mrhockey89 wrote:I don't think it's so much that people are down on Kevin Martin, but if we got Klay Thompson, then Martin is a bench player making starter money, and on the wrong side of his prime, especially if we take in 2 wing players in the trade/draft. Really, Martin has more value to the team that doesn't have a SG than the team that does.
I'd also argue that Pekovic may be the 2nd best scorer on our team behind Love.
K-Mart's value isn't dependent on the team he's on. He's a scorer that makes $6.5M a year, which is pretty reasonable. Doesn't depend on athleticism, relies on his jumper and getting to the foul line. Two aspects of his game that shouldn't leave him as he gets older, especially if his minutes are kept in check.
Martin averaged more PPG and played in more games than Pekovic last year. Obviously Martin's stats go down if Thompson was acquired, but judging by our team last year, Martin was the clear No. 2 in the majority of the games.
I disagree. If we trade for Klay then we've got Klay, Shabazz, Budinger, and Martin (assuming you don't count Shved) as 2 guards. (Budinger is a swing player, but plays some SG)
If you're Golden State, you've got Jordan Crawford and....Marshon Brooks maybe at SG? Minnesota could much more afford to let go of a shooting guard than Golden State at that point.
Martin also played more minutes and took more shots than Pekovic, and the numbers were pretty close....and let's face it, if we got Thompson, Pekovic would score far more PPG than Martin next year.
I would take Brooks and Crawford over Shved and bud..We would have nothing at SG after Clay if we traded martin... I thought Bazz&Bud were more of a SF? Go look at the roster martin and jeffers are the oonly 2 listed as SG.
mrhockey89 wrote:I don't think it's so much that people are down on Kevin Martin, but if we got Klay Thompson, then Martin is a bench player making starter money, and on the wrong side of his prime, especially if we take in 2 wing players in the trade/draft. Really, Martin has more value to the team that doesn't have a SG than the team that does.
I'd also argue that Pekovic may be the 2nd best scorer on our team behind Love.
K-Mart's value isn't dependent on the team he's on. He's a scorer that makes $6.5M a year, which is pretty reasonable. Doesn't depend on athleticism, relies on his jumper and getting to the foul line. Two aspects of his game that shouldn't leave him as he gets older, especially if his minutes are kept in check.
Martin averaged more PPG and played in more games than Pekovic last year. Obviously Martin's stats go down if Thompson was acquired, but judging by our team last year, Martin was the clear No. 2 in the majority of the games.
I disagree. If we trade for Klay then we've got Klay, Shabazz, Budinger, and Martin (assuming you don't count Shved) as 2 guards. (Budinger is a swing player, but plays some SG)
If you're Golden State, you've got Jordan Crawford and....Marshon Brooks maybe at SG? Minnesota could much more afford to let go of a shooting guard than Golden State at that point.
Martin also played more minutes and took more shots than Pekovic, and the numbers were pretty close....and let's face it, if we got Thompson, Pekovic would score far more PPG than Martin next year.
Shabazz and Budinger are small forwards. Shved doesn't count because he's irrelevant to this franchise.
So we send Golden State K-Mart as a favor? Here you go Warriors. We'll take your shitty trade package AND give you the third best player in the trade because you'll need a SG after you acquire our All-NBA PF. Have fun in the playoffs!
The point is, their package sucks as it is with Thompson/Lee. Barely sending anything of importance for Love. Throwing in Martin just makes the deal that much worse.
Also, I'm pretty sure the Warriors would just run a Curry/Iggy/Green/Love/Bogut lineup at that point, which is still an upgrade over what they have now. No need for us to giftwrap Martin for them.
...Pek would score more than Martin next year because Martin would be our 6th man! I already said this.
mrhockey89 wrote:I don't think it's so much that people are down on Kevin Martin, but if we got Klay Thompson, then Martin is a bench player making starter money, and on the wrong side of his prime, especially if we take in 2 wing players in the trade/draft. Really, Martin has more value to the team that doesn't have a SG than the team that does.
I'd also argue that Pekovic may be the 2nd best scorer on our team behind Love.
K-Mart's value isn't dependent on the team he's on. He's a scorer that makes $6.5M a year, which is pretty reasonable. Doesn't depend on athleticism, relies on his jumper and getting to the foul line. Two aspects of his game that shouldn't leave him as he gets older, especially if his minutes are kept in check.
Martin averaged more PPG and played in more games than Pekovic last year. Obviously Martin's stats go down if Thompson was acquired, but judging by our team last year, Martin was the clear No. 2 in the majority of the games.
I disagree. If we trade for Klay then we've got Klay, Shabazz, Budinger, and Martin (assuming you don't count Shved) as 2 guards. (Budinger is a swing player, but plays some SG)
If you're Golden State, you've got Jordan Crawford and....Marshon Brooks maybe at SG? Minnesota could much more afford to let go of a shooting guard than Golden State at that point.
Martin also played more minutes and took more shots than Pekovic, and the numbers were pretty close....and let's face it, if we got Thompson, Pekovic would score far more PPG than Martin next year.
Shabazz and Budinger are small forwards. Shved doesn't count because he's irrelevant to this franchise.
So we send Golden State K-Mart as a favor? Here you go Warriors. We'll take your shitty trade package AND give you the third best player in the trade because you'll need a SG after you acquire our All-NBA PF. Have fun in the playoffs!
The point is, their package sucks as it is with Thompson/Lee. Barely sending anything of importance for Love. Throwing in Martin just makes the deal that much worse.
Also, I'm pretty sure the Warriors would just run a Curry/Iggy/Green/Love/Bogut lineup at that point, which is still an upgrade over what they have now. No need for us to giftwrap Martin for them.
...Pek would score more than Martin next year because Martin would be our 6th man! I already said this.
Shabazz and Budinger are both wing players who play both SF and SG. Is Duncan a PF or a C? Same difference.
I guess I find it interesting that you are up in arms about losing Martin, who would be a backup for us, yet completely dismiss David Lee, who would be starting for us and is arguably a better player than Martin. (Not saying I'm a Lee guy, Martin is no better than Lee..so it boils down to Love vs Klay+a draft pick. Obviously Love is a better player than Klay, but Klay is (a bit) younger, and on a much smaller salary, and a 2 way player who IS a prototypical shooting guard, something that always troubled us with Love since he's fairly one dimensional). So really, it boils down to this..
What is our best option?
Staring contest with Love and see who blinks?
Adding Klay Thompson?
Adding draft picks?
We're definitely not getting an established player better than Klay in return for Love..so those really are our 3 options. We can't manufacture trades that don't exist, unless your name is Chris Broussard
Have you seen bud and bazz play SG? Yeah it's pretty ugly lol... You can't compare that to timmy playing C/Pf because he can actually do it unlike bud/Bazz...Or maybe they can just play JJ more at Sg lmao....I have yet to see a rumerd deal for love that martin is involed in,Just read it on here is all....Are bench was joke last year and moving martin&Brewer there would make a big differnce imo....
Shabazz and Budinger are small forwards. Neither are advanced enough with the ball to create off the dribble and neither can guard SGs. I guess Pekovic is a power forward now...
I dismiss Lee because he makes $30M in the next two years. That's ugly. Not to mention he absolutely has to be in the trade to match salaries. His involvement in this trade is a given; Martin's is not.
If Thompson/Lee/Barnes really is the best offer we get, I'll take my chances with Flip coaching the team and try to make the Wolves into a playoff team before the trade deadline. If we're not playing up to par, that Thompson/Lee deal is still going to be there.
And if it's not, I'm sure there will be someone else willing to trade for Love. We don't have to make this deal pre-season if it's a bad package.
Well, Chase played more minutes and was more effective for the Wolves last year at SG than he did/was at SF. And Shabazz is good with his post up game, but makes for a bit of a tweener 3 while he's a bit slow and his lack of comfort with outside shooting makes him a non ideal 2.
The reason I bring them up is because they will get time at both wing positions, which means less time for someone else. And I think you're taking my comments out of context anyway as I'm not suggesting I'd want to trade Martin,what I'm suggesting is that he may be a key in the trade if we want to do the Klay trade.
Like everyone else, my ideal trade is for #1 overall. My 2nd choice would be to Boston IF they were willing to give us Sullinger+#6+both Brooklyn picks (and possibly even another one of their own). Beyond those trades, Golden State would be my next choice. I think it's almost to the point of no return for Love, and a trade deadline deal won't work.
I still don't get why you're so down on Klay. He's much more than an average player. If you trade a star, you're not going to get equal value in return, but a high end 2-way player who fits perfectly with your team needs is a rarity in itself, and that's what Klay represents.
Martin can only play one position and that can't happen coming off the bench if we get a starter who plays more than 30 minutes a game at the 2. Then you are paying 6 million for 18> minutes a night as he can't move over to the 3 and doesn't have the handle for a 1. You might be able to get away with playing Klay at the 3, but then you are taking minutes away from a position where we already have 4 guys on the roster. If we get 2 who can play some backup 1, then I think you keep him, but he's not worth keeping if you have less than 20 minutes to play him. His lack of handles and quality shot creation just make him an overpriced shooter off the bench at that point.
Khans, by saying Martin can only play one position, I think you are suggesting that he and Klay can't be on the court at the same time. I disagree, and think that Martin would still get 20 minutes off the bench if we traded for Klay...and what a nice couple of 3-point targets Martin and Thompson would be for Rubio. Yes, this would limit the minutes our current glut of small forwards would get, but based on performance last year, is that really a big sacrifice?
