kekgeek1 wrote:Can people just stop with defensive real plus minus because cole sucks at d
I think that DRPM has some huge flaws. I still believe defensive analytical tools are way behind the offensive tools. I still rely on opponent scoring by position as the first stat to frame context. If you lose your man it needs to be your responsibility to pass that message on to the team. If a guy has high DRPM but the other team is getting all their points from that position there is an obvious disconnect. This is my main issue with Rubio being called a great defender, you can't have it both ways.
kekgeek1 wrote:Can people just stop with defensive real plus minus because cole sucks at d
I think that DRPM has some huge flaws. I still believe defensive analytical tools are way behind the offensive tools. I still rely on opponent scoring by position as the first stat to frame context. If you lose your man it needs to be your responsibility to pass that message on to the team. If a guy has high DRPM but the other team is getting all their points from that position there is an obvious disconnect. This is my main issue with Rubio being called a great defender, you can't have it both ways.
I think ricky is a solid defender but I 100% agree. People talk about real plus minus like it is the be all to end all but there is some huge flaws to it.
Also to Q point from last game Jim P brought up we are in the top 10 in Drtg but we have a huge outlier game playing the grizzlies JV team
longstrangetrip wrote:11 assists and 17 TOs...not going to win many games with that kind of offensive ineptitude.
I know it's early, but this is poor play of an epic proportion, and Thibs needs to send a strong Pop-like message before the next game. I wouldn't start anyone not named Karl (and he may be out injured also). Let the young guys know they aren't automatically entitled to a starting position.
KAT (if healthy)
Belly
Bazz
Rush
Tyus
And watch the young guys come in a lot hungrier...hopefully,
The 2nd unit has been THE problem in every game but this one. What needs to happen is they need to put their stats aside and start playing as a team. There is no cohesion on offense, especially once we face a little adversity.
longstrangetrip wrote:11 assists and 17 TOs...not going to win many games with that kind of offensive ineptitude.
I know it's early, but this is poor play of an epic proportion, and Thibs needs to send a strong Pop-like message before the next game. I wouldn't start anyone not named Karl (and he may be out injured also). Let the young guys know they aren't automatically entitled to a starting position.
KAT (if healthy)
Belly
Bazz
Rush
Tyus
And watch the young guys come in a lot hungrier...hopefully,
What has rush, tyus, Belly done to deserve to start. Bazz is the only bench player to do anything this year
Not much...but at least they didn't have the atrocious +/- numbers the starters had tonight, and have had in the third quarter of 4 out of five games. When Pop makes a hockey shift change, it isn't because the guys coming in have necessarily earned it. It's more about lighting a fire under the guys he's benching. Thibs needs to do something different...this is inexcusable play against teams that aren't all that good.
longstrangetrip wrote:11 assists and 17 TOs...not going to win many games with that kind of offensive ineptitude.
I know it's early, but this is poor play of an epic proportion, and Thibs needs to send a strong Pop-like message before the next game. I wouldn't start anyone not named Karl (and he may be out injured also). Let the young guys know they aren't automatically entitled to a starting position.
KAT (if healthy)
Belly
Bazz
Rush
Tyus
And watch the young guys come in a lot hungrier...hopefully,
The 2nd unit has been THE problem in every game but this one. What needs to happen is they need to put their stats aside and start playing as a team. There is no cohesion on offense, especially once we face a little adversity.
+1
We are back to the iso shit again. Even KAT has played statistically great the last 2 game but I'm not sure if he has had one meaningful pass in those 2 games.
We miss ricky (not saying he will solve our problems). Also I would love to see the stats on odd man fast breaks TOs to assist ratio because just from the eye test it has been bad
longstrangetrip wrote:11 assists and 17 TOs...not going to win many games with that kind of offensive ineptitude.
I know it's early, but this is poor play of an epic proportion, and Thibs needs to send a strong Pop-like message before the next game. I wouldn't start anyone not named Karl (and he may be out injured also). Let the young guys know they aren't automatically entitled to a starting position.
KAT (if healthy)
Belly
Bazz
Rush
Tyus
And watch the young guys come in a lot hungrier...hopefully,
The 2nd unit has been THE problem in every game but this one. What needs to happen is they need to put their stats aside and start playing as a team. There is no cohesion on offense, especially once we face a little adversity.
I agree that offensive cohesion is a huge problem, but I don't know if +/- stats would pin our woes on the 2nd unit. It seems to me the issue has been mostly the 3rd quarter, when our starters get most of the minutes.
Don't get me wrong...I like the 5 guys Thibs prefers as starters. I just think they need a slap in the face. Bench them, and tell them they get their starting role back when they start passing the ball and rotating on defense. This season has started out as a disaster, and continuing to do the same thing expecting a different result is the definition of coaching insanity
kekgeek1 wrote:Can people just stop with defensive real plus minus because cole sucks at d
I think that DRPM has some huge flaws. I still believe defensive analytical tools are way behind the offensive tools. I still rely on opponent scoring by position as the first stat to frame context. If you lose your man it needs to be your responsibility to pass that message on to the team. If a guy has high DRPM but the other team is getting all their points from that position there is an obvious disconnect. This is my main issue with Rubio being called a great defender, you can't have it both ways.
I think ricky is a solid defender but I 100% agree. People talk about real plus minus like it is the be all to end all but there is some huge flaws to it.
Also to Q point from last game Jim P brought up we are in the top 10 in Drtg but we have a huge outlier game playing the grizzlies JV team
I think Rubio is a solid defender too ,but I make a distinction between solid and great.. The problem is that DRPM makes him out to be Khawaii Leanord at the position and ignores how often opponent PGs go off on him.
longstrangetrip wrote:11 assists and 17 TOs...not going to win many games with that kind of offensive ineptitude.
I know it's early, but this is poor play of an epic proportion, and Thibs needs to send a strong Pop-like message before the next game. I wouldn't start anyone not named Karl (and he may be out injured also). Let the young guys know they aren't automatically entitled to a starting position.
KAT (if healthy)
Belly
Bazz
Rush
Tyus
And watch the young guys come in a lot hungrier...hopefully,
The 2nd unit has been THE problem in every game but this one. What needs to happen is they need to put their stats aside and start playing as a team. There is no cohesion on offense, especially once we face a little adversity.
+1
We are back to the iso shit again. Even KAT has played statistically great the last 2 game but I'm not sure if he has had one meaningful pass in those 2 games.
We miss ricky (not saying he will solve our problems). Also I would love to see the stats on odd man fast breaks TOs to assist ratio because just from the eye test it has been bad
He didn't get off to a great start in the first three games, and you could just see that he was determined to get himself going in these last 2. That's great and we need him being our best player, but it can't come at the expense of Zach and Wig.
longstrangetrip wrote:11 assists and 17 TOs...not going to win many games with that kind of offensive ineptitude.
I know it's early, but this is poor play of an epic proportion, and Thibs needs to send a strong Pop-like message before the next game. I wouldn't start anyone not named Karl (and he may be out injured also). Let the young guys know they aren't automatically entitled to a starting position.
KAT (if healthy)
Belly
Bazz
Rush
Tyus
And watch the young guys come in a lot hungrier...hopefully,
What has rush, tyus, Belly done to deserve to start. Bazz is the only bench player to do anything this year
Not much...but at least they didn't have the atrocious +/- numbers the starters had tonight, and have had in the third quarter of 4 out of five games. When Pop makes a hockey shift change, it isn't because the guys coming in have necessarily earned it. It's more about lighting a fire under the guys he's benching. Thibs needs to do something different...this is inexcusable play against teams that aren't all that good.
Just a counter to your point it is easier to go to your bench when it is filled with vets that won't kill you like the spurs bench has like ginobili, mills, diaw. Like we are going to undersized 2nd year pg, can't dribble rush, specialty player in Bazz, Belly who has been a bad nba player and no offense cole
