Orlando Magic - 30 For 30

[Coolbreeze44]

The 30 for 30 special on the Magic provides an interesting lesson for the Wolves as they begin the Thibs-Layden era. It's a really well done piece that focuses on the promise of this young team, and then how it unravels starting with Shaq leaving for the Lakers. There are a lot of parallels that can be drawn between that team and ours. Each had a dominant big man and 2nd star. Surrounding the two stars are/were other good young players. Greatness is/was expected for each team.

But the Magic story is about ultimate failure and promise unfulfilled. And I think it's noteworthy how the Wolves shouldn't take anything for granted as they embark on this journey. Imagine KAT leaving the organization just as the championships are ready to stack up. And what if Andrew were to develop injury issues like Penny did just as he was entering his prime? I guess my point is nothing is guaranteed, no matter how promising we look today. Hopefully our front office is smart enough to avoid the pitfalls that doomed Orlando.

Toward the end Shaq said something very interesting. Even with all the titles he won as a Laker, and all the fame and money his stint in LA brought him, he said he wished he would have stayed in Orlando. Further, he mused that the league should mandate that once you are drafted by an organization you should be bound to that team. He was saying this not so much to protect the teams interest, but rather that the players would be better off. His experience had taught him that. Just a very good special and I would recommend it to you if haven't seen it yet.

[JasonIsDaMan [enjin:7981157]]

No it doesn't. I live in Orlando, and I can't stress this enough: The '95 Orlando Magic, top to bottom, is the biggest collection of assholes god ever blessed with a vertical, from their asshole brownshirt owner all the way down to the asshole TV broadcast team complete with Matty Goukas badmouthing every other city worse than Blyleven ever dreamed of.

The only two redeemable human beings are Anderson and Hill. Yeah, Anderson was effected by those 4 free throws. Most people would be. Penny would have call the sports station to tell everybody they were blessed to have seen it. Anderson was also frozen out by Shaq. So Shaq freezes a guy out because HE MISSED FOUR FREE THROWS! He made it through a year of college without learning what irony was. You know, because he's an asshole.

Penny Hardaway gets Brian Hill fired for telling him he was playing poorly. He was, but you can't tell an asshole that. When they showed the clip of Kobe and Shaq, and he said "That was my championship", I spit out my soda 20 feet. Now he thinks he better than Kobe. You know why? Because....well, you know.

My favorite line is by Jeff Turner, Orlando Magic Radio Colorman, (who makes me wish they only had one guy like the Wolves do). He said something to the effect of "Even Sam Cassell had a 30 point game". OK, first of all, Cassell is better than Turner. Second, between the '95 finals and the '88 Olympics, you can argue that Turner was involved in two of the 10 most embarrassing sports results of the past 30 years (don't get me wrong, the January 2001 NFC Championship game is #1 with a bullet), but has time to take a shot at Cassell. You know why? Because...well, you know.

Jason Kidd and Jimmy Jackson got into a feud over Toni Braxton. Shaq and Penny got into a feud over....Lil' Penny.

I could address some of the other things about Grant, Bowie, and the media guys who you don't know so it won't mean anything, but the internet isn't big enough.

Fun game: Rewatch the doc, and after each segment, say "You know why? Cause you're an asshole." If works.

But to address your finer points: Shaq left because the Magic owner played hardball on salary. If Taylor does that, gets what he deserves, and maybe some of the energy you guys put into making up trade threads could be used for an organized boycott.

Who is the 2nd star? Dieng? Rubio? Don't get me wrong, I am rooting for Wiggins, but lets pump the brakes on the "Star" thing.

Seriously? That "one team" line? Only an asshole plays for 5 or 6 teams, bad mouths all of them on his way out the door, then says that. Know your history. Shaq wouldn't have changed a thing. He delivered that line about as well as he delivered any line in "Blue Chips" or "Kazzam". Why? I don't know. Maybe they paid him more. Maybe he's serious about running for Orange (FL) County Sheriff. Or maybe they gave him producer credit, like Jalen Rose refused to give Chris Weber.

The bad news is the Wolves are no-where near that level of talent at this time. The good news is they are made up of WAAAAY better people.

[Coolbreeze44]

Jason, you could have just stated your last paragraph and left it at that. But at least I gave you a forum for all the vitriol you've been storing up for 20 years.

[JasonIsDaMan [enjin:7981157]]

Jason, you could have just stated your last paragraph and left it at that. But at least I gave you a forum for all the vitriol you've been storing up for 20 years.

I have friends down here who are also transplants. We all watched that doc and laughed our hindquarters off reliving it later. So not really storing it up.

This is what bothers me: Wolves fan, and fans of other teams, are watching that doc and thinking "could that be us?". It really can't, and the thing that bugs me the most is if everyone would have given honest answers, it would be clear that it was the perfect confluence of ego, greed, and hubris. In other words, assholes.

I mean seriously, Shaq? Even if you don't know about all the times he badmouthed the last team and/or coach he played for, how about all the stories and/or lawsuits over him picking up 5'8' 180 pound guys and bodyslamming them? And this "one team" thing? Is that a two-way street? Does a team have to keep a guy as long as he's willing to show up and play? So do the Wolves owe Ndubi Ebi back salary?

[Coolbreeze44]

Jason, you could have just stated your last paragraph and left it at that. But at least I gave you a forum for all the vitriol you've been storing up for 20 years.

I have friends down here who are also transplants. We all watched that doc and laughed our hindquarters off reliving it later. So not really storing it up.

This is what bothers me: Wolves fan, and fans of other teams, are watching that doc and thinking "could that be us?". It really can't, and the thing that bugs me the most is if everyone would have given honest answers, it would be clear that it was the perfect confluence of ego, greed, and hubris. In other words, assholes.

I mean seriously, Shaq? Even if you don't know about all the times he badmouthed the last team and/or coach he played for, how about all the stories and/or lawsuits over him picking up 5'8' 180 pound guys and bodyslamming them? And this "one team" thing? Is that a two-way street? Does a team have to keep a guy as long as he's willing to show up and play? So do the Wolves owe Ndubi Ebi back salary?

I'm just the messenger with my first post. I thought it was interesting. My main point is that there are parallels that can be drawn between the two franchises at the point the Wolves are at now. I'm not saying we have the same amount of talent, or that the quality of the individuals are the same. But the Orlando situation showed just how quickly things can go South.

[JasonIsDaMan [enjin:7981157]]

Point taken.

All I can say is relax. If you had lived through it, you would see that there really isn't a parallel with the Wolves, or anywhere in MIN sports.

The closest I can come up with is that last team Jerry Burns coached. Dennis Green came in and cleaned out the barn. Pressure-washed it. Now imagine he kept and coddled them, guys like Ray Berry and Keith Millard. Still not in the same ballpark.

[Papalrep]

Holy shit Jason, interesting thread. Thanks.

[JasonIsDaMan [enjin:7981157]]

Holy shit Jason, interesting thread. Thanks.

Anything I can do to help, Father Sarducci. Sorry about the coarse language.

Right now, I am 75% worried about the Wolves talent level and 1% worried about their character.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Am I the only one worried about the next CBA?

Right now, it's favorable for young stars to stick with their drafted teams for their FIRST extension. But not so after that...

But the NBA is actively moving toward more player movement (to mimic the NFL?) for some reason. The sad thing is it keeps the NBA in news cycles year round and I wouldn't be surprised if the new CBA opens it up even more?



[Note: It's probably just my Pessimist Abe persona kicking into overdrive...]

[JasonIsDaMan [enjin:7981157]]

Am I the only one worried about the next CBA?

Right now, it's favorable for young stars to stick with their drafted teams for their FIRST extension. But not so after that...

But the NBA is actively moving toward more player movement (to mimic the NFL?) for some reason. The sad thing is it keeps the NBA in news cycles year round and I wouldn't be surprised if the new CBA opens it up even more?



[Note: It's probably just my Pessimist Abe persona kicking into overdrive...]

You raise good points. But it's not the length contracts that concern me, or even the money. Right now, MIN can keep KAT for 9 years, even if he hated it there, which he doesn't seem to.

This is the part that concerns me: every new lockout, in which the owners kick the players out of the building so they can argue amongst themselves, ends up with owners removing rules that help them. Like hat lockout where Dan Gilbert spearheaded all those changes in trade rules because he was still raw about Lebron. If I am an owner of a MID-MARKET (though the 7cma is the smallest in terms of 4-team markets, it is still around 15th, placing it in the middle) team like the Wolves, I would want every loophole imaginable to keep players, or if they are dead set on leaving, benefiting from that the most I possibly could.

Removing the "sign-and-trade" loophole was just dumb. If a player is leaving, and the only way a contract can be insured is if he signs it with his current team, that is a chip. Use it. If the only way I can make a trade work is to sign one of my assistants to a player contract and include him in a trade, I do it.

The funny thing is: A lot of the moves the owners made were to eliminate "super teams" in "sexy {sic} markets". Now nobody wants to play for the Knicks or Lakers, Phoenix and Orlando are bad, MIA is over the hill and very expensive based on their standing, and there's a Super team in Sexy(?) Cleveland. Life is funny sometimes.