Grizzlies/Wolves GDT

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

Rubio has played 7 games - hardly enough time to declare his season a dumpster fire. But I do agree he has not been very good to date.

It's still early for Wall too. It's hard to believe that in his 7th season he's gone from a 32% career 3-point shooter to 44%. But I guess anything is possible. His outside shot and turnover issues have held him back in prior years. We'll see if he can sustain this level of shooting success, which by the way, hasn't translated to team success.

[Wile E Coyote [enjin:17432808]]

I would definitely be hesitant to trade for Wall, despite his obvious physical gifts. Within the last year he has directly complained about:
* Beal and his relationship with him.
* The insufficient marketing of him by the team. Not on enough billboards, etc.

In WAS he is option 1 or 1a on offense, and he is probably marketed as the face of the team. Just not enough, apparently. On the Wolves he'd be the 3rd option on offense (unless he ignored the coach) and would not be marketed more than Towns/Wiggins.

I think Wall ends up going to a bigger market, not smaller. He seems to want the Carmello situation: big money in a big city as the clear #1 guy on a team. LA?

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Thibs and Layden weren't willing to include Zach LaVine in a deal for Jimmy Butler. So, I personally doubt they'd include him in a deal for John Wall, especially with the growth LaVine has shown so far this season. I also think he's much more valuable to this team than a lot of people would like to think. His 3P shooting and ability to be a secondary ball-handler has proven to be a big punch for the offense. And while the numbers don't show it, I do believe he's improved defensively. I'd hang on to him.

(Also, Washington already has Bradley Beal. It'd make sense for them to want pieces in return that would compliment him -- not a player that would seem redundant to what they already have.)

If they could score Wall almost straight for Rubio that would be highway robbery. In a third team scenario we would still likely have to give up another major piece. I think Lavine is good for all the reasons you mention, but our best 2 is Wiggins, and there is some redundancy with Wig and Lavine (ball dominant scorers). I think a threesome of Wig, Wall, and Towns is more complimentary than Wig, Lavine, and Towns. I'm happy to roll with what we have, but Wall would be one of the splashier targets.

Wiggins probably is our best overall SG, but he's also our best SF and we have very little behind him there. Also, this has turned into a league where you just want to get your best players on the floor together regardless of position, especially at the wings.

LaVine is without any doubts whatsoever our best three-point shooter and among the elites in the game, no hyperbole. If Minnesota was to trade him, I don't see any shooters readily available that can replace him, either already on the team or around the league. He's been a primary reason why Minnesota's actually out-shooting teams from behind the arc this season.

I'd also argue that LaVine is a perfect compliment to Towns and Wiggins in that he's satisfied playing off-ball a lot of the time, spaces the floor extremely well, and can handle the ball when asked to do so. He's our Klay Thompson, J.J. Redick, Kyle Korver type that changes how defenses guard your team before he even touches the basketball.

Wall would be an excellent addition, but only if it doesn't disrupt the three that are already here. We'd have one ball with two players who need it to attack the rim and no one reliable to camp out above the break or in the corner. Worse, it might make Towns even more perimeter-oriented to help with the lack of shooting on the floor. To me, that spells trouble for everyone.

[Wile E Coyote [enjin:17432808]]

With regard to our point guard situation, Ricky at this age is not likely to become much better as a shooter. So I don't really care about his offensive game in general. He definitely needs to hit his free throws, but guards are pretty consistent on those and I'm not worried. I am a bit worried about his turnovers though.

Big picture wise, the issue at PG for me is that Dunn looks really lost. He was the long-term plan there, and he is getting outplayed by Tyus. That is a concern IMO.

[Monster]

With regard to our point guard situation, Ricky at this age is not likely to become much better as a shooter. So I don't really care about his offensive game in general. He definitely needs to hit his free throws, but guards are pretty consistent on those and I'm not worried. I am a bit worried about his turnovers though.

Big picture wise, the issue at PG for me is that Dunn looks really lost. He was the long-term plan there, and he is getting outplayed by Tyus. That is a concern IMO.

It is a concern. Dunn wasn't my guy and I had some concerns about him and he absolutely isn't playing well overall. Its really early though and remember he was at Providence for 4 years but he really only played 3 fullish seasons in college. For a fun comparison look at this PG's first season in the NBA.

FG 36.6% 3 point 30.5% That's Kemba Walker's rookie season and he didn't have the defensive potential that Dunn has. It's one comparison that has some positives and you can find other ones that are much less encouraging. I've seen enough to think Dunn is gonna be solid eventually. its tough playing PG running a team of young inexperienced players in a new system. Heck Rubio has gotten a bit frustrated at times.

[Coolbreeze44]

Dunn deserves a lot more time to try and figure things out. But Tyus is being under-utilized right now. All I know is that PG play has been a problem overall, and something needs to get figured out before this season is too far gone.

And everyone knows Thibs wasn't my first choice as coach, but it doesn't matter. He's the coach and he's going to be for a very long time. You can complain about his decisions all you want, but it's not going to make a difference. I'm guessing he wants Dunn to emerge as the guy, and he quite possibly could. But I'd like to see some clarity one way or the other. The smart money is we wait until we get close to the deadline to make a significant move. By that time we could be locked back into the lottery.

[Brooklyn_Wolves [enjin:14608167]]

If Wiggins develops as a playmaker, can LaVine become our PG again? If Thibs offense calls for PG only to bring up the ball and hand it to Wiggins who starts a 2 men game with Towns, then Zach maybe fit enough to play that limited PG role, he has the handles and a money outside shot. Get a long defensive SF in the offseason and move Wig to SG.
Zach-Drew-SF-KAT-G.

[Coolbreeze44]

If Wiggins develops as a playmaker, can LaVine become our PG again? If Thibs offense calls for PG only to bring up the ball and hand it to Wiggins who starts a 2 men game with Towns, then Zach maybe fit enough to play that limited PG role, he has the handles and a money outside shot. Get a long defensive SF in the offseason and move Wig to SG.
Zach-Drew-SF-KAT-G.

Interesting

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

If Wiggins develops as a playmaker, can LaVine become our PG again? If Thibs offense calls for PG only to bring up the ball and hand it to Wiggins who starts a 2 men game with Towns, then Zach maybe fit enough to play that limited PG role, he has the handles and a money outside shot. Get a long defensive SF in the offseason and move Wig to SG.
Zach-Drew-SF-KAT-G.

Boy, that solves a lot of problems, doesn't it? I suppose it's why Flip and then Mitchell may have tried it in the first place:

1. It allows Wiggins to play his "ideal" position on the floor at the 2.
2. It allows LaVine to not be shoved aside in order to make way for Wiggins. He simply switches to the 1.
3. It gives us a PG that is currently the best shooter on the team.
4. It gives us great size and length at our two back court positions, although frankly, neither utilize their length much on defense, as neither gets many deflections (but may be this changes if guarding smaller players more often?).

I cringe at the memories of LaVine trying to run an offense though. I mean, he had problems even bringing the ball up at times!

Also, Wiggins is a looooooong ways away from a D-Wade/Kobe/Jordan/LeBron/Harden type of point wing. He is still in the very, very early stages of developing play making skills.

It's definitely an interesting thought and I can certainly see it being used in crunch-time situations in the short run. But as a permanent solution? Not so sure.....

[Coolbreeze44]

If Wiggins develops as a playmaker, can LaVine become our PG again? If Thibs offense calls for PG only to bring up the ball and hand it to Wiggins who starts a 2 men game with Towns, then Zach maybe fit enough to play that limited PG role, he has the handles and a money outside shot. Get a long defensive SF in the offseason and move Wig to SG.
Zach-Drew-SF-KAT-G.

Boy, that solves a lot of problems, doesn't it? I suppose it's why Flip and then Mitchell may have tried it in the first place:

1. It allows Wiggins to play his "ideal" position on the floor at the 2.
2. It allows LaVine to not be shoved aside in order to make way for Wiggins. He simply switches to the 1.
3. It gives us a PG that is currently the best shooter on the team.
4. It gives us great size and length at our two back court positions, although frankly, neither utilize their length much on defense, as neither gets many deflections (but may be this changes if guarding smaller players more often?).

I cringe at the memories of LaVine trying to run an offense though. I mean, he had problems even bringing the ball up at times!

Also, Wiggins is a looooooong ways away from a D-Wade/Kobe/Jordan/LeBron/Harden type of point wing. He is still in the very, very early stages of developing play making skills.

It's definitely an interesting thought and I can certainly see it being used in crunch-time situations in the short run. But as a permanent solution? Not so sure.....

The next discussion would be IF this could work, what we could we do with the existing PG assets to improve the team?