TeamRicky wrote:Wiggins is handling the ball and has five turnovers (actually should have been 6) and KAT is 0 from 6 from outside and he has a complete greenlight from there and why is Thibs ok with this? We should have blown out a Portland team without Lillard at home, but the gameplan is terrible. Its on the players too, but I really have been disappointed with Thibs game management.
what the fuck do you do at this point when teams literally have a player play centerfield against us, how do you coach around a PG that can't shoot at all? Teams are going to aggressively go after us on defense with doubles and traps like crazy now once they see this and there is nothing we can do to stop it, this isn't on Towns improving passing out of the doubles he can get better but Ricky has to go. Can any of you find me clips of another pg who was so ignored and let open to shot THAT bad on every play? It doesn't matter if it's a 3 or a 10 footer you can't win that way, we are seeing what any team we faced in a playoff game would do to us and it was brutal to watch
Ricky has consistently been our top plus guy every year until this year. Thibs is the X Factor. He's been a complete disaster so far. If we had the option of getting rid of Thibs, I would do that before getting rid of Ricky who's elite in every category for a point guard outside of Field goal shooting.
It seems to me people go so extreme when it comes to Rubio. I don't see a reason to go overboard defending him or find anyway possible to push him out. If Dunn becomes the PG of the future and and the Wolves can't find a deal that helps them they could just play Rubio off the bench and enjoy a really effective player for a chunk of minutes that probably would help other bench guys be effective. I don't think there is any hurry to make a move. There are plenty of other avenues to improve this team than trading a guy like Rubio. Hopefully Dunn progresses.
1) God is Kat a bad help side defender, I honestly think some of it is he doesn't want to get into foul trouble but he reacts to late and either gives up a uncontested layup or and 1
2) teams will continue to double KAT hard until ricky can make them pay and tonight he didn't do that. It takes Kat so out of rythm also.
3) By far Dunn best game of his career, he did some dumb things like jumping on the pump fake at the end of the third, also way over helped on Plumlee on the elbow leaving Mccullum open for the clinching 3 but man he attacks those screens. Contrast to ricky where Ricky was just ate by the screens. Dunn made CJ work.
4) Lavine worst game in a long time, he complained a lot tonight couldn't get into a rythm.
5) I get why Thibs is trying to make wiggins into a playmaker because if ricky is not in the game there is no offensive flow at all. Wiggins played ok but he was not in attack like the Bucks game.
6) overall hard to win when I would say all 5 starters played below their mean all to different extents.
Ex) Wolves need to do more promotions, the wolves are the worst team ever so I get why the crowd was quite (super boring sloppy game). But the crowd goes nuts for cherry berry, the Staff needs to do more silly promotions to create energy
TeamRicky wrote:Wiggins is handling the ball and has five turnovers (actually should have been 6) and KAT is 0 from 6 from outside and he has a complete greenlight from there and why is Thibs ok with this? We should have blown out a Portland team without Lillard at home, but the gameplan is terrible. Its on the players too, but I really have been disappointed with Thibs game management.
what the fuck do you do at this point when teams literally have a player play centerfield against us, how do you coach around a PG that can't shoot at all? Teams are going to aggressively go after us on defense with doubles and traps like crazy now once they see this and there is nothing we can do to stop it, this isn't on Towns improving passing out of the doubles he can get better but Ricky has to go. Can any of you find me clips of another pg who was so ignored and let open to shot THAT bad on every play? It doesn't matter if it's a 3 or a 10 footer you can't win that way, we are seeing what any team we faced in a playoff game would do to us and it was brutal to watch
Ricky has consistently been our top plus guy every year until this year. Thibs is the X Factor. He's been a complete disaster so far. If we had the option of getting rid of Thibs, I would do that before getting rid of Ricky who's elite in every category for a point guard outside of Field goal shooting.
It seems to me people go so extreme when it comes to Rubio. I don't see a reason to go overboard defending him or find anyway possible to push him out. If Dunn becomes the PG of the future and and the Wolves can't find a deal that helps them they could just play Rubio off the bench and enjoy a really effective player for a chunk of minutes that probably would help other bench guys be effective. I don't think there is any hurry to make a move. There are plenty of other avenues to improve this team than trading a guy like Rubio. Hopefully Dunn progresses.
I think 12 million for a back up pg could be spent better elsewhere. If only we could talk Pek into retiring.
TeamRicky wrote:Wiggins is handling the ball and has five turnovers (actually should have been 6) and KAT is 0 from 6 from outside and he has a complete greenlight from there and why is Thibs ok with this? We should have blown out a Portland team without Lillard at home, but the gameplan is terrible. Its on the players too, but I really have been disappointed with Thibs game management.
what the fuck do you do at this point when teams literally have a player play centerfield against us, how do you coach around a PG that can't shoot at all? Teams are going to aggressively go after us on defense with doubles and traps like crazy now once they see this and there is nothing we can do to stop it, this isn't on Towns improving passing out of the doubles he can get better but Ricky has to go. Can any of you find me clips of another pg who was so ignored and let open to shot THAT bad on every play? It doesn't matter if it's a 3 or a 10 footer you can't win that way, we are seeing what any team we faced in a playoff game would do to us and it was brutal to watch
Ricky has consistently been our top plus guy every year until this year. Thibs is the X Factor. He's been a complete disaster so far. If we had the option of getting rid of Thibs, I would do that before getting rid of Ricky who's elite in every category for a point guard outside of Field goal shooting.
It seems to me people go so extreme when it comes to Rubio. I don't see a reason to go overboard defending him or find anyway possible to push him out. If Dunn becomes the PG of the future and and the Wolves can't find a deal that helps them they could just play Rubio off the bench and enjoy a really effective player for a chunk of minutes that probably would help other bench guys be effective. I don't think there is any hurry to make a move. There are plenty of other avenues to improve this team than trading a guy like Rubio. Hopefully Dunn progresses.
I think 12 million for a back up pg could be spent better elsewhere. If only we could talk Pek into retiring.
Actually it sounds like Pek's medical retirement is pretty much in the works.
Maybe 14 million (his salary for next year) is a lot for a backup PG but Rubio isn't just some above replacement level that you sign for cheap he is a better overall player than that. Those type is guys last summer got at least 7 million a year per if not more. This summer that price could go up. If Pek's salary goes away that means even more space than the Wolves already project to have. Again there is plenty of opportunity to improve other aspects of the team than dumping Rubio espcially just because of the money thing.
TeamRicky wrote:Wiggins is handling the ball and has five turnovers (actually should have been 6) and KAT is 0 from 6 from outside and he has a complete greenlight from there and why is Thibs ok with this? We should have blown out a Portland team without Lillard at home, but the gameplan is terrible. Its on the players too, but I really have been disappointed with Thibs game management.
what the fuck do you do at this point when teams literally have a player play centerfield against us, how do you coach around a PG that can't shoot at all? Teams are going to aggressively go after us on defense with doubles and traps like crazy now once they see this and there is nothing we can do to stop it, this isn't on Towns improving passing out of the doubles he can get better but Ricky has to go. Can any of you find me clips of another pg who was so ignored and let open to shot THAT bad on every play? It doesn't matter if it's a 3 or a 10 footer you can't win that way, we are seeing what any team we faced in a playoff game would do to us and it was brutal to watch
Ricky has consistently been our top plus guy every year until this year. Thibs is the X Factor. He's been a complete disaster so far. If we had the option of getting rid of Thibs, I would do that before getting rid of Ricky who's elite in every category for a point guard outside of Field goal shooting.
Legit question because I am curious about your opinion on this. Don't you think the wolves are capped out by running the ricky rubio style of offense (at best .500 ball) and don't you think it is smart to try something different (wiggins playmaker) even if it fails now or continues to fail if it has the potential to exceed the cap the ricky style has shown since being in the league even if it is not putting ricky in the best position to succeed
Kekgeek, As to your question on the Ricky style of offense and whether that caps us....I think it's a fairly complex answer.
The fact is we were one of the most potent offenses in the NBA playing that style in the latter half of last season. Once LaVine was inserted as the starting SG and Rubio now had a full slate of weapons at his disposal, our offense took flight. The reason we only played .500-ish ball was because our defense still sucked. A similar scenario played out throughout an entire season in 2013-14. So no, Rubio does not cap us to a .500 team if we had a defense that was as good as our offense.
However......If one takes a longer view, you can see the logic in what Thibs is doing. First, he is fully invested in the "big three" and developing them to their full capabilities. One major step in development is to be able to make plays for others. They become so much more dangerous if their primary scorers can also create for others. It diversifies the offense and enables us to become less dependent on a singular play maker. Look at how the Clippers have collapsed since Paul got hurt. Imagine what would happen to OKC if Westbrook got hurt. Or the Rockets without Harden.
A byproduct of this strategy is that Thibs doesn't need to worry about filling his PG slot with a max contract player. Assuming they are saving their big contracts for the big three, it makes sense to ensure the team isn't overly dependent on their PG to run the entire offense, whether that PG is Rubio or someone else.
And finally, this strategy allows us to eventually upgrade defensively at PG with Dunn (I think Rubio is a plus team defender, but Dunn is on a different level and could eventually be a DPOY candidate - I think he could be THAT good). However, Dunn also isn't nearly the play maker Rubio is, so in a sense, Thibs is paving the way for Dunn to potentially be our starter some day, whereby he's more of a caretaker on offense while most of the sets run through the other guys.
longstrangetrip wrote:Is this the low point in the most dreadful of all seasons?
How is it such a low point? We lost to team with more wins than us and went to the playoffs last year. To me it's closer to a 50/50 game. The Blazers are now a game over .500 when Lilliard doesn't play.
Monster, we lost at home to a team that was in a complete tailspin and missing their best player. They had lost 8 out of 10 and were 5-14 on the road before last night. There is simply no way to put a positive spin on last night without hallucinogenics.
TeamRicky wrote:Wiggins is handling the ball and has five turnovers (actually should have been 6) and KAT is 0 from 6 from outside and he has a complete greenlight from there and why is Thibs ok with this? We should have blown out a Portland team without Lillard at home, but the gameplan is terrible. Its on the players too, but I really have been disappointed with Thibs game management.
what the fuck do you do at this point when teams literally have a player play centerfield against us, how do you coach around a PG that can't shoot at all? Teams are going to aggressively go after us on defense with doubles and traps like crazy now once they see this and there is nothing we can do to stop it, this isn't on Towns improving passing out of the doubles he can get better but Ricky has to go. Can any of you find me clips of another pg who was so ignored and let open to shot THAT bad on every play? It doesn't matter if it's a 3 or a 10 footer you can't win that way, we are seeing what any team we faced in a playoff game would do to us and it was brutal to watch
Ricky has consistently been our top plus guy every year until this year. Thibs is the X Factor. He's been a complete disaster so far. If we had the option of getting rid of Thibs, I would do that before getting rid of Ricky who's elite in every category for a point guard outside of Field goal shooting.
It seems to me people go so extreme when it comes to Rubio. I don't see a reason to go overboard defending him or find anyway possible to push him out. If Dunn becomes the PG of the future and and the Wolves can't find a deal that helps them they could just play Rubio off the bench and enjoy a really effective player for a chunk of minutes that probably would help other bench guys be effective. I don't think there is any hurry to make a move. There are plenty of other avenues to improve this team than trading a guy like Rubio. Hopefully Dunn progresses.
Yeah, the polarization about our PG surprises me too. I am so conflicted about him...love some things, hate some others...and that leaves me right in the middle. I love his peripheral numbers and his defensive passion, and he seems like a stellar teammate. But his shooting is a real issue that will never be solved. I think his contract, which we thought was a terrific bargain, is about right. I see him as clearly our starting PG, but there will be nights like last night when Dunn deserves the majority of minutes.
Do Ricky's +/- numbers really matter if we aren't winning? On the one hand you are arguing that he's doing his job out there on the floor, but at the same time that says he's not a real difference maker if he's been a plus contributor to a losing team for so long. He has 3 20 PPG scorers next to him that seemingly have to show up every single game just to have a shot to win the game. Aren't you tired of that? Wouldn't you like a player that can step up and have a monster game to help out the big 3 every once in a while? It's just tiring giving a guy a pass because his stats say he's a positive when he never steps up to win a game for us. It's always gotta be someone else because he just can't do it.
