AbeVigodaLive wrote:Under your previous "organic" growth plan... you were banking on progressive growth from Wiggins and KAT.
So let's say that happens and Teague and Butler bolt. Ok.
Wouldn't the Wolves still have two of the league's better (best) players entering their prime? Doesn't sound like the worst scenario to me. At least half the league would be happy to have that problem.
It is great, except you're talking about two players seeing playoffs, unable to get over the hump, and looking to jettison when the other core players take off as we have no young talent brewing, no cap room, and we are not some destination like GSW or Cavs for the time being for top ring chasers.
No young talent brewing? So there was a flip that switched and now we are incapable of that happening or something?
Tyus
Patton
Young FA's we could sign
G-league
Undrafted guys or an international dude.
Why can't we do that while being a really good team? Other other good teams do it why can't we?
Oh the Cavs and GS were so sexy like 2-4 years ago...not really it wasn't that long ago those teams were basketball wastelands.
California and LeBron vs. Minnesota. That's not comparable. Tyus isn't a great prospect. Patton was jut drafted, so we will see. Otherwise, we lose our pick next year and get an OKC pick that will be in the 22-29 range now. Not super exciting. Shabazz likely is gone. Bjelicia may be next year (he also isn't very good or young. Not much else. I will love to see us win close games, no doubt, I'm just not convinced this actually has us in the conversation that we need, want, or waited to be in. That saddens me.
AbeVigodaLive wrote:Under your previous "organic" growth plan... you were banking on progressive growth from Wiggins and KAT.
So let's say that happens and Teague and Butler bolt. Ok.
Wouldn't the Wolves still have two of the league's better (best) players entering their prime? Doesn't sound like the worst scenario to me. At least half the league would be happy to have that problem.
It is great, except you're talking about two players seeing playoffs, unable to get over the hump, and looking to jettison when the other core players take off as we have no young talent brewing, no cap room, and we are not some destination like GSW or Cavs for the time being for top ring chasers.
No young talent brewing? So there was a flip that switched and now we are incapable of that happening or something?
Tyus
Patton
Young FA's we could sign
G-league
Undrafted guys or an international dude.
Why can't we do that while being a really good team? Other other good teams do it why can't we?
Oh the Cavs and GS were so sexy like 2-4 years ago...not really it wasn't that long ago those teams were basketball wastelands.
Spurs have been doing it for 20 years.
What I hate about your argument Future is that your just assuming it's gonna be doom and gloom. I can do the same thing if we kept our roster. Man Zach might ever be the same player after his knee injury. Dunn will never find his jump shot. Rubio last two months was a fluke and he went to back to being the Ricky we all know. Markkaen is the Finnish Andrew Barjgnani. All we can do is sit and watch and hope everything works out but for Heavens sake this franchise haven't been in playoffs in over a decade we're lucky we even still have a team.
TheFuture wrote:For the record, I would have sat with Rubio, Dunn, LaVine, Wiggins, KAT, Dieng, Bjelicia, #7, used our 20 mil cap on the bench, matched shabazz at anything under 7 mil, and fought for a 6-8 seed. We will see what happens.
The 6 seed just added Paul George. We'd be fighting for an 8 seed and likely losing to more experienced teams again. We were supposed to make a big jump last year after adding a couple bench pieces and it didn't happen. I fail to see how adding a different bench and internal improvement results in 10 more wins. In a conference that just got even better that's a poor forecast imo.
Jester, those guys may fail, sure. But Teague is what he is, a twenty nine year old above average pg who just cut five mil from our bench options. Jimmy is a star, of course, but that isn't putting us anywhere alone. There is heat about laying down to GSW, but we are in unprecedented territory with that team. Even if one all star gets hurt, they have 3 more and a team full of playoff vets. This isn't the NFL of any given Sunday... Any nba fan should realize that young players will need to acclimate to the playoff environment before they help win 4/7. We don't have LeBron. KAT and Wiggins haven't even sniffed fifty fifty ball.
TheFuture wrote:Jester, those guys may fail, sure. But Teague is what he is, a twenty nine year old above average pg who just cut five mil from our bench options. Jimmy is a star, of course, but that isn't putting us anywhere alone. There is heat about laying down to GSW, but we are in unprecedented territory with that team. Even if one all star gets hurt, they have 3 more and a team full of playoff vets. This isn't the NFL of any given Sunday... Any nba fan should realize that young players will need to acclimate to the playoff environment before they help win 4/7. We don't have LeBron. KAT and Wiggins haven't even sniffed fifty fifty ball.
I guess I rather them take a shot and hope butler resigns in 2 years and make the playoffs and get the playoff experience your talking about. Then hope all the dominos fall into place and everything clicks next year with bunch of youngs guys and maybe a better bench. Idk Im not going to be pestmitic and just going to sit back relax and watch this team hopefully take the next step. Just my perspective but I understand your too at the end of the day if Wiggins and Kat don't take the next step it was never going work anyways.
Fully understand your view jester, and most others here. It's been a LOooooong road to get here. Don't blame any for wanting to just see a dang playoff game.
I'm just of the opinion that it was a year or two too soon. I've watched religiously through it all. The beasleys, the johnsons, the Williams, flynns, etc. etc. etc. Flip came back and made Great moves to put us back on track. Then he passes, the KG fiasco happens, Thibs moves on from his 5 pick after one year (one can argue that's better than waiting though I see otherwise) Zach (which I felt was a flip homerun), and #7. Call me timid, but I cannot help but feel this blows up in our face in two seasons and a Thibs is canned simultaneously. Then it just restarts. I loved the notion of actually seeing real potential for once and wanted to see it at least develop. We haven't sniffed playoffs for 13 years, yes, but we also never came close in those years to having the young hits on talent that flip left us with..
I liked the Butler trade a whole lot, but not sure I like swapping Rubio for Teague. I get that Teague is a better fit, but I think Rubio is the better player, plus you lose cap space in the deal. I would rather improve elsewhere than do a lateral move and have less cap options.
I'm not sold on essentially a Ricky for pick and Teague deal but I have to think that perhaps Ricky wanted out and behind the scene requested the trade. It has to be hard to hear the constant rumors that you are being traded. He may have pushed for it to be over and he is going to a playoff team.
It was Ricky and cap space for Teague and a first round pick. Not just a swap. It might be a low first round pick, but many people here every year want us to pick up an extra pick in that range to add more young talent to the team. Teague and Ricky is a wash and I'd take a first round pick over 4 million in cap space any day. It gives us the chance to win now and keep building for the future. Our current starting PF and backup PG were taken in that range. That's a huge get to get that pick.
There is going to be a lot less pressure on KAT and Wig now. I see that as a hidden positive with these moves. Now they can just be what they are - 22 year old budding phenoms - without the burden of turning a moribund franchise around all by themselves. I'm not saying there isn't pressure, but it's going to be a different kind of pressure for them. I see it helping both guys a lot, and maybe even Wig a little bit more.
