Losing in LA - Wolves @ Lakers

[Lipoli390]

Regarding tonight's game, Wiggins and KAT did everything they could. So why did we lose?Well, how about our starting SG finishing with 0 points, 0 rebounds, 0 assists and 0 steals in 30 minutes. And how about our two main guards off the bench (Dunn and Jones) combining for 0 points in 25 minutes. KAT and Wiggins have their faults and, hopefully at age 21, they'll improve their weaknesses over the next several years. But we don't need to blow up the core. We need guys around these two who can produce better than Rush, Dunn, Jones, Casspi, Aldrich and Hill. Getting LaVine and Belly back healthy will help. Beyond that, our dynamic front office duo will need to make much better use of free agency and the draft this summer than they did last summer. It's not about trading Wiggins, KAT or even Dieng or Ricky. It's about surrounding those 4 with better players even as KAT and Wiggins continue to develop their own games.

[bleedspeed]

It's not about trading Wiggins, KAT or even Dieng or Ricky. It's about surrounding those 4 with better players even as KAT and Wiggins continue to develop their own games.

EXACTLY

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

Didn't bother watching this one, glad I saved myself the frustration. I did see we allowed 32 points in the 4th quarter. Typical.

Here is our defensive "improvement" since last season:

Defensive Rating - 28th last year, 27th this year
Opponent eFG% - 29th last year, 29th this year

Opponent eFG% is the single most important defensive stat, and frankly, I think you could use it as a barometer for this team's performance overall. We haven't improved a lick despite hiring one of the best defensive coaches of his generation. So depressing.

[bleedspeed]

Seriously would it be easier to upgrade Wiggins, Rubio, and Dieng. Or would it be easier to upgrade Rush, and company?

[Duke13]

I think Tim hit the nail on the head earlier in the thread. I'm not suggesting we trade Wig or Kat but they play the furthest thing from team basketball. Kat is going to be a top five player most likely, so no you don't entertain trading him but he's playing so selfishly. It's so obvious he's hunting stats, 6-7 times a game he should be called for a foul pushing a teammate going for a rebound. Our offense is strictly Rubio dribbling the ball up the court, and passing to wig or Kat, ball rarely leaves their hands. I'm sure the come back will be why should they pass it, neither of them make others better at this point. Their secondary players need to be better but I agree with Tim, I'd question the impact other free agents would have with the style these two play as it stands currently. I mean it's been actually comical watching Kat destroy his own teammates going for rebounds, keep it up!!

[AbeVigodaLive]

I think Tim hit the nail on the head earlier in the thread. I'm not suggesting we trade Wig or Kat but they play the furthest thing from team basketball. Kat is going to be a top five player most likely, so no you don't entertain trading him but he's playing so selfishly. It's so obvious he's hunting stats, 6-7 times a game he should be called for a foul pushing a teammate going for a rebound. Our offense is strictly Rubio dribbling the ball up the court, and passing to wig or Kat, ball rarely leaves their hands. I'm sure the come back will be why should they pass it, neither of them make others better at this point. Their secondary players need to be better but I agree with Tim, I'd question the impact other free agents would have with the style these two play as it stands currently. I mean it's been actually comical watching Kat destroy his own teammates going for rebounds, keep it up!!

Yep. I mentioned it a couple of weeks back with the rebounding stuff.

And that leads (in)directly to another problem...

The more rebounds he gets. The more points he scores... the more adulation he receives. Notice how it's almost universally assumed he's on the precipice of being a top 5 player. And that's despite playing selfishly (actions louder than hollow words)... and playing defense lazily.

He's going to be rewarded for this handsomely. Something has to change with these foundation guys to get them to "buy in" to winning basketball.

Maturity? They're young.
Losing? Eventually, they'll want more than money and accolades.
Criticism? The flowery superlatives will begin to wane and Cousins comparisons will begin.
Organization? ewwww... it starts at the top. Glen Taylor is a loser owner. Doesn't make him a bad guy. But he's been the constant amid changing players and coaches. The losing permeates throughout the organization. It doesn't appear Thibs is enough... nor should it be.

ELITE players have a drive to compete and WIN. It's on them. All on them. Towns and Wiggins have the potential to be those types of guys. But they have to be willing to do whatever it takes to make that gigantic-sized leap. I believe it will happen (for Towns and hopefully Wiggins) but we're not close to being there yet.


[Note: We can probably start the 2018 preseason articles filled with "Towns is ready to win" and "We're serious now" narratives. Show me with more wins. Anything else is worthless to me.]

[TeamRicky [enjin:6648771]]

I don't think we need to blow up this team either. I really don't want to trade any of our starters and hopefully another year, a good draft pick (Isaac is still my hope) and a few free agent veterans who can play both sides will get us headed in the right direction. Salary cap management is important, but I think we only need to set aside two max salaries right now. It would be a big mistake to hold back salary with the idea LaVine is a max player. We can try to sign him for a cap friendly deal but we should only resign him for big money if he proves he can be a plus defender and improve his overall game, but based on his stats to date, he's far far away from deserving that kind of money (he's been in the bottom third of plus/minus stats every year which indicates his present production is very replaceable). I'd rather sign Gay, Ibaka or another more accomplished free agent on a two year deal and then we can choose which player to sign longer term.

[Coolbreeze44]

The lack of ball movement on offense is a team-wide issue. I've never seen a team have so many one pass and shot possessions as this group. And now that Ricky is looking more for his offense the ball movement is even less (not Ricky's fault). There is a definite theme of "my turn to shoot" that permeates through our offense. And yet this team scores the ball easily for the most part. That is until the legs get a little tired in the 2nd half. We've all seen big leads go away time and time again.

The knee jerk reaction is to think we have a whole host of problems that need to be fixed before we can move forward. Team defense is certainly one. But what if the problems really aren't that dramatic? Here's what I mean. What if we find a starting quality small forward who play hard nosed defense? Add to that another big whose main calling card is defense and can provide some rim protection. You get Bazz the hell out of town and have Zach embrace his role. To these things you add another year of development and cohesion under Thibs. I think we would all agree it wouldn't be that hard to make improvements, but the corresponding results should be dramatic. Mainly we would be better equipped to hold on to the leads we build and that alone would boost the win total significantly.

The last point I want to make is about the defense. We don't need the defense of our young stars to be a whole lot better to become a decent team. The things I mention above will get us to that level. But we need better defense to become a great team. It's going to be the difference between winning 48 games and 60. I'm banking on Thibs eventually getting our young guys to buy in. And the experience and maturity that comes with playing several years in the league will eventually get us to the required efficiency. I guess what I'm saying is we can easily be a playoff team next year. Any competent front office should be able to get us there. But we still need to have a little patience with the process of becoming a contender. Just don't do anything stupid with this group in terms of trying to win too quickly.

[Duke13]

Cool, I agree we can be a playoff team next year. But I don't think it's as easy as a plug and play of a free agent. Sounds easy but there needs to be a maturity of our core first and foremost. It's something that should come with time, we hope!!

Our offense is terrible in crunch time. As been most of the year. ISO basketball can easily be defended down the stretch of games. The predictability is part of it. I think the selfishness I see on offense is the same problem on defense. No team cohesion. Does Kat have the phisically ability to be above average defensively, hell yea he does but for some reason he been terrible. Same can be said for him being a more willing passer and get other involved, it's a mentality. Hopefully he has another conversation with Bill Russell this offseason about being a team leader and this time he listens.

[Porckchop]

I've mentioned this before but it bares repeating. The most talented players don't have as hard of a time translating their own skills to the NBA level it's about finding a way to integrate it into a team concept. It takes time especially when you have two super talented offensive players on the same team . Durant and Westbrook didn't figure it out immediately, yes they had more success early but they were winning bec they had more talent around them and they themselves were just better than Kat and Wigs. They didn't know how to play together really well for a couple years.
I have no doubt it will click eventually, just need a couple more pieces along the defensive front, a three pt shooter, and a good player maker at any positions. I'd prefer all 3 be vets .

Trade Lavine , pick, and a throw in to move up to get Ball or maybe Fultze? Would you?

Clearly leaves a log jam at the pg position, but Ricky or Dunn be used in other trades to upgrade other positions.