CoolBreeze44 wrote:If i was the Wolves I'd be focusing on Knox. I might even give away Butler and a #1 for that. Of course we would need some salary filler coming back.
I agree that Knox should be one of the top players we should be targeting. That said I would not give a #1. No reason for it especially when lottery players have such a high variance in how their career will be. Im high on Knox but that doesn't mean he will be an all star player.
It is essential we get value in return. A few ideas:
LAC receive: Jimmy Butler and Gorgui Dieng
MIN receive: Tobias Harris, Patrick Beverley, Marcin Gortat and a 2019 2nd round pick
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BKN receive: Jimmy Butler and Gorgui Dieng
MIN receive: Allen Crabbe, DeMarre Carrol, Jarrett Allen and 2019 1st round pick (DEN).
Or
BKN receive: Jimmy Butler, Gorgui Dieng
MIN receive: Allen Crabbe, DeMarre Carrol, Caris LeVert and Jarrett Allen
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PHI receive: Jimmy Butler
MIN receives: Robert Covington and Markelle Fultz
____________________________________
My favourite trade partner would be the Nets. Sean Marks has done a terrific job getting Brooklyn back on their feet after the mess he inherited and now has a few assets up his sleeve. We may be able to get a somewhat even return as he will be intrigued by adding a superstar to pair with Russell and the young nucleus they have there. They would also have the capspace to potentially lure Irving away from the Celtics.
This may sound weird to the board, but knowing we are moving on from Butler has me excited and looking forward to the season. For some reason I have hope again. I think believing it was going to be Thibs and the ex-Bulls put a hard cap on our potential. At least now we have a chance to build again, even if it means waiting a couple years. If they can Thibs soon all the better.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:If i was the Wolves I'd be focusing on Knox. I might even give away Butler and a #1 for that. Of course we would need some salary filler coming back.
The Knicks are not giving you Knox. If the Knicks wanna basically devalue everything they say from here on out to their fans, they fall into another one of these win quick scams. They're gonna be evaluating their young talent all year and then spend when they need to next summer. Not one Knicks fan is even clamoring for Butler right now
CoolBreeze44 wrote:How about Knox? I have to believe Butler could fetch him. May not get much more than that but it's enough for me.
KiwiMatt wrote:I wonder if Philly would bite on a Butler for Covington and Fultz deal.
A starting lineup for the 76ers of Simmons, Reddick, Butler, Saric and Embiid is scary good and would have a chance of getting past Boston in the East.
KiwiMatt wrote:I wonder if Philly would bite on a Butler for Covington and Fultz deal.
A starting lineup for the 76ers of Simmons, Reddick, Butler, Saric and Embiid is scary good and would have a chance of getting past Boston in the East.
Philly is loaded even after drafting two high busts in Okafor and Noel and a disappointment in Fullz. I wish the Wolves had approached building our team that way-PATIENTLY. We should have looked to ensure we have three deserving young max players before blowing our capspace. KAT-hell yeah, Wiggs-not so much and Jimmy-a stud, but he's old, injury plagued and a cancer (hell nah). Impatience by Taylor and Pibbs puts us in a situation where we now have to hope Wiggs can be the player we hoped he'd be and hope Taylor can find a coach to help maximize the talents of Wiggs and that we can somehow find another young cornerstone.
There's patience and then there's asking a fanbase who waited for 12 years to wait 3-4 more years without even knowing if there will be a payoff to all of this suffering. The ones who say "well we shoulda waited a couple more years" basically want us to pretend the last 10+ years didn't happen and that's not fair to the fans and it reinforces this idea that this organization doesn't mind losing forever.
If Wiggins had been the guy most thought he'd be, there woulda never been a need to add Butler.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:How about Knox? I have to believe Butler could fetch him. May not get much more than that but it's enough for me.
KiwiMatt wrote:I wonder if Philly would bite on a Butler for Covington and Fultz deal.
A starting lineup for the 76ers of Simmons, Reddick, Butler, Saric and Embiid is scary good and would have a chance of getting past Boston in the East.
KiwiMatt wrote:I wonder if Philly would bite on a Butler for Covington and Fultz deal.
A starting lineup for the 76ers of Simmons, Reddick, Butler, Saric and Embiid is scary good and would have a chance of getting past Boston in the East.
Philly is loaded even after drafting two high busts in Okafor and Noel and a disappointment in Fullz. I wish the Wolves had approached building our team that way-PATIENTLY. We should have looked to ensure we have three deserving young max players before blowing our capspace. KAT-hell yeah, Wiggs-not so much and Jimmy-a stud, but he's old, injury plagued and a cancer (hell nah). Impatience by Taylor and Pibbs puts us in a situation where we now have to hope Wiggs can be the player we hoped he'd be and hope Taylor can find a coach to help maximize the talents of Wiggs and that we can somehow find another young cornerstone.
There's patience and then there's asking a fanbase who waited for 12 years to wait 3-4 more years without even knowing if there will be a payoff to all of this suffering. The ones who say "well we shoulda waited a couple more years" basically want us to pretend the last 10+ years didn't happen and that's not fair to the fans and it reinforces this idea that this organization doesn't mind losing forever.
If Wiggins had been the guy most thought he'd be, there woulda never been a need to add Butler.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:How about Knox? I have to believe Butler could fetch him. May not get much more than that but it's enough for me.
KiwiMatt wrote:I wonder if Philly would bite on a Butler for Covington and Fultz deal.
A starting lineup for the 76ers of Simmons, Reddick, Butler, Saric and Embiid is scary good and would have a chance of getting past Boston in the East.
KiwiMatt wrote:I wonder if Philly would bite on a Butler for Covington and Fultz deal.
A starting lineup for the 76ers of Simmons, Reddick, Butler, Saric and Embiid is scary good and would have a chance of getting past Boston in the East.
Philly is loaded even after drafting two high busts in Okafor and Noel and a disappointment in Fullz. I wish the Wolves had approached building our team that way-PATIENTLY. We should have looked to ensure we have three deserving young max players before blowing our capspace. KAT-hell yeah, Wiggs-not so much and Jimmy-a stud, but he's old, injury plagued and a cancer (hell nah). Impatience by Taylor and Pibbs puts us in a situation where we now have to hope Wiggs can be the player we hoped he'd be and hope Taylor can find a coach to help maximize the talents of Wiggs and that we can somehow find another young cornerstone.
There's patience and then there's asking a fanbase who waited for 12 years to wait 3-4 more years without even knowing if there will be a payoff to all of this suffering. The ones who say "well we shoulda waited a couple more years" basically want us to pretend the last 10+ years didn't happen and that's not fair to the fans and it reinforces this idea that this organization doesn't mind losing forever.
If Wiggins had been the guy most thought he'd be, there woulda never been a need to add Butler.
So what are you suggesting they do?
I'm saying what they did in adding Butler was smart. Everything else after that didn't make a ton of sense other than adding Taj and even that cost us a ton of money. Philly was down with trusting the process because they're a town and a franchise that wasn't interested anymore in being a team that either made the playoffs and lost in the first round or semis or picked 11th. For us, a playoff berth is the equivalent of a conference finals appearance for everyone else. What everyone forgets is that we needed to see this team produce while these guys were on rookie deals. Instead, everyone was down with tanking, with getting as high of a pick as possible, with rationalizing the thought of "I'd rather have a lotto pick with .05 percent chance of winning the lotto than making the playoffs and losing in round 1." If that's the mentality, this team will always be afraid to take the next step. As far as I'm concerned, the Butler trade was a success.
Towns/Wiggins/LaVine/Dunn eventually would have all gotten paid for showing you nothing but losing. Plan B would have meant admitting none of those guys were the guys you needed and you woulda started all over again anyway. Regarding Wiggins, the EASY decision was not to give him a max deal if you questioned whether he deserved it in the first place like Glen Taylor did.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:How about Knox? I have to believe Butler could fetch him. May not get much more than that but it's enough for me.
KiwiMatt wrote:I wonder if Philly would bite on a Butler for Covington and Fultz deal.
A starting lineup for the 76ers of Simmons, Reddick, Butler, Saric and Embiid is scary good and would have a chance of getting past Boston in the East.
KiwiMatt wrote:I wonder if Philly would bite on a Butler for Covington and Fultz deal.
A starting lineup for the 76ers of Simmons, Reddick, Butler, Saric and Embiid is scary good and would have a chance of getting past Boston in the East.
Philly is loaded even after drafting two high busts in Okafor and Noel and a disappointment in Fullz. I wish the Wolves had approached building our team that way-PATIENTLY. We should have looked to ensure we have three deserving young max players before blowing our capspace. KAT-hell yeah, Wiggs-not so much and Jimmy-a stud, but he's old, injury plagued and a cancer (hell nah). Impatience by Taylor and Pibbs puts us in a situation where we now have to hope Wiggs can be the player we hoped he'd be and hope Taylor can find a coach to help maximize the talents of Wiggs and that we can somehow find another young cornerstone.
There's patience and then there's asking a fanbase who waited for 12 years to wait 3-4 more years without even knowing if there will be a payoff to all of this suffering. The ones who say "well we shoulda waited a couple more years" basically want us to pretend the last 10+ years didn't happen and that's not fair to the fans and it reinforces this idea that this organization doesn't mind losing forever.
If Wiggins had been the guy most thought he'd be, there woulda never been a need to add Butler.
So what are you suggesting they do?
I'm saying what they did in adding Butler was smart. Everything else after that didn't make a ton of sense other than adding Taj and even that cost us a ton of money. Philly was down with trusting the process because they're a town and a franchise that wasn't interested anymore in being a team that either made the playoffs and lost in the first round or semis or picked 11th. For us, a playoff berth is the equivalent of a conference finals appearance for everyone else. What everyone forgets is that we needed to see this team produce while these guys were on rookie deals. Instead, everyone was down with tanking, with getting as high of a pick as possible, with rationalizing the thought of "I'd rather have a lotto pick with .05 percent chance of winning the lotto than making the playoffs and losing in round 1." If that's the mentality, this team will always be afraid to take the next step. As far as I'm concerned, the Butler trade was a success.
Towns/Wiggins/LaVine/Dunn eventually would have all gotten paid for showing you nothing but losing. Plan B would have meant admitting none of those guys were the guys you needed and you woulda started all over again anyway. Regarding Wiggins, the EASY decision was not to give him a max deal if you questioned whether he deserved it in the first place like Glen Taylor did.
I don't agree with you that us making the playoffs is like another team making the conference finals. Sure we've lost for a long time, but our fans should have the same expectations as any other fan base. We can't change the past but shouldn't have to sacrifice our future because of it. In a vacuum the Butler trade was okay. The relative value going in each direction was fair. It was just the right trade at the wrong time for the Wolves.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:How about Knox? I have to believe Butler could fetch him. May not get much more than that but it's enough for me.
KiwiMatt wrote:I wonder if Philly would bite on a Butler for Covington and Fultz deal.
A starting lineup for the 76ers of Simmons, Reddick, Butler, Saric and Embiid is scary good and would have a chance of getting past Boston in the East.
KiwiMatt wrote:I wonder if Philly would bite on a Butler for Covington and Fultz deal.
A starting lineup for the 76ers of Simmons, Reddick, Butler, Saric and Embiid is scary good and would have a chance of getting past Boston in the East.
Philly is loaded even after drafting two high busts in Okafor and Noel and a disappointment in Fullz. I wish the Wolves had approached building our team that way-PATIENTLY. We should have looked to ensure we have three deserving young max players before blowing our capspace. KAT-hell yeah, Wiggs-not so much and Jimmy-a stud, but he's old, injury plagued and a cancer (hell nah). Impatience by Taylor and Pibbs puts us in a situation where we now have to hope Wiggs can be the player we hoped he'd be and hope Taylor can find a coach to help maximize the talents of Wiggs and that we can somehow find another young cornerstone.
There's patience and then there's asking a fanbase who waited for 12 years to wait 3-4 more years without even knowing if there will be a payoff to all of this suffering. The ones who say "well we shoulda waited a couple more years" basically want us to pretend the last 10+ years didn't happen and that's not fair to the fans and it reinforces this idea that this organization doesn't mind losing forever.
If Wiggins had been the guy most thought he'd be, there woulda never been a need to add Butler.
That's not how I view things at all. I guess I don't think just being in the playoffs and getting your a$$es kicked is any better than missing the playoffs. The latter gets you a better draft pick and better odds of finding the next cornerstone. I guess if playoffs is all you aspire to, what's the point? More than half the teams make it. In fact, its kind of exciting in a perverse way to keep the streak going longer than artificially boosting your win total by getting a rent-a-Jimmy and signing-old-man-Taj.
