The Thibs Effect

Any And All Things T-Wolves Related
User avatar
Q12543 [enjin:6621299]
Posts: 13844
Joined: Thu Jul 11, 2013 12:00 am

Re: The Thibs Effect

Post by Q12543 [enjin:6621299] »

monsterpile wrote:I'm not sure how bad Wiggins was the 2nd half of the season but the searing image of him for a chunk of the season (and some of his rookie season) was him sorta running into a screen and looking like a video game character that hit the edge of the boarder of the video game world and can't go anywhere and looked udderly helpless. Bazz was pretty bad also but Wiggins just looked so helpless at times it was sad and the effort...it was like he just gave up.

To me a HUGE part of fighting through screens is doing work to stay connected to your guy because you can easily get through screens that aren't good enough by just sliding past them. You also can create offensive fouls this way because the screener has to basically slide into you to set the screen. It's not always possible to stick that close but a lot of players at any level don't do this and it's surprising how well it can work. Rubio was doing this more as the season went on and it was a big reason for his success as a defender. Tyus putting pressure on ball handlers helped him in this aspect as well. This is the type of stuff Jim Pete is referring to when he says the true but cliche "be hard to play against" line.


Yes, this! And frankly, none of our guys are great at it, including Rubio at times.

By the way, this applies to the other side as well. One of the nuances of the game that LaVine struggles with is knowing how to use a high ball screen. I can't tell you how often he jumped the gun on those things and went too early or too wide, thus allowing his guy to easily navigate over the top of the screen.
User avatar
Monster
Posts: 24088
Joined: Sun Jul 07, 2013 12:00 am

Re: The Thibs Effect

Post by Monster »

Rocket2961 wrote:Steve Aschburner ?@AschNBA 18h18 hours ago
@BreakTheHuddle @TwolvesBlog @brittrobson Had a close coaching cohort of Thibs tell me this month: "RR not his kind of PG." Cuz shooting.
5 retweets 2 likes
Reply Retweet 5

a reply to a brittrobson tweet


Thanks for posting this. I'm a Rubio guy so I am biased and I am not completely dismissing this but what coach out there (other than Jason Kidd lol) is like damn I gotta get me a sweet poor shooting PG? Pretty much anyone is gonna have some reservations about Rubio that's perfectly healthy. If Thibs is actually a really good coach he will figure out how to get the best out of Rubio and other players not just be like "oh that guy doesn't fit in my box of players I like so let's move on." I'm perfectly fine if they decide to draft a guy that could end up taking over from Rubio but I don't think that means they gotta move Rubio either. Make sure that young guy is actually up to the task first.
User avatar
Monster
Posts: 24088
Joined: Sun Jul 07, 2013 12:00 am

Re: The Thibs Effect

Post by Monster »

Q12543 wrote:
monsterpile wrote:I'm not sure how bad Wiggins was the 2nd half of the season but the searing image of him for a chunk of the season (and some of his rookie season) was him sorta running into a screen and looking like a video game character that hit the edge of the boarder of the video game world and can't go anywhere and looked udderly helpless. Bazz was pretty bad also but Wiggins just looked so helpless at times it was sad and the effort...it was like he just gave up.

To me a HUGE part of fighting through screens is doing work to stay connected to your guy because you can easily get through screens that aren't good enough by just sliding past them. You also can create offensive fouls this way because the screener has to basically slide into you to set the screen. It's not always possible to stick that close but a lot of players at any level don't do this and it's surprising how well it can work. Rubio was doing this more as the season went on and it was a big reason for his success as a defender. Tyus putting pressure on ball handlers helped him in this aspect as well. This is the type of stuff Jim Pete is referring to when he says the true but cliche "be hard to play against" line.


Yes, this! And frankly, none of our guys are great at it, including Rubio at times.

By the way, this applies to the other side as well. One of the nuances of the game that LaVine struggles with is knowing how to use a high ball screen. I can't tell you how often he jumped the gun on those things and went too early or too wide, thus allowing his guy to easily navigate over the top of the screen.


That's true and a great point but I will say it looked like he improved Some in that area especially working with Dieng. It's still something he needs to work on. It's all feel for the game and decision making etc for Lavine but he certainly made some big strides last year.
User avatar
longstrangetrip [enjin:6600564]
Posts: 9432
Joined: Tue Jul 09, 2013 12:00 am

Re: The Thibs Effect

Post by longstrangetrip [enjin:6600564] »

Rocket2961 wrote:Steve Aschburner ?@AschNBA 18h18 hours ago
@BreakTheHuddle @TwolvesBlog @brittrobson Had a close coaching cohort of Thibs tell me this month: "RR not his kind of PG." Cuz shooting.
5 retweets 2 likes
Reply Retweet 5

a reply to a brittrobson tweet


Hmm...who knows if the cohort of Thibs is a reliable source or not, but I still found this troubling. Robson is lobbying hard for Ricky in the past 24 hours by listing players who had a lower TS% than him last year: So far he's listed Kobe Bryant, John Wall, Dwayne Wade, Danny Green, Dennis Schroeder, Derrick Rose, Marco Bellinelli, Kurt Heinrich, Monta Ellis, Steve Blake, Aaron Brooks, Corey Joseph and Dion Waiters. Pretty impressive list, including some who are known as shooters. With everything else that Ricky adds in running the point and playing D, I have a difficult time finding this cohort of Thibs credible.

Robson also tweets that Lavine, Rubio, Wiggins and Bazz all hit more than 40% of their corner treys last year, although the Wolves were last in the league in corner trey attempts. I hope that is an indictment of Mitchell, and not just an inability of the Wolves' players to execute. We'll find out this year, because Thibs is a vocal advocate of threes from the corner.
User avatar
Phenom
Posts: 3297
Joined: Fri Jul 12, 2013 12:00 am

Re: The Thibs Effect

Post by Phenom »

So this roster was supposed to be the most desirable roster to be available in some years that Thibs has been pining for and now he is going to come in and gut it? I am buying that for sure. He is willing to unload LaVine who was a difference maker when he was finally put in the starting lineup? He wants to move Rubio who statistically elevates each member of the roster that he wanted so badly? It all makes sense now.
User avatar
Lipoli390
Posts: 16263
Joined: Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:00 am

Re: The Thibs Effect

Post by Lipoli390 »

Phenom's_Revenge wrote:So this roster was supposed to be the most desirable roster to be available in some years that Thibs has been pining for and now he is going to come in and gut it? I am buying that for sure. He is willing to unload LaVine who was a difference maker when he was finally put in the starting lineup? He wants to move Rubio who statistically elevates each member of the roster that he wanted so badly? It all makes sense now.


Well said, Phenom! Thibs called this the best young roster in the NBA. I doubt he was referring solely to KAT and Wiggins. And he's mentioned LaVine, Bazz, Gorgui and Rubio when praising that roster. It makes no sense that he'd be looking to move any of these guys right away without coaching them for at least half a season or more.

We hired Thibs because he is supposedly one of the best head coaches in the League -- maybe top 2 or 3. He's replacing a guy who can't get a head coaching job anywhere else in the League. So we should expect Thibs to dramatically elevate what we get out of the players we have above and beyond the natural maturation and improvement they'd make anyway by working on their games this summer. Moreover, Thibs has said that you coach to the strengths of your roster. That's what the best coaches do. They adapt and get the most out of what they have.

According to Thibs what he has is the best young roster in the NBA. One member of that roster is a PG who is happens to be one of the best at his position as a rebounder, defender and playmaker. He's also a fierce competitor and great teammate -- which makes him Thibs kind of guy. And there can be no debate that Ricky statistically elevates the play of his teammates. So unless Thibs isn't nearly as smart as his reputation suggests, I think he'll stick with Ricky and the rest of our our young core at least until the Feb trade deadline unless he gets an offer that blows him away.
User avatar
TRKO [enjin:12664595]
Posts: 1175
Joined: Sun Feb 01, 2015 12:00 am

Re: The Thibs Effect

Post by TRKO [enjin:12664595] »

Even if Thibs isn't a Rubio guy, it makes zero sense to deal him now. Maybe draft Dunn and make him earn it over Rubio. I think dealing Rubio is foolish unless you have an offer too good to pass up on the other end.
User avatar
BizarroJerry [enjin:6592520]
Posts: 3290
Joined: Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:00 am

Re: The Thibs Effect

Post by BizarroJerry [enjin:6592520] »

Let's not jump to conclusions on any of these tweets quite yet. I think he'll play out the season with our current roster + draft pick and bench free agent.
User avatar
TeamRicky [enjin:6648771]
Posts: 2736
Joined: Sat Jul 13, 2013 12:00 am

Re: The Thibs Effect

Post by TeamRicky [enjin:6648771] »

This is double hearsay. A lot can get lost in translation or the so called Cohort or the Tweeter may have their own agenda. So I'll take Thibs at face value when he complimented Ricky and said he's very valuable. We deal with this every offseason and Ricky is still on our club and I'm glad about that.
User avatar
thedoper
Posts: 11008
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2013 12:00 am

Re: The Thibs Effect

Post by thedoper »

A smart team being built around Wiggins and Towns is fine as far as I am concerned. There are better complimentary pieces out there than the ones we have. A PG that can't shoot and a high flying 6th man are not the hills I would die on if I was rallying against Thibs. He wasnt my first choice either but we consistently get carried away with overvaluing this roster.
Post Reply