Wolves offseason thread

[AbeVigodaLive]

The team was 37 - 22 (63%... 52-win pace) with Butler and Towns in the lineup. Considering the team hadn't made the playoffs for 13 years... nor even had a winning record for 12 years... I can't agree that it was NOT working.

Or that Thibs should have been fired after the 2018 season.



[Note: Retool/rebuild... after one winning season out of 14? Yikes. Personally, I expect more from the local NBA franchise.]

[kekgeek]

The team was 37 - 22 (63%... 52-win pace) with Butler and Towns in the lineup. Considering the team hadn't made the playoffs for 13 years... nor even had a winning record for 12 years... I can't agree that it was NOT working.

Or that Thibs should have been fired after the 2018 season.



[Note: Retool/rebuild... after one winning season out of 14? Yikes. Personally, I expect more from the local NBA franchise.]

Yep. Also people talk about the wolves sneaking in (what they did) but going into that night wolves could of been the 4th seed. Also only 2 games out of the 3 seed. How much would of the narrative changed if the other games fell in the wolves favor

[Wolvesfan21]

The team was 37 - 22 (63%... 52-win pace) with Butler and Towns in the lineup. Considering the team hadn't made the playoffs for 13 years... nor even had a winning record for 12 years... I can't agree that it was NOT working.

Or that Thibs should have been fired after the 2018 season.



[Note: Retool/rebuild... after one winning season out of 14? Yikes. Personally, I expect more from the local NBA franchise.]

Yet they almost missed the playoffs after Butler missed his usual amount of games. Maybe that coincided with Butler sleeping with KAT's girl which sounds plausible as something Butler would do. I seem to remember KAT's game absolutely tanking, especially in the playoffs.

Wether that is true or not, things were not working in the end between them. Which is why Butler decided to late in the summer ask for a trade. Maybe he said it's with me or them (Kat and Wiggins), you pick. I really don't know. Thibs should have, Glen should have had some knowledge of what was going on.

If Thibs was even remotely proactive he would have moved on from Butler sooner, same with Taylor and firing Thibs.

[AbeVigodaLive]

The team was 37 - 22 (63%... 52-win pace) with Butler and Towns in the lineup. Considering the team hadn't made the playoffs for 13 years... nor even had a winning record for 12 years... I can't agree that it was NOT working.

Or that Thibs should have been fired after the 2018 season.



[Note: Retool/rebuild... after one winning season out of 14? Yikes. Personally, I expect more from the local NBA franchise.]

Yep. Also people talk about the wolves sneaking in (what they did) but going into that night wolves could of been the 4th seed. Also only 2 games out of the 3 seed. How much would of the narrative changed if the other games fell in the wolves favor

The Wolves played without Butler down the stretch... which obviously hurt the overall record a bit.

They also won 5 of the final 7 games, including a winner-take-all game #82... so it's not like they sneaked in through a backdoor either.

[AbeVigodaLive]

The team was 37 - 22 (63%... 52-win pace) with Butler and Towns in the lineup. Considering the team hadn't made the playoffs for 13 years... nor even had a winning record for 12 years... I can't agree that it was NOT working.

Or that Thibs should have been fired after the 2018 season.



[Note: Retool/rebuild... after one winning season out of 14? Yikes. Personally, I expect more from the local NBA franchise.]

Yet they almost missed the playoffs after Butler missed his usual amount of games. Maybe that coincided with Butler sleeping with KAT's girl which sounds plausible as something Butler would do. I seem to remember KAT's game absolutely tanking, especially in the playoffs.

Wether that is true or not, things were not working in the end between them. Which is why Butler decided to late in the summer ask for a trade. Maybe he said it's with me or them (Kat and Wiggins), you pick. I really don't know. Thibs should have, Glen should have had some knowledge of what was going on.

If Thibs was even remotely proactive he would have moved on from Butler sooner, same with Taylor and firing Thibs.

Sure. When Butler announced he wanted out... sure. Thibs lost me for good when he let Butler highjack the team and hold it hostage... while completely throwing the two young players (ironically/coincidentally/conveniently making more money than him) under the bus.

That's when Thibs should have been fired.

But it seemed like you (and others at the time) were advocating for firing Thibs just because the 47 - 35 season wasn't good enough. Those are two entirely things for me.

[Wolvesfan21]

The team was 37 - 22 (63%... 52-win pace) with Butler and Towns in the lineup. Considering the team hadn't made the playoffs for 13 years... nor even had a winning record for 12 years... I can't agree that it was NOT working.

Or that Thibs should have been fired after the 2018 season.



[Note: Retool/rebuild... after one winning season out of 14? Yikes. Personally, I expect more from the local NBA franchise.]

Yet they almost missed the playoffs after Butler missed his usual amount of games. Maybe that coincided with Butler sleeping with KAT's girl which sounds plausible as something Butler would do. I seem to remember KAT's game absolutely tanking, especially in the playoffs.

Wether that is true or not, things were not working in the end between them. Which is why Butler decided to late in the summer ask for a trade. Maybe he said it's with me or them (Kat and Wiggins), you pick. I really don't know. Thibs should have, Glen should have had some knowledge of what was going on.

If Thibs was even remotely proactive he would have moved on from Butler sooner, same with Taylor and firing Thibs.

Sure. When Butler announced he wanted out... sure. Thibs lost me for good when he let Butler highjack the team and hold it hostage... while completely throwing the two young players (ironically/coincidentally/conveniently making more money than him) under the bus.

That's when Thibs should have been fired.

But it seemed like you (and others at the time) were advocating for firing Thibs just because the 47 - 35 season wasn't good enough. Those are two entirely things for me.

Yes and no. The season wasn't good enough in that the combination of Thibs, Butler, KAT Wiggins wasn't ever going to be a championship team. Because for the reasons I mentioned before, Butler was going to be traded or let go (after the next season) for one. Taylor wasn't going to start paying LUX tax based on his history. The other contracts Thibs had put the team with limited the near term upside. I didn't see any path to how they were going to win it all with that group. So in the end, my feeling was to retool then. Thibs had enough of a track record of far too many poor decisions and with the lack of any progress of Wiggins, I just saw no chance.

Butler still had nice value with a year left on his contract, so some team would bring him in where they could resign him. Another thing, if Butler was going to be given a max extension, it would have been offered by then. It wasn't, proving that Taylor wouldn't spend the tens of millions or whatever to hang onto Butler with all these other big contracts already on the books.

I didn't think it was likely in any way that Thibs was on a path to contend. So that was basically my reason for wanting him fired.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Yes and no. The season wasn't good enough in that the combination of Thibs, Butler, KAT Wiggins wasn't ever going to be a championship team. Because for the reasons I mentioned before, Butler was going to be traded or let go (after the next season) for one. Taylor wasn't going to start paying LUX tax based on his history. The other contracts Thibs had put the team with limited the near term upside. I didn't see any path to how they were going to win it all with that group. So in the end, my feeling was to retool then. Thibs had enough of a track record of far too many poor decisions and with the lack of any progress of Wiggins, I just saw no chance.

Butler still had nice value with a year left on his contract, so some team would bring him in where they could resign him. Another thing, if Butler was going to be given a max extension, it would have been offered by then. It wasn't, proving that Taylor wouldn't spend the tens of millions or whatever to hang onto Butler with all these other big contracts already on the books.

I didn't think it was likely in any way that Thibs was on a path to contend. So that was basically my reason for wanting him fired.

Actually, Jimmy Butler declined a four-year, $110 million extension while he was in Minnesota, but that was always going to be the case as he stood to make exponentially more money by becoming a free agent and then signing a max contract. He was eligible for the full five-year, $190 million contract if he just waited, which is what he did.

As we know now, Philadelphia offered that exact deal and Butler decided to head to South Beach instead for four-years, $142 million. Just to reiterate, that extension was always going to be declined.

[mjs34]

Sure. When Butler announced he wanted out... sure. Thibs lost me for good when he let Butler highjack the team and hold it hostage... while completely throwing the two young players (ironically/coincidentally/conveniently making more money than him) under the bus.

That's when Thibs should have been fired.

But it seemed like you (and others at the time) were advocating for firing Thibs just because the 47 - 35 season wasn't good enough. Those are two entirely things for me.

Yes and no. The season wasn't good enough in that the combination of Thibs, Butler, KAT Wiggins wasn't ever going to be a championship team. Because for the reasons I mentioned before, Butler was going to be traded or let go (after the next season) for one. Taylor wasn't going to start paying LUX tax based on his history. The other contracts Thibs had put the team with limited the near term upside. I didn't see any path to how they were going to win it all with that group. So in the end, my feeling was to retool then. Thibs had enough of a track record of far too many poor decisions and with the lack of any progress of Wiggins, I just saw no chance.

Butler still had nice value with a year left on his contract, so some team would bring him in where they could resign him. Another thing, if Butler was going to be given a max extension, it would have been offered by then. It wasn't, proving that Taylor wouldn't spend the tens of millions or whatever to hang onto Butler with all these other big contracts already on the books.

I didn't think it was likely in any way that Thibs was on a path to contend. So that was basically my reason for wanting him fired.

[AbeVigodaLive]

The team was 37 - 22 (63%... 52-win pace) with Butler and Towns in the lineup. Considering the team hadn't made the playoffs for 13 years... nor even had a winning record for 12 years... I can't agree that it was NOT working.

Or that Thibs should have been fired after the 2018 season.



[Note: Retool/rebuild... after one winning season out of 14? Yikes. Personally, I expect more from the local NBA franchise.]

Yet they almost missed the playoffs after Butler missed his usual amount of games. Maybe that coincided with Butler sleeping with KAT's girl which sounds plausible as something Butler would do. I seem to remember KAT's game absolutely tanking, especially in the playoffs.

Wether that is true or not, things were not working in the end between them. Which is why Butler decided to late in the summer ask for a trade. Maybe he said it's with me or them (Kat and Wiggins), you pick. I really don't know. Thibs should have, Glen should have had some knowledge of what was going on.

If Thibs was even remotely proactive he would have moved on from Butler sooner, same with Taylor and firing Thibs.

Sure. When Butler announced he wanted out... sure. Thibs lost me for good when he let Butler highjack the team and hold it hostage... while completely throwing the two young players (ironically/coincidentally/conveniently making more money than him) under the bus.

That's when Thibs should have been fired.

But it seemed like you (and others at the time) were advocating for firing Thibs just because the 47 - 35 season wasn't good enough. Those are two entirely things for me.

Yes and no. The season wasn't good enough in that the combination of Thibs, Butler, KAT Wiggins wasn't ever going to be a championship team. Because for the reasons I mentioned before, Butler was going to be traded or let go (after the next season) for one. Taylor wasn't going to start paying LUX tax based on his history. The other contracts Thibs had put the team with limited the near term upside. I didn't see any path to how they were going to win it all with that group. So in the end, my feeling was to retool then. Thibs had enough of a track record of far too many poor decisions and with the lack of any progress of Wiggins, I just saw no chance.
.

The Wolves were nearly the worst organization in all of sports when it comes to making the playoffs, and definitely in the NBA.

Championships?

The Wolves have been near a championship only 1 time in 30+ years. And even then, they might only have been the 4th best team in the league. With a 13-season playoff drought... I don't give a shit about championships. Just give me meaningful games. Just give me a glimmer of legit hope. Just give me more wins than losses.

The championship or bust angle is great for national pundits and tv rabble rousers. Or teams with LeBron James. Or teams in high-profile locations where superstar FAs want to play. The championship angle was a dead issue in 2017 with the Timberwolves. There's real value in trying to be the next Utah or Portland or Memphis... etc.

And it's entirely more realistic.

[Wolvesfan21]

Yes and no. The season wasn't good enough in that the combination of Thibs, Butler, KAT Wiggins wasn't ever going to be a championship team. Because for the reasons I mentioned before, Butler was going to be traded or let go (after the next season) for one. Taylor wasn't going to start paying LUX tax based on his history. The other contracts Thibs had put the team with limited the near term upside. I didn't see any path to how they were going to win it all with that group. So in the end, my feeling was to retool then. Thibs had enough of a track record of far too many poor decisions and with the lack of any progress of Wiggins, I just saw no chance.

Butler still had nice value with a year left on his contract, so some team would bring him in where they could resign him. Another thing, if Butler was going to be given a max extension, it would have been offered by then. It wasn't, proving that Taylor wouldn't spend the tens of millions or whatever to hang onto Butler with all these other big contracts already on the books.

I didn't think it was likely in any way that Thibs was on a path to contend. So that was basically my reason for wanting him fired.

Actually, Jimmy Butler declined a four-year, $110 million extension while he was in Minnesota, but that was always going to be the case as he stood to make exponentially more money by becoming a free agent and then signing a max contract. He was eligible for the full five-year, $190 million contract if he just waited, which is what he did.

As we know now, Philadelphia offered that exact deal and Butler decided to head to South Beach instead for four-years, $142 million. Just to reiterate, that extension was always going to be declined.

Oh yeah that right, I forgot about that, where he couldn't sign for max ahead of time. I was thinking of how reportedly Butler was angry that both KAT and Wiggins made more then him, Or that Wiggins made max money, which limited his available money. It could have been that Wiggins was terrible and making max money and in no way can you win a championship with a sunk cost like that. Probably more that he knew he had to get out of MN to get his own big money. Which again, just riding him for one more season wouldn't bring a contender to MN. I don't see in any way they would have beaten both Houston and GSW that season. After that, Butler is gone. Then you are left with less assets then before.