biases are, it's simply not going to happen any time soon unless the players themselves request a trade.

That may come quicker than expected in my mind. How much more ineptitude can KAT live through? Sure there are points

If I was KAT I would have likely already requested a move. But then again I'm a more aggressive personality than KAT. Anyways, I think that next season is probably live or die for Towns in Minnesota.

[thedoper]

Quite the reach to basically insinuate that trading KAT and D-Lo would lead to a more competitive team in the short-term. I'd say there's a zero-percent chance that Glen Taylor thinks that. Whatever our biases are, it's simply not going to happen any time soon unless the players themselves request a trade.

That may come quicker than expected in my mind. How much more ineptitude can KAT live through? Sure there are points

If I was KAT I would have likely already requested a move. But then again I'm a more aggressive personality than KAT. Anyways, I think that next season is probably live or die for Towns in Minnesota.

Thats how I see it too. Next trade deadline is probably the real point where big change may come.

[Coolbreeze44]

Lip, I fear you are right. It's not what I would do but unfortunately I'm not in control. But it is a downer to acknowledge we are probably stuck on this path.

Is it any more of a downer than trading KAT and another re-rebuild? KAT is going to request out if its not working and we will still get a haul of future assets for him. I personally like watching KAT play basketball, the shitty D and losing have tough, but in all he'd still a really intriguing talent and another piece could even gain some more wins for this team. Im just not sure I have the stomach to start a rebuild again. The pain point for you might come when Rosas admits that the only way he is getting a win now asset is when he's willing to give up Jaden to do it. Id be sad too, but I do think that if either Ant or McDaniels can help give us a legit, top 25 asset in their prime, you do it.

Doper, we are the worst team in the league. I don't care what you call this current situation, but it is a rebuild and that rebuild needs to be fluid to change course as needed. The status quo isn't nearly good enough. And as you know, I have zero confidence in the KAT/DLO pairing unless someone else comes along who is at least as good as KAT is.

[Wolvesfan21]

Lip, I fear you are right. It's not what I would do but unfortunately I'm not in control. But it is a downer to acknowledge we are probably stuck on this path.

Is it any more of a downer than trading KAT and another re-rebuild? KAT is going to request out if its not working and we will still get a haul of future assets for him. I personally like watching KAT play basketball, the shitty D and losing have tough, but in all he'd still a really intriguing talent and another piece could even gain some more wins for this team. Im just not sure I have the stomach to start a rebuild again. The pain point for you might come when Rosas admits that the only way he is getting a win now asset is when he's willing to give up Jaden to do it. Id be sad too, but I do think that if either Ant or McDaniels can help give us a legit, top 25 asset in their prime, you do it.

If we do trade KAT we simply won't be able to compete for another 3-5 years and that is only if the youngest team in the league hits on draft picks which we probably won't even have this year. You're not going to get good young talent back, you're going to rely on picks.

If Ant was more efficient at putting the ball in the hoop I would have more hope, but the odds look slim on that. I guess him becoming a good defender as well. He has time on his side though so anything could happen with his game, he could be an All Star in 3 years.

I like some of our young guys but we simply have to wait years before they are any good, if they ever do.

[Wolvesfan21]

Quite the reach to basically insinuate that trading KAT and D-Lo would lead to a more competitive team in the short-term. I'd say there's a zero-percent chance that Glen Taylor thinks that. Whatever our biases are, it's simply not going to happen any time soon unless the players themselves request a trade.

Also, Evan Massey's not clued in. In reading the comments on his tweets it seems that people are aware of his "throw shit at the wall and see if it sticks" gimmick. He's a clickbait writer who focuses on fake trade rumors and bold prediction storylines. Disregard anything this guy says.

You are guaranteed to get worse by trading KAT and hope to be good in 5 years.

[thedoper]

Lip, I fear you are right. It's not what I would do but unfortunately I'm not in control. But it is a downer to acknowledge we are probably stuck on this path.

Is it any more of a downer than trading KAT and another re-rebuild? KAT is going to request out if its not working and we will still get a haul of future assets for him. I personally like watching KAT play basketball, the shitty D and losing have tough, but in all he'd still a really intriguing talent and another piece could even gain some more wins for this team. Im just not sure I have the stomach to start a rebuild again. The pain point for you might come when Rosas admits that the only way he is getting a win now asset is when he's willing to give up Jaden to do it. Id be sad too, but I do think that if either Ant or McDaniels can help give us a legit, top 25 asset in their prime, you do it.

Doper, we are the worst team in the league. I don't care what you call this current situation, but it is a rebuild and that rebuild needs to be fluid to change course as needed. The status quo isn't nearly good enough. And as you know, I have zero confidence in the KAT/DLO pairing unless someone else comes along who is at least as good as KAT is.

I agree we stink, and the status quo is unacceptable. I don't think the status quo is going to be the route Rosas goes actually. I think he will likely move on one of Ant or Jaden and maybe both to land a third player of value. That could definitely fail too but I think that is where things are at. If he lucks out and gets Cunningham there may be more of an impetus to somewhat stand pat, but that would also give him another out to move Ant. I personally really like Ant and Jaden and wish we had more wins this year to give us all more confidence that their youth could integrate with KAT and DLo. DLo has warts and to this point hasn't done anything positive for this franchise but I think moving him for nothing would only further solidify a directionless ship manned by Rosas. I can't see any scenario where he admits defeat without a tangible amount of games of his vision of Kat and Dlo playing together.

[FNG]

I don't disagree with you guys about what Rosas wants. But we're kidding ourselves if we assign too much importance to that. This is Glen's franchise, and good or bad (mostly bad it seems) his fingerprints are going to be on every decision the Wolves make. To understand this, you only have to ask yourself this...was Ryan Saunders Rosas's first choice to coach? Of course not! We all know he wanted Finch all along, and could only get Glen to pull the trigger after a year of losing big. Three things we have to know about Glen: 1) He loves basketball and thinks he is quite knowledgeable, 2) he loves this franchise and despises losing and 3) he is a very hands-on manager in every enterprise he is involved in. POBO's are interchangeable in Glen's eyes, as demonstrated by having had 11 of them in our short history! Glen's POBO is there to bring him ideas which he may approve of, but also to act out on ideas that Glen brings him. So knowing this about Glen, why would he allow Rosas more rope if the KAT/DLO duo doesn't significantly improve this team?

Look, I don't know Massey either, and I'm not sure what Kek means about him having the blue checkmark...maybe that means he has a good reputation and is connected. But I'm guessing he's tuned into the NBA and Glen's reputation enough to know Glen is not patient with losing. Anyone who changes GMs and coaches (14 in the team's history!) as often as many change their toothbrush is not going to sit idly by if he thinks his max players are not the guys to turn this franchise around. So maybe Massey is connected enough to have heard Glen is talking to other owners about moving KAT and DLO (I suspect this is the case), or maybe he is just guessing based on Glen's hair trigger when it comes to moving out of what he surmises to be a losing situation. He also knows it's not likely Glen is going to go into the luxury tax by bringing in another big contract to supplement his two max guys if he doesn't think they are clicking. DLO and KAT may play together another 22 games this season assuming DLO comes back Monday against the Kings (with me ecstatic to be back in the arena in section 136!). If they don't win at least 11 of those, history (and maybe Massey) tells me that Glen will be looking to make a move involving DLO and/or KAT. My hope is that they do win those 11+ games and prove the DLO naysayers here (like me) wrong, but my guess is that we are seeing DLO's last weeks in a Timberwolves uniform.

Glen must really hate himself if he despised losing. He's been pretty slow to make changes in the face of horrible losing cultures in the past. He's overseen the worst franchise record-wise in sports. Id say hes really embraced losing. I think Glen's view of winning is more in the perceived value of his investment than in our wins and losses.

Doper, I agree that Glen looks at turning a $90 million investment into close to a billion dollars as a win...wouldn't we all? But he could watch his money grow jetting around on his private plane or from the beach in Monaco. But instead he chooses to drive up from Mankato in the dead of winter to every home game when most of us would probably be taking occasional breaks from the cold. Why? Because he loves the game and, no different than us but even more so, desperately wants this team to win. And he gets involved in every decision because it's his team and he (incorrectly in my view) thinks he knows what is best for his team. I suspect he let Rosas talk him into the DLO trade, but he also knows they need to give it a chance to see if Rosas was right. But we have all seen that Glen is a "short leash" guy, so 22 games is all a guy like him needs to evaluate a situation. Maybe Glen has mellowed as he approaches 80 next month and won't be as quick on the draw as he has been in the past, but I doubt it. If you want to know how a guy is going to act, look at his past actions, not at how you want him to act.

And believe me, I get the unhappiness here about another rebuild. But to Cool's point, what do we call what we have now? 11-36 has got to be a rebuild, right? Why not at least continue the rebuild with young players who are fun to watch -like McDaniel, Vando, Reid and Nowell and whatever KAT and DLO can bring back in trade (I agree with Doper that KAT is a unique talent, but wasn't that at least a little bit telling last week when an allegedly immature McDaniel had to admonish him on the court for whining about a call rather than getting back on defense?). Again, if DLO turns out to be worth his max contract and pairs with KAT to turn this franchise around, I'll be singing his praises and talking about keeping him from ever leaving town. But I don't expect him to change his spots overnight and become a positive player on the court, so I will continue to think Glen will be looking at some big changes if we don't finish the season really strong. And frankly, I'll be really pissed if he doesn't.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

In what way is Glen Taylor a "short leash" guy? I think there's a much better argument for him being the exact opposite in that he often waits too long to make a certain move.

[thedoper]

I don't disagree with you guys about what Rosas wants. But we're kidding ourselves if we assign too much importance to that. This is Glen's franchise, and good or bad (mostly bad it seems) his fingerprints are going to be on every decision the Wolves make. To understand this, you only have to ask yourself this...was Ryan Saunders Rosas's first choice to coach? Of course not! We all know he wanted Finch all along, and could only get Glen to pull the trigger after a year of losing big. Three things we have to know about Glen: 1) He loves basketball and thinks he is quite knowledgeable, 2) he loves this franchise and despises losing and 3) he is a very hands-on manager in every enterprise he is involved in. POBO's are interchangeable in Glen's eyes, as demonstrated by having had 11 of them in our short history! Glen's POBO is there to bring him ideas which he may approve of, but also to act out on ideas that Glen brings him. So knowing this about Glen, why would he allow Rosas more rope if the KAT/DLO duo doesn't significantly improve this team?

Look, I don't know Massey either, and I'm not sure what Kek means about him having the blue checkmark...maybe that means he has a good reputation and is connected. But I'm guessing he's tuned into the NBA and Glen's reputation enough to know Glen is not patient with losing. Anyone who changes GMs and coaches (14 in the team's history!) as often as many change their toothbrush is not going to sit idly by if he thinks his max players are not the guys to turn this franchise around. So maybe Massey is connected enough to have heard Glen is talking to other owners about moving KAT and DLO (I suspect this is the case), or maybe he is just guessing based on Glen's hair trigger when it comes to moving out of what he surmises to be a losing situation. He also knows it's not likely Glen is going to go into the luxury tax by bringing in another big contract to supplement his two max guys if he doesn't think they are clicking. DLO and KAT may play together another 22 games this season assuming DLO comes back Monday against the Kings (with me ecstatic to be back in the arena in section 136!). If they don't win at least 11 of those, history (and maybe Massey) tells me that Glen will be looking to make a move involving DLO and/or KAT. My hope is that they do win those 11+ games and prove the DLO naysayers here (like me) wrong, but my guess is that we are seeing DLO's last weeks in a Timberwolves uniform.

Glen must really hate himself if he despised losing. He's been pretty slow to make changes in the face of horrible losing cultures in the past. He's overseen the worst franchise record-wise in sports. Id say hes really embraced losing. I think Glen's view of winning is more in the perceived value of his investment than in our wins and losses.

Doper, I agree that Glen looks at turning a $90 million investment into close to a billion dollars as a win...wouldn't we all? But he could watch his money grow jetting around on his private plane or from the beach in Monaco. But instead he chooses to drive up from Mankato in the dead of winter to every home game when most of us would probably be taking occasional breaks from the cold. Why? Because he loves the game and, no different than us but even more so, desperately wants this team to win. And he gets involved in every decision because it's his team and he (incorrectly in my view) thinks he knows what is best for his team. I suspect he let Rosas talk him into the DLO trade, but he also knows they need to give it a chance to see if Rosas was right. But we have all seen that Glen is a "short leash" guy, so 22 games is all a guy like him needs to evaluate a situation. Maybe Glen has mellowed as he approaches 80 next month and won't be as quick on the draw as he has been in the past, but I doubt it. If you want to know how a guy is going to act, look at his past actions, not at how you want him to act.

And believe me, I get the unhappiness here about another rebuild. But to Cool's point, what do we call what we have now? 11-36 has got to be a rebuild, right? Why not at least continue the rebuild with young players who are fun to watch -like McDaniel, Vando, Reid and Nowell and whatever KAT and DLO can bring back in trade (I agree with Doper that KAT is a unique talent, but wasn't that at least a little bit telling last week when an allegedly immature McDaniel had to admonish him on the court for whining about a call rather than getting back on defense?). Again, if DLO turns out to be worth his max contract and pairs with KAT to turn this franchise around, I'll be singing his praises and talking about keeping him from ever leaving town. But I don't expect him to change his spots overnight and become a positive player on the court, so I will continue to think Glen will be looking at some big changes if we don't finish the season really strong. And frankly, I'll be really pissed if he doesn't.

I don't get the short leash perspective personally. David Kahn made it through the full duration of his contract (minus a team option on an extension) when everyone in the known basketball universe rightfully claimed he was a joke. Mchale stayed many years beyond his peak. Flip died which definitely caused some chaos. The only one who got fired was Thibs, and this was because of an untenable management structure that Taylor created of the dual role POBO/coach.

Two of the three main people in the POBO role overstayed their welcome. I assume that Rosas isn't going to be different.