LST packing for home - Wolves vs Jazz GDT

[Monster]

Payne has been a big bright spot, I don't take much into SL, but he looks a lot more in control and so does Brown (not saying he didn't before) and Towns looks rushed on offense, it will come though with playing time.

The thing to be truly optimistic about Payne is his defense looks much better. His ability to stay in front of guys has been pretty good.

[Monster]

Heslip missed a FT. I'm gonna say it here Heslip is a dissappointment.

[SameOldNudityDrew]

Payne has been a big bright spot, I don't take much into SL, but he looks a lot more in control and so does Brown (not saying he didn't before) and Towns looks rushed on offense, it will come though with playing time.

The thing to be truly optimistic about Payne is his defense looks much better. His ability to stay in front of guys has been pretty good.

I think Payne has played pretty well this summer, but I actually thought he was halfway decent for us last year. I feel like he became a punching bag on this board somewhat unfairly. He wasn't great, but I think we have been too quick to judge him because he played four years of college and because we set the bar high for him since we traded a first round pick for him (and most of us seem to think we can pull another Paul George or Kawhi Leonard out of our ass with any given future first rounder).

Bottom line: I think he's got the makings of a pretty good role player who fits our roster, and that is almost certainly more than Bennett will ever become. He's long and athletic. He's not a stopper, but he defends solid (I'd argue 2 or 3 positions because of his lateral quickness). He can score at the rim, on the perimeter, and in between. And--importantly--he hustles and communicates, which are the kind of intangible skills you want.

Now, he should stand out in summer league because he does have more experience than some of these guys. But I'd encourage people to really think about what he brings to the table and how he could be a part of this team. He's not going to give us that Clipper game every other night. But he could become a good, versatile hustle/glue guy who can do the little things and be a threat for a double double. I'd definitely rather have him than Bennett.

[60WinTim]

Thank you, Drew! And I thought I was the only Payne supporter last year. I guess there were 2 of us...

[SameOldNudityDrew]

Yeah. And I think it would be nice to establish a constructive discussion of Payne at some point (so we don't devolve into a Thaddeus Young type pit fight this season!).

I think Monster was one of the more thoughtful critics of Payne. Here's what monster wrote on the "Guys we're NOT talking about" thread a month or so ago. Summer league's not over, but I think monster was prescient to say it will be interesting to see Payne's performance in the SL.

So what do you guys think of Payne? Any other supporters out there? Anybody changing their mind? Anybody see a D-Leaguer despite his performance in SL? What say you?



"I am gonna do it...talk about Payne. He looks to be on the roster for the best 2 years and we now have a better idea what the front putt looks like with Towns and Bjelica on board so what does that mean for Payne? Keep in mind I am not a fan of his as a basketball player.

He may not get too many minutes even on the nights that Pek and KG don't play. He has the length to play as a center but got pushed around bigtime last year. A lot of teams don't play a true center off the bench anyway so he may be able to play there some anyway or pair with Dieng or Towns and figure out the best/worst case of who each guy should match up with.

What is to like about Payne?

1. Length and athletic ability. He has legit center length and his explosive athletic ability is well above average. Sadly a lot of times he doesn't seem to use these traits too well.

That's not quite it but I don't want to go overboard here either. The thing I think that MAY separate Payne from the length athletic guy you find in the D-league is he has a theoretical jumpshot so he has some sort of offensive weapon that some guys don't have. Last year it looked bad most of the time.

If you want to take an optimistic view of Payne you hope he finds his jumper and it's just enough to be effective. Lo would say he played hard and then offensively too fast and then he probably tried to slow down. He might have been a little less likely to crash around after taking out Dieng idk.

We have discussed his weaknesses pretty extensively but it will be interesting to see him in SL. It's just a few games in a contrived setting but I do think you can see growth of a player from one season to the next in what they do or don't do or can't do. It would be nice if he makes some sort of step forward and becomes halfway decent. Imagine if he could even be an Anthony Tolliver type impact guy? He has a ways to go to be even that good (kinda sad) but I'd take that right now."

[Coolbreeze44]

I've always been on the side of "let's not rush to judgment on Payne". I like his toughness and hustle and still he think he can be a nice player for us.

[TAFKASP]

Regarding Payne, he's on the wrong team if he's looking for fans who'll hang onto the "He has all the tools..." sales pitch. I'm not saying he doesn't, nor am I saying he won't put it together and be a positive asset for this team going forward. I'm only saying this team has been burdened with to many players with the body and athleticism but not the brains nor instincts to ever truly play at an NBA level. We've had players with star capability in the first two categories but running on empty in the last two.

I think Payne takes a beating because many don't want to get their hopes up only to once again be disappointed. I'll admit it, I'm a bit gun shy.

[Monster]

Regarding Payne, he's on the wrong team if he's looking for fans who'll hang onto the "He has all the tools..." sales pitch. I'm not saying he doesn't, nor am I saying he won't put it together and be a positive asset for this team going forward. I'm only saying this team has been burdened with to many players with the body and athleticism but not the brains nor instincts to ever truly play at an NBA level. We've had players with star capability in the first two categories but running on empty in the last two.

I think Payne takes a beating because many don't want to get their hopes up only to once again be disappointed. I'll admit it, I'm a bit gun shy.

Yep you nailed it.

I pretend he was a 2nd rounder and see if I am happy with how he has done. Based on 3 SL games this year (small sample) I am pretty happy. You could make an arguement he has been the Wolves best player.

[TAFKASP]

Regarding Payne, he's on the wrong team if he's looking for fans who'll hang onto the "He has all the tools..." sales pitch. I'm not saying he doesn't, nor am I saying he won't put it together and be a positive asset for this team going forward. I'm only saying this team has been burdened with to many players with the body and athleticism but not the brains nor instincts to ever truly play at an NBA level. We've had players with star capability in the first two categories but running on empty in the last two.

I think Payne takes a beating because many don't want to get their hopes up only to once again be disappointed. I'll admit it, I'm a bit gun shy.

Yep you nailed it.

I pretend he was a 2nd rounder and see if I am happy with how he has done. Based on 3 SL games this year (small sample) I am pretty happy. You could make an arguement he has been the Wolves best player.

The thing is you don't even have to pretend he's a second rounder. When you're drafting in the middle of the first round which is at best the pick we gave up you're hoping for a solid rotation player, not a star. Yes, on rare occasion teams find a star, but it's far more likely they find a dud. If Payne can develop into a solid backup at the 4/5 he will have been a good pickup!

[Monster]

Regarding Payne, he's on the wrong team if he's looking for fans who'll hang onto the "He has all the tools..." sales pitch. I'm not saying he doesn't, nor am I saying he won't put it together and be a positive asset for this team going forward. I'm only saying this team has been burdened with to many players with the body and athleticism but not the brains nor instincts to ever truly play at an NBA level. We've had players with star capability in the first two categories but running on empty in the last two.

I think Payne takes a beating because many don't want to get their hopes up only to once again be disappointed. I'll admit it, I'm a bit gun shy.

Yep you nailed it.

I pretend he was a 2nd rounder and see if I am happy with how he has done. Based on 3 SL games this year (small sample) I am pretty happy. You could make an arguement he has been the Wolves best player.

The thing is you don't even have to pretend he's a second rounder. When you're drafting in the middle of the first round which is at best the pick we gave up you're hoping for a solid rotation player, not a star. Yes, on rare occasion teams find a star, but it's far more likely they find a dud. If Payne can develop into a solid backup at the 4/5 he will have been a good pickup!

Yeah that's true I absolutely agree. I also think it's reasonable to have a little higher expectations for a guy that was drafted in the first round and Incant quite get over that (plus I wasn't a fan of him at that spot) so thinking of him as a 2nd rounder or maybe late first let's me maybe be more rational about what he is or isn't. I should probably do the same for Bennett.