Interesting Article on the Triangle

[SameOldNudityDrew]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/28/sports/basketball/phil-jackson-knicks-triangle-offense-nba.html

It's tough to come away from this article without respecting the triangle offense a little bit.

Rambis was a bum, so even if he had the right personnel (not Jonny Flynn) to run it, he probably would have had a lot of trouble with buy-in.

And Carmelo is not a guy you want to build around at all, especially not an offense that requires floor-vision, savviness, and passing. So I see New York having problems until they get the right players to fit this system. Plus Derek Fisher is still young and untested. So the odds look long in New York, but it's interesting to think of how this offensive style (if not a formal system) has influenced the Spurs and the Warriors.

It's long, but worth the read.

[GymRat [enjin:6592663]]

Jackson has been criticizing offenses around the league for years. There really are only a couple that would be considered "beautiful" by his standards, the same by which he measures The Triangle. He's right in that The Triangle is a morphing offense, and it has the capacity to evolve within a game based on what is working, what is not, who is on the floor, etc. Today's myriad offenses typically have a couple strong go-to sets, but when they fail, players are quick to iso or simply reset and try again from a different spot on the floor. And it's usually the same ball handler throughout.

[thedoper]

This was a great article. New york still has some talented journalists there I have to say. The summary I pull out of it really is the same in any sport: Systems are there to facilitate talent. But for a certain type of team, the triangle or hybrids of it can make for beautiful, unique basketball. I do think that Okafor slipped to the Knicks that would be great for them and for showcasing his talents provided that Fisher himself actually understands the triangle.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

This article reinforces numerous themes in my mind:

- Our basketball development system in the U.S. emphasizes individual "on the ball" skills versus team, off the ball skills. The result is some of the most supremely gifted one-on-one players in the world, but that in turn informs the style of play that Phil Jackson rails against.

- If Phil Jackson really wants to make a difference in how the game is played, he should get involved at the youth AAU levels of ball: It's an awesome platform for supremely gifted athletes to feature their skills and compete against the best. As for breeding High-IQ players that understand how to play in a read-and-react system? Not so much.

- As much as basketball aficianados might love read-and-react offenses with tons of ball movement, coaches ultimately use what works and wins games. Sometimes iso-ball and 2-man PnR with everyone else standing around is truly the best option available. Go back to the youth developmental system if you want to change that reality.

- I've never seen a successful formula at the NBA level where the system comes first, the players come next. It's always the other way around - adapting to the talent you have. I wish the Knicks were a Western Conference team!

[Coolbreeze44]

This article reinforces numerous themes in my mind:

- Our basketball development system in the U.S. emphasizes individual "on the ball" skills versus team, off the ball skills. The result is some of the most supremely gifted one-on-one players in the world, but that in turn informs the style of play that Phil Jackson rails against.

- If Phil Jackson really wants to make a difference in how the game is played, he should get involved at the youth AAU levels of ball: It's an awesome platform for supremely gifted athletes to feature their skills and compete against the best. As for breeding High-IQ players that understand how to play in a read-and-react system? Not so much.

- As much as basketball aficianados might love read-and-react offenses with tons of ball movement, coaches ultimately use what works and wins games. Sometimes iso-ball and 2-man PnR with everyone else standing around is truly the best option available. Go back to the youth developmental system if you want to change that reality.

- I've never seen a successful formula at the NBA level where the system comes first, the players come next. It's always the other way around - adapting to the talent you have. I wish the Knicks were a Western Conference team!

Excellent critique - totally agree

[SameOldNudityDrew]

Part of the problem is there's so much turnover in rosters and coaching in the NBA. This kind of offense requires the players to be able to "read and react" to each other on the floor, and you can't do that unless you've played a lot together. It's no surprise that the team that plays the closest type of basketball to this is the Spurs, who have basically kept their core together for ages compared to other teams these days.

Another thought: Frank Kaminsky would be perfect for this system. I get that the Knicks would be smart to try to trade down to get him, but I wonder why people are so down on Kaminsky in general. The dude can play! How does the consensus know he won't be good at the next level? I believe the experts, but I'm not sure why I believe them. What's the logic?

[Monster]

"- I've never seen a successful formula at the NBA level where the system comes first, the players come next. It's always the other way around - adapting to the talent you have. I wish the Knicks were a Western Conference team!"

I agree Q and that's what made Winter and Phil so special. The complimented each other.

This was a fantastic read. Half of me really wants to see Phil have some good success building the Knicks (and there are a lot of good true smart knicks fans that deserve better) and part of me hopes he fails. He is a polarizing figure but he is also pretty entertaining and obviously has a great basketball mind and a smart person in general.

[BizarroJerry [enjin:6592520]]

I agree Drew. I'm a Kaminsky fan too. I think he'll be an all star.

[thedoper]

Wanted to bump this thread to talk Jackson some more. I am on record saying that I think Porzingis wont be great, but I absolutely love the stones on Jackson. The Grant move was a nice trade from them. This stuff about Carmello not being happy is hilarious. I know these moves are risky. But I love his moxy. It is the only way that you can be in the NY market. They have to strip it down. Jackson is playing coy but they need to trade Melo when the time is right.

[bleedspeed]

Wanted to bump this thread to talk Jackson some more. I am on record saying that I think Porzingis wont be great, but I absolutely love the stones on Jackson. The Grant move was a nice trade from them. This stuff about Carmello not being happy is hilarious. I know these moves are risky. But I love his moxy. It is the only way that you can be in the NY market. They have to strip it down. Jackson is playing coy but they need to trade Melo when the time is right.

Phil needs to call the Cavs and workout a S&T between the Knicks and Cavs. Melo joins his friend LeBron and Love get to be the man with the Knicks and would be great in the triangle.