sjm34 wrote:My guess is that Wiggins wants a player option to opt out early. Never hurts to ask, but I wouldn't give it.
Lip, when did Gorgui become an asset????????
SJM I think you nailed it here about a significant factor that could be the back and forth of the negotiations on the Wiggins extension. I hadn't thought about a player option being a bargaining chip but it's certainly something a player and agent would look for and it makes complete sense to do so. 5-6 is a ton of time to be locked in for today's NBA.
My take on this has always been:
A. If the player and the team are trully both commited to one another, then they will agree on a 5 year max contract with no opt out close. Simple as that.
B. If the team needs to give reassurance and guarantee, then throw in a no trade clause or a trade kicker in the 5year max deal.
C. If the player's priority is the most money and is chasing rings and wanting to form superteams with other players, then they will likely push for an opt out after 2-3years.
Wiggins strike me as a guy that is loyal and very confident in his own ability that he isnt craving to be part of a superteam. He is likely going for the full 5year no opt out max. I can see the holdup being him wanting a no trade clause/trade kicker. Its just a gut feel and add that he is stil very young and hus prime is yet to come. I see that as the holdup.
World, I agree with your take on this. If we're both wrong and the real hold-up is Wiggins wanting an early opt-clause, then I'm more than a little irritated. If Wiggins wants the Wolves to commit now to 5 more guaranteed seasons after this one at the top dollar allowed under the CBA, which is more than any other team can offer, then Wiggins needs to commit to the team for the full 5 years. If he's not willing to do that then let him play this season with the risk of injury or another season of poor defense and underwhelming rebounding and we can make him a qualifying offer next summer and match any offer.
Again, I don't think Wiggins is holding out for an early opt-out. He doesn't strike me as that kind of guy and it doesn't make much sense to risk the security of the 5-year max for a 3 or 4 year exit. The delay could be the result of the Wolves trying to build in some incentives as conditions for max money -- like making the NBA all-defensive team or some other defensive or rebounding metrics. Otherwise, I still think it could be because the Wolves have offered Wiggins in a deal for Kyrie.
A few things.
1. Wow. A good player requesting a trade TO the Wolves. I actually read the article several times thinking that Kyrie Irving requested a trade to the Wild.
2. Needs to be said: The last lockout was partially about revenue share, but mostly about roster control, with Gilbert (Smarting over just having lost Lebron) and Taylor (Smarting over just having hired two decades worth of poor front office staff) being the hardliners over an agreement that eliminated immediate sign-and-trades. Fast forward, and what's holding up a deal? Jeff Teague's untradeable-just-signed-contract. Like I always said: when you don't have revenue, you have to have creativity, so why would you handcuff yourself?
3. CANNOT overpay for this guy. He wants to leave because he is tired of listening to LEBRON!??!!?!?! (What did Lebron do, tell him to screw over his hometown while sitting next to Jim Gray?) And he wants to play in MIN because KAT won't confront him. Sounds like a good reason. I say Teague and the OKC pick, or walk away.
4. Teague had worse teammates the Irving last season and really wasn't that much worse himself. He's fine. Gibson will probably be the problem.
"Can say with certainty that "report" of Butler and Towns being "OK" with trading Wiggins for Kyrie is not accurate."
He also added
"Have Butler and KAT talked to Kyrie? I think there's a high likelihood that happened. But neither Wolf is playing GM."
"Continue to believe a deal for Kyrie coming to Minnesota is a long shot. Things can change quickly, but that's where things stand now."
"Wolves remain excited about the Butler-Wiggins pairing with Towns. Posturing? Maybe. But I really don't think so"
"Not just Glen who likes Wiggins. Thibs is a big fan"
Good insights by Jon K. Not many teams can roll out two big wings that are virtually interchangeable. Assuming Wiggins keeps improving, that's the theory and it would be a key differentiator for us. Butler and Wiggins are no Jordan/Pippen or LeBron/Wade, but they could be really, really good. Add in KAT as potentially a top 5 talent and we could be set for a while. Lots of improvement needed first on the defensive side of the ball....
"Can say with certainty that "report" of Butler and Towns being "OK" with trading Wiggins for Kyrie is not accurate."
He also added
"Have Butler and KAT talked to Kyrie? I think there's a high likelihood that happened. But neither Wolf is playing GM."
"Continue to believe a deal for Kyrie coming to Minnesota is a long shot. Things can change quickly, but that's where things stand now."
"Wolves remain excited about the Butler-Wiggins pairing with Towns. Posturing? Maybe. But I really don't think so"
"Not just Glen who likes Wiggins. Thibs is a big fan"
Good insights by Jon K. Not many teams can roll out two big wings that are virtually interchangeable. Assuming Wiggins keeps improving, that's the theory and it would be a key differentiator for us. Butler and Wiggins are no Jordan/Pippen or LeBron/Wade, but they could be really, really good. Add in KAT as potentially a top 5 talent and we could be set for a while. Lots of improvement needed first on the defensive side of the ball....
Good post. To add to that what I think what is overlooked with all this Kyrie hype is Jeff Teague COULD actually be a pretty good compliment to all these guys. He does a lot of things pretty well. Just being say the 15th best PG in the league right now (that's where a lot of hisbstats have him the past few years in various categories) is no slouch. That means you are a pretty good player because the position is pretty deep and very talented at the top and it could be getting even more so with new talent coming in. His quickness could even be an asset defensively because when was it the Wolves had a PG that was able to be a quick defender and blow past guys with that quickness? JJ Barea maybe? I think Teague could be a real key to how good this team could be. If he can find his way quickly this team could really take off.
More indication from Jon K. that Wiggins isn't going anywhere based on Glen's talk about working on the extension and sitting down with Wiggins and discussing expectations.
Wow, kinda like Taylor's attitude here. You want max? Look me in the eye and tell me your commitment to the Wolves, because you still have a ways to go to earn this kind of money.
Here is Jon K's two money paragraphs:
Both Taylor and coach Tom Thibodeau are counting on Wiggins to make big leaps as a defender, ball-handler and perimeter shooter as they prepare to lavish the 22-year-old with the kind of money that few others in his draft class have a chance of making on their second contracts.
For all of the big scoring nights he has enjoyed early in his career, he has been much more inconsistent in many other areas of his game, including defense and rebounding.
Q12543 wrote:Wow, kinda like Taylor's attitude here. You want max? Look me in the eye and tell me your commitment to the Wolves, because you still have a ways to go to earn this kind of money.
Here is Jon K's two money paragraphs:
Both Taylor and coach Tom Thibodeau are counting on Wiggins to make big leaps as a defender, ball-handler and perimeter shooter as they prepare to lavish the 22-year-old with the kind of money that few others in his draft class have a chance of making on their second contracts.
For all of the big scoring nights he has enjoyed early in his career, he has been much more inconsistent in many other areas of his game, including defense and rebounding.
Yeah, I really liked hearing this on Barreiro today. I know many are down on Glen here, but I like how he is handling the Wig deal. Who knows if it will have any positive impact, but I'm glad Glen is at least laying out some expectations for the max money he is about to give Andrew.
I am going to give you 150 million of guaranteed money, and I expect you to improve. That is some hard nose bargaining on Taylor's part. Taylor always feels he has to be fighting for something. I wish he'd just go away personally. Thibs has got it covered.
