Thibs Comments

[AbeVigodaLive]

One thing that may/may not be important to some teams...

Beasley has been a rotation player for three different playoff teams. Muhammad has been a rotation player for losing teams. In fact, in each of his seasons... the more he's played... the more the team has lost.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

One thing that may/may not be important to some teams...

Beasley has been a rotation player for three different playoff teams. Muhammad has been a rotation player for losing teams. In fact, in each of his seasons... the more he's played... the more the team has lost.

As you like to say....To be fair, who were their team mates? And how did Beasley's team do when he played for Minnesota? How did Javale McGee look with Golden State vs. his prior teams where he was a perennial Shaqtin' the Fool superstar?

It's amazing how once you establish a core of really good players you can plug in any number of different guys and make them look a whole lot better.....

While Shabazz's box score stats have been pretty stagnant, look at his Defensive Rating over his career (this is the real Defensive Rating that measures points per 100 possessions given up while on the floor, not the B-ball Reference D-rating, which is an effed up stat):

Rookie - 112.2
2nd year - 110.4
3rd year - 108.8
4th year - 106.8

The team as a whole has been absolutely awful defensively, especially the last three years, yet his numbers keep improving. How much of that is him and how much of it is in the way he's used and the guys he's on the floor with? Last year, Bjelica was the only regular rotation player with a better D-Rating, so me thinks Shabazz has made some legit strides in this area.

[AbeVigodaLive]

One thing that may/may not be important to some teams...

Beasley has been a rotation player for three different playoff teams. Muhammad has been a rotation player for losing teams. In fact, in each of his seasons... the more he's played... the more the team has lost.

As you like to say....To be fair, who were their team mates? And how did Beasley's team do when he played for Minnesota? How did Javale McGee look with Golden State vs. his prior teams where he was a perennial Shaqtin' the Fool superstar?

It's amazing how once you establish a core of really good players you can plug in any number of different guys and make them look a whole lot better.....

While Shabazz's box score stats have been pretty stagnant, look at his Defensive Rating over his career (this is the real Defensive Rating that measures points per 100 possessions given up while on the floor, not the B-ball Reference D-rating, which is an effed up stat):

Rookie - 112.2
2nd year - 110.4
3rd year - 108.8
4th year - 106.8

The team as a whole has been absolutely awful defensively, especially the last three years, yet his numbers keep improving. How much of that is him and how much of it is in the way he's used and the guys he's on the floor with? Last year, Bjelica was the only regular rotation player with a better D-Rating, so me thinks Shabazz has made some legit strides in this area.

And that's the kind of stuff teams will look at. To be fair, that's why I wrote "may/may not" in the post above. I don't have easy access to all the stats, VUE stuff and analytical data. Or, the brainpower to scout as well as the pros.

Personally, the two guys are among a handful of my most hated Wolves (to watch) in the team's inglorious history.

I don't think either is a bad player. Both have proven they can get hot and win a game your team wasn't supposed to win. And that's basically their jobs. You take the good with the bad with guys like this. And that's why I think it's a fair comp when we're looking at what the financial marketplace might look like for Muhammad.



[Note: Some of it goes back to the big picture stuff we've discussed with Rubio in the past. If he's not to blame. And Wiggins isn't to blame. And Towns isn't to blame. And Muhammad isn't to blame. And LaVine isn't to blame. And so-and-so isn't to blame... why has the team lost so much... and underperformed seemingly every season? It gets very difficult for guys like us to be able to parcel out the percentage of blame. But finding a place for yourself on a winning team vs. a losing one is important in the NBA. Maybe Muhammad can do that. We just haven't seen it.]

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

We have yet to establish a core of "really good players". Rubio was a solid starting PG, but not really good. Wiggins has been mediocre, but has major upside still. Same with LaVine. And KAT is really, really good on one end, not on the other. So collectively, they are to blame for not becoming stars (at least so far). And it's nearly impossible to win more than 40 games in the west without at least a couple of all-star caliber players.

On the other hand, you can't single out any one of these four individuals and say, ah yes, if only we had a different PG (or Center or SF, etc.) because certainly all are good enough to be top 8 or 9 rotation-worthy NBA players on nearly every team in the league. So they are to blame and not to blame at the same time I guess???

As for Shabazz, he's expected to play 12-18 minutes off the bench as a wing. I believe if our starting unit gels into an upper half two-way squad, a guy like Bazz will be deemed acceptable off the bench.

[KiwiMatt]

Bring Back Bazz

[Lipoli390]

Lip, I'm curious as to who asked the coaching style question. I'm good friends with a long time season ticket holder, I actually think the longest ticket holder (since the inaugural season), friends with his son actually. Sits court side right next to wolves bench. I was talking to him a couple weeks ago, he mentioned he wasn't happy with tibs deamenor on the sidelines and was going to ask him about it. He told me he's talked to Taylor about this before also.

His name's Jon. Is that guy you know?

[Lipoli390]

One thing that may/may not be important to some teams...

Beasley has been a rotation player for three different playoff teams. Muhammad has been a rotation player for losing teams. In fact, in each of his seasons... the more he's played... the more the team has lost.

As you like to say....To be fair, who were their team mates? And how did Beasley's team do when he played for Minnesota? How did Javale McGee look with Golden State vs. his prior teams where he was a perennial Shaqtin' the Fool superstar?

It's amazing how once you establish a core of really good players you can plug in any number of different guys and make them look a whole lot better.....

While Shabazz's box score stats have been pretty stagnant, look at his Defensive Rating over his career (this is the real Defensive Rating that measures points per 100 possessions given up while on the floor, not the B-ball Reference D-rating, which is an effed up stat):

Rookie - 112.2
2nd year - 110.4
3rd year - 108.8
4th year - 106.8

The team as a whole has been absolutely awful defensively, especially the last three years, yet his numbers keep improving. How much of that is him and how much of it is in the way he's used and the guys he's on the floor with? Last year, Bjelica was the only regular rotation player with a better D-Rating, so me thinks Shabazz has made some legit strides in this area.

And that's the kind of stuff teams will look at. To be fair, that's why I wrote "may/may not" in the post above. I don't have easy access to all the stats, VUE stuff and analytical data. Or, the brainpower to scout as well as the pros.

Personally, the two guys are among a handful of my most hated Wolves (to watch) in the team's inglorious history.

I don't think either is a bad player. Both have proven they can get hot and win a game your team wasn't supposed to win. And that's basically their jobs. You take the good with the bad with guys like this. And that's why I think it's a fair comp when we're looking at what the financial marketplace might look like for Muhammad.



[Note: Some of it goes back to the big picture stuff we've discussed with Rubio in the past. If he's not to blame. And Wiggins isn't to blame. And Towns isn't to blame. And Muhammad isn't to blame. And LaVine isn't to blame. And so-and-so isn't to blame... why has the team lost so much... and underperformed seemingly every season? It gets very difficult for guys like us to be able to parcel out the percentage of blame. But finding a place for yourself on a winning team vs. a losing one is important in the NBA. Maybe Muhammad can do that. We just haven't seen it.]

Your assessment of fair market comp for Bazz seems reasonable. However, I think Bazz has more value around the league than Beasley because of Beasley's long track record as sort of a head case or a flake. And Bazz's stead improvement on the defensive end further enhances his value relative to Beasley. That's why I think Bazz will ultimately be offered more than the vet minimum by some team, although not a lot more.

As for assessment blame, I'll change the term from blame to reason. Why have the Wolves been a losing team the past four seasons while Bazz and Ricky have been here. Because winning NBA teams are build around 2 or 3 allstars. We've had no allstar-caliber players on this team the past 4 seasons except possibly KAT last season. Wiggins has allstar potential and KAT is, at best, borderline until he improves defensively. Ricky, Gorgui and Bazz have been complementary players. They can help you win if they're complementing 2 or 3 stars. The arrival of Butler gives us one definite allstar. I'm banking of KAT shoring up his defense and improving overall to the point where he's clearly playing at an allstar level. That gives us a core that can win with the right complementary players. I like the idea of Bazz coming back and becoming one of several bench rotation players, including Taj or Gorgui, Crawford and Belly. That's a solid nine-man rotation with Tyus as a 10th guy. I'd like more 3-point shooting, but at this point, the 3-point shooting improvement will have to come from the addition of Teague along with improved 3-point shooting from Wiggins.

[Duke13]

Lip, I'm curious as to who asked the coaching style question. I'm good friends with a long time season ticket holder, I actually think the longest ticket holder (since the inaugural season), friends with his son actually. Sits court side right next to wolves bench. I was talking to him a couple weeks ago, he mentioned he wasn't happy with tibs deamenor on the sidelines and was going to ask him about it. He told me he's talked to Taylor about this before also.

His name's Jon. Is that guy you know?

Jim is the guy referring to, older gentlemen, sits in the corner on the floor right next to the wolves bench.

[Lipoli390]

Lip, I'm curious as to who asked the coaching style question. I'm good friends with a long time season ticket holder, I actually think the longest ticket holder (since the inaugural season), friends with his son actually. Sits court side right next to wolves bench. I was talking to him a couple weeks ago, he mentioned he wasn't happy with tibs deamenor on the sidelines and was going to ask him about it. He told me he's talked to Taylor about this before also.

His name's Jon. Is that guy you know?

Jim is the guy referring to, older gentlemen, sits in the corner on the floor right next to the wolves bench.

The guy who asked is Jon and he sits in Row A near the bench. I've gotten to know him. He did a great job asking the question. Very respectful. I don't like the yelling, but like Q I liked Thibs' response. Thibs is such a straight-shooter. There is absolutely no BS in that guy. He's kind of growing on me -- not like a fungus. :). I think KAT and Wiggins will adjust to Thibs style if they haven't already. Having Butler and Gibson around will help with the connection between Thibs and the other players. Ultimately, I have to believe that Thibs' hyper-competitiveness will rub off on all the players to some extent. Even players at the NBA level tend to take on the character of their head coach if he's a good one. So regardless of his flaws and my past criticisms, I have a totally open mind when it comes to Thibs as our head coach this coming season.

[Monster]

Lip, I'm curious as to who asked the coaching style question. I'm good friends with a long time season ticket holder, I actually think the longest ticket holder (since the inaugural season), friends with his son actually. Sits court side right next to wolves bench. I was talking to him a couple weeks ago, he mentioned he wasn't happy with tibs deamenor on the sidelines and was going to ask him about it. He told me he's talked to Taylor about this before also.

His name's Jon. Is that guy you know?

Jim is the guy referring to, older gentlemen, sits in the corner on the floor right next to the wolves bench.

The guy who asked is Jon and he sits in Row A near the bench. I've gotten to know him. He did a great job asking the question. Very respectful. I don't like the yelling, but like Q I liked Thibs' response. Thibs is such a straight-shooter. There is absolutely no BS in that guy. He's kind of growing on me -- not like a fungus. :). I think KAT and Wiggins will adjust to Thibs style if they haven't already. Having Butler and Gibson around will help with the connection between Thibs and the other players. Ultimately, I have to believe that Thibs' hyper-competitiveness will rub off on all the players to some extent. Even players at the NBA level tend to take on the character of their head coach if he's a good one. So regardless of his flaws and my past criticisms, I have a totally open mind when it comes to Thibs as our head coach this coming season.

I think what seems to make Thibs during game stuff more liveable to me is that the rest of the time he seems very in control, thoughtful and respectful. It sure seems like him taking a step back from being crazy as far as practices both physically and all that is pretty legit. It's probably no walk in the park but it's probably a healthy improvement.

I also don't see him as a guy that's going to play mind games with guys or using the media to get at them or something. It also seems like to some extent he can turn that stuff on and off as he tends to calm down pretty quick when it matters to communicate something to his team during a time out etc. it also seems like as much as Thibs is yelling it's telling guys what to including encouraging to make a play and he also has their back working the officials.