Jimmy Butler fed up with Towns

[worldK]

Jimmy seems to have problems with younger guys. I remember it was him and wade vs rondo and the younger guys in his last year with chicago. Rondo was well liked by the young guys in that team and it was a divide between them and butler/wade.

The trajectory of jimmy and the wolves just dont fall in line. Butler is at the stage where he wants to win now and he is in the middle of his prime now. The wolves 2 other guys, towns and wiggins are still not anywhere near their prime.

Its perfectly understandable that jimmy wants to win now while he is at his best. I want to see 1 more year of jimmy/towns/wiggins together before I break them up. But if this became an issue then I will have to choose to trade jimmy and get something for him. Losing him in free agency next season gain us nothing as we are over the cap anyway and we get nothing in return.

I agree with lip that trading butler to memphis for the 4th pick last june might be the best we can get from jimmy. Now, if it came down to it, we would be lucky to get fultz and wilson chandler frim the sixers at the deadline and that happens only if jimmy will commit to sixers and see them as his road to the finals in the wide open east.

[Lipoli390]

According to bulls guys, this cowley guy is a hack when it comes to garpax. But he is plugged in to jimmy. He is to jimmy what windhorst is to lebron.

This wouldnt be the first time for jimmy to throw his team under the bus, he did it just last year.

Hopefully, cowley is just Chicago's version of wolfson.

Butler's agent said the Crowley report is BS. His agent said that if Butler has a problem with someone he'll say it himself directly, not passive-aggressively through some reporter. That rings true based on everything we've heard about Butler. So I don't believe the report and does Robson, who's pretty plugged in and attuned to all things Wolves.

However, if the report is true, then Butler's acting like a sniping little bitch and I'd trade him this summer. Of course, I wanted to trade him draft night. So true or not, I'd look to trade Butler to the Celtics for

Hard to know. Butler did call out Wiggins publicly during the season by essentially saying, but in a somewhat passive-aggressive way, that Wiggins doesn't even give 80% effort. I can't remember the exact quote, but it was pretty nasty. So maybe he is a bitch. His teammates in Chicago didn't like him when he tried to assert himself as a leader there. I recall a game last season when Butler was pissed at KAT and then ran away from KAT when KAT tried to inbound the ball to him. Then Butler continued to give him the silent treatment. I remember thinking that I'd like to pull Butler aside and explain to him that he needs to learn a thing or two about leadership. Then when Taylor suggested that Butler could help recruit, Butler's agent went into a tirade about how Butler's not paid to recruit. Hard to believe that Butler's agent wold speak like that publicly in that way if his comment didn't reflect Butler's view. And Butler could have come out and publicly corrected his agent, but he didn't.

To be fair, we all believe Wiggins has motor issues. It's been his reputation coming out of college. Garnett told a former NBA player who shares an mutual friend with me that "Wiggins has no heart." But Garnett never attempted to publicly shame his teammates. That never works. If telling someone to their face won't turn them around, then nothing will. As for leadership, people follow leaders who inspire them and who have their back. Public shaming isn't leadership, it's venting. Butler is free to vent to the press as he did locally here regarding Wiggins and as he MAY have done through Crowley in reference to KAT. But at some point, it's just petty and it certainly isn't leadership.

[crazy-canuck [enjin:18955461]]

Sure you need to make the best picks or win trades, but all is moot if you can't develop players.

You're right!

However, i do believe flip had a plan. He had a vision in his mind of how he wanted to develop wiggs, kat, and lavine. I also think sam had every intention to carry out that vision.

Unfortunately, thibs had other plans.

[Lipoli390]

Buler should have been traded already and this is one example why. It would be a great move to trae him befrore the season and acquire some more younger talent an draft assets.

I agree. I think we're in the minority on this, Cool. And as long as Thibs is in charge it will never happen. Having failed to do a draft-day deal with Memphis for the 4th pick, I'd turn my attention to the Celtics. Kyrie and Jimmy are good friends and want to play together. So the Celtics organization should be pretty movitated to do a deal for Butler. The Celtics have four assets I'd be interested in for the Wolves:

1. Jayson Tatum
2. Jaylen Brown
3. The Kings' 2019 1st round pick (top 1 protected)
4. The Grizzlies' 2019 1st round (top 8 protected, then top 6 the next yr., then unprotected)

Give me two of those assets plus Horford for salary match and I'd do the deal.

[Monster]

Buler should have been traded already and this is one example why. It would be a great move to trae him befrore the season and acquire some more younger talent an draft assets.

I agree. I think we're in the minority on this, Cool. And as long as Thibs is in charge it will never happen. Having failed to do a draft-day deal with Memphis for the 4th pick, I'd turn my attention to the Celtics. Kyrie and Jimmy are good friends and want to play together. So the Celtics organization should be pretty movitated to do a deal for Butler. The Celtics have four assets I'd be interested in for the Wolves:

1. Jayson Tatum
2. Jaylen Brown
3. The Kings' 2019 1st round pick (top 1 protected)
4. The Grizzlies' 2019 1st round (top 8 protected, then top 6 the next yr., then unprotected)

Give me two of those assets plus Horford for salary match and I'd do the deal.

I never bet but I would put a lot of money on the Celtics having no interest in this proposed deal. Just the way I see it. I doubt they would even give up Brown or Tatum straight up for Butler. That's not a knock on Butler just how valuable those young guys are when you consider their contracts etc.

[Monster]

Personally I'm just gonna enjoy Jimmy as long as he is here. All in all there are very few players I have enjoyed watching the last 10 years of this franchise as much as I did Jimmy in just one season.

[Lipoli390]

Buler should have been traded already and this is one example why. It would be a great move to trae him befrore the season and acquire some more younger talent an draft assets.

I agree. I think we're in the minority on this, Cool. And as long as Thibs is in charge it will never happen. Having failed to do a draft-day deal with Memphis for the 4th pick, I'd turn my attention to the Celtics. Kyrie and Jimmy are good friends and want to play together. So the Celtics organization should be pretty movitated to do a deal for Butler. The Celtics have four assets I'd be interested in for the Wolves:

1. Jayson Tatum
2. Jaylen Brown
3. The Kings' 2019 1st round pick (top 1 protected)
4. The Grizzlies' 2019 1st round (top 8 protected, then top 6 the next yr., then unprotected)

Give me two of those assets plus Horford for salary match and I'd do the deal.

I never bet but I would put a lot of money on the Celtics having no interest in this proposed deal. Just the way I see it. I doubt they would even give up Brown or Tatum straight up for Butler. That's not a knock on Butler just how valuable those young guys are when you consider their contracts etc.

Monster - Actually, even if were a betting guy, I wouldn't have enough confidence in my idea to bet you. :). Part of it is the value the Celtics likely put on those two guys. But you have to admit that part of the equation is Butler's value because I have no doubt the Celtics would do that deal for Kawhi Leonard. The Bulls approached the Celtics last summer about Butler and the Celtics apparently showed absolutely no interest. Yet, I suspect that the Kyrie factor might prompt the Celtics to include Brown along with one of those two likely lottery picks in a deal for Butler. In the alternative, I'd trade Butler and Gorgui for both those picks and Hayward. I think the Celtics would do that deal.

[Monster]

Buler should have been traded already and this is one example why. It would be a great move to trae him befrore the season and acquire some more younger talent an draft assets.

I agree. I think we're in the minority on this, Cool. And as long as Thibs is in charge it will never happen. Having failed to do a draft-day deal with Memphis for the 4th pick, I'd turn my attention to the Celtics. Kyrie and Jimmy are good friends and want to play together. So the Celtics organization should be pretty movitated to do a deal for Butler. The Celtics have four assets I'd be interested in for the Wolves:

1. Jayson Tatum
2. Jaylen Brown
3. The Kings' 2019 1st round pick (top 1 protected)
4. The Grizzlies' 2019 1st round (top 8 protected, then top 6 the next yr., then unprotected)

Give me two of those assets plus Horford for salary match and I'd do the deal.

I never bet but I would put a lot of money on the Celtics having no interest in this proposed deal. Just the way I see it. I doubt they would even give up Brown or Tatum straight up for Butler. That's not a knock on Butler just how valuable those young guys are when you consider their contracts etc.

Monster - Actually, even if were a betting guy, I wouldn't have enough confidence in my idea to bet you. :). Part of it is the value the Celtics likely put on those two guys. But you have to admit that part of the equation is Butler's value because I have no doubt the Celtics would do that deal for Kawhi Leonard. The Bulls approached the Celtics last summer about Butler and the Celtics apparently showed absolutely no interest. Yet, I suspect that the Kyrie factor might prompt the Celtics to include Brown along with one of those two likely lottery picks in a deal for Butler. In the alternative, I'd trade Butler and Gorgui for both those picks and Hayward. I think the Celtics would do that deal.

That's good I don't have much money anyways. lol personally I think you are overvaluing what the Celtics would send back for Butler. Maybe you could get 1 of those picks and a wing (Hayward fits more what they want to do than Butler but I could see them doing that) but adding Dieng to the deal? No way that's negative trade value. This is Ainge we are dealing with not the Kings or something. Lol it's tough i mean no matter what you think of Butler anyone would agree he is an incredibly valuable player as a true 2-way high level player. His injury history take his value down a bit. Then his age and then the fact he could end up being a rental. Do the Celtics need Butler? Idk it's a bit hard to say because some guys are still young and we don't know if Smart will be back or what Hayward will give them next year. Ultimately Butler likely has more value to the Wolves than he does to Boston. I get the idea of moving Butler but it's a pretty tough sell in a lot of ways too. Jon K also reported on a recent podcast Glen doesn't want to trade Butler either so...yeah it's not going to happen unless something happens to change things. I think nobody wants to hear that news even the folks like you that would look to move him if you know what I mean. I think ultimately everyone here would like to see this team get off to a great start and some things fall into place. It's just some are much less optimistic about that happening and that's totally fair.

[foye2smith [enjin:6593248]]

It's so frustrating small market teams can't win literally or figuratively. "Your star player wants to leave in a year better trade him or you're fucked" Trade him and get $0.50 on the $1.00. Wolves lost the KG trade, lost the Big Al trade, lost the Kevin Love trade, etc.

It's been over half a decade for Minnesota, Utah, Denver, and Orlando and none of them are in any better spot now than they were in with their disgrunted star. Tough luck for Minnesota, Utah, and Denver they're still seasons away from relevancy with Golden State and LeBron looming over the west.

Or wait a season and luckily re-sign player "You're paying 'player x' this much in 2021? you're fucked"

Screw it let's hope the Wolves never get good players. Get a roster of 7th men and overpay them so they'll be content and stay. /s

Then we need people running the Wolves organization who won't constantly lose trades and make poor draft decisions. I mentioned it in another thread and I'll do it again here. No one was flocking to Golden State when they were dwelling near the bottom of the standings for years. The Warriors have never been one of the NBA's iconic franchises. They made a string of terrific draft decisions, drafting Curry at #7, Klay Thompson at #11 and Draymond Green in the second round. They drafted Harrison Barnes with the 7th pick, traded for Iggy while he was still in his prime and they hired a young very smart head coach who can relate to players. The then won an NBA championship before Kevin Durant ever went there. To sign Durant, the Warriors front office had to think steps ahead and intelligently manage their cap situation. That Warriors success is all earned.

The Wolves problems aren't rooted in the cold winter weather or the lack of an iconic brand like Lakers, Knicks or Celtics. The Wolves problems are rooted in an owner who hires mediocre to bad front office executives to run the basketball operations. And the mediocrity runs downhill to choice of coaches and player personnel decisions. In this last instance, Taylor hired a head coach out of touch with today's NBA and also make him PBO even though he'd never even worked in a front office much less led one. Mediocrity throughout the Wolves organization. Is it any wonder the team is mediocre. There is obviously dissension in the organization and among players right now. A good organization would fix it. Under Glen Taylor those problems will just fester and get worse.

And that's why the 2nd beat player in the league is elbowing his way out of arguably the best run sports organization for the last two decade.

Just seems like the standard for small market organizations is to be damn near infallible.

[thedoper]

Wow the sky really is falling. This has been the most overblown offseason ever. Surpassing all of those losing years when we were god awful with no hope. Jimmy, KAT, and Wiggins are still a great basketball 3. Just get them together and make it work. They made small strides last year, need bigger ones this year.