Trade market and trade hype thread

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

The whole weight-gain/weight-lifting thing with Wiggins is tough to judge in my opinion. One thing a real combine would do - if the technology even exists - is measure the potential for someone to add lean muscle mass. Some guys just don't have the frames for it and Wiggins might be one of these guys whose ideal playing weight is in that 200-210 lbs. range.

Regardless, LaVine and Wiggins are redundant in a lot of ways in terms of what they DON'T do very well. I'm with Cam. In reality, I wouldn't look to pull the trigger on either one in a proactive way. But I also don't think we need multiple more years to figure out if they are the right wing pairing and it's OK to speculate on other options and trades.

[thedoper]

The whole weight-gain/weight-lifting thing with Wiggins is tough to judge in my opinion. One thing a real combine would do - if the technology even exists - is measure the potential for someone to add lean muscle mass. Some guys just don't have the frames for it and Wiggins might be one of these guys whose ideal playing weight is in that 200-210 lbs. range.

Regardless, LaVine and Wiggins are redundant in a lot of ways in terms of what they DON'T do very well. I'm with Cam. In reality, I wouldn't look to pull the trigger on either one in a proactive way. But I also don't think we need multiple more years to figure out if they are the right wing pairing and it's OK to speculate on other options and trades.

On the flip side I think it's fair to assume that with good coaching and leadership they can continue to make growth in the areas they are complimentary as well. There are probably less than 10 SF that are capable of physically restricting Wiggins. There are even less 2s that can do it to Zach. If Wiggins continues to focus on cutting hard to the basket and Zach in time develops more court awareness with the ball, and both continue to improve defensively. They can be less redundant and quite complimentary.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

The whole weight-gain/weight-lifting thing with Wiggins is tough to judge in my opinion. One thing a real combine would do - if the technology even exists - is measure the potential for someone to add lean muscle mass. Some guys just don't have the frames for it and Wiggins might be one of these guys whose ideal playing weight is in that 200-210 lbs. range.

Regardless, LaVine and Wiggins are redundant in a lot of ways in terms of what they DON'T do very well. I'm with Cam. In reality, I wouldn't look to pull the trigger on either one in a proactive way. But I also don't think we need multiple more years to figure out if they are the right wing pairing and it's OK to speculate on other options and trades.

On the flip side I think it's fair to assume that with good coaching and leadership they can continue to make growth in the areas they are complimentary as well. There are probably less than 10 SF that are capable of physically restricting Wiggins. There are even less 2s that can do it to Zach. If Wiggins continues to focus on cutting hard to the basket and Zach in time develops more court awareness with the ball, and both continue to improve defensively. They can be less redundant and quite complimentary.

From a pure scoring perspective, they are complimentary because a) they score in different ways, with one being more of a pure shooter and the other being more of an all-around threat, and b) by having two scoring wings, one of them always benefits by having the weaker wing defender guard him.

My issue is that neither are very good passers, defenders, or rebounders. That's a lot of ground to cover, but incremental improvements with the right supporting cast could make it work over the long run.

Oh, and don't forget we have KAT, who is clearly the most talented player on the roster. It's not like we HAVE to have two high-scoring wings. They need to bring more to the table than scoring since by virtue of having KAT, there will be games where one or both of these guys won't even need to score much. They need to some of the other things well too.

[bleedspeed]

If the 76ers called and offered Dario Saric for Dunn would you make the trade?

[kekgeek]

If the 76ers called and offered Dario Saric for Dunn would you make the trade?

No

[khans2k5 [enjin:6608728]]

Include efficiency and I'm sure you can see the intrigue.

AW: .525 TS%, 27.6 USG%

CJM: .589 TS%, 28.2 USG%

Sadly we should compare CJ numbers when he was 21, but he was not even in the league yet. The other black mark on CJ is he is 25 and only proven to be healthy 1 year in the NBA and had issues in college. He might be a ticking time bomb on the health side.

We wouldn't be trading for 21-year old McCollum. We'd be trading for the 25-year old who's already one the very elite shooters -- and consequently one of the best young scorers -- in the NBA.

It isn't a discussion about who was better at what age. It's a "would you deal this guy for this guy right now" conversation. I'm okay with saying it's worth consideration regardless of how unlikely it is.

{Steph Curry and Kyrie Irving once had injury issues too. It's okay to be wary, but you shouldn't dismiss a deal altogether because of them.}

You have to factor in future performance due to age and potential in these deals. It's not just a would you deal this guy for this guy now. If you aren't factoring in what Wiggins will look like in 3-4 years when he gets to the same age CJ is now then you just aren't making a smart move. If you project Wiggins will never attain CJ Mcollum's level of player then go for it. I certainly wouldn't take CJ's next 5 years over Wiggins. Wiggins is just too good at 21 to think he's peaked IMO. If he has peaked I'll die on this hill, but I don't think we've seen the best from him by far. Wiggins is also one of the league's best young scorers and he's 4 years younger. That just has to matter in any conversation of a deal.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

If the 76ers called and offered Dario Saric for Dunn would you make the trade?

Nope. That's not to say that I wouldn't trade Dunn, but I'm not high on Saric.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

The Magic reportedly offered Nikola Vucevic and a first-round pick to the Heat for Goran Dragic.

The Heat should consider that offer, in my opinion, but they'd need a third team to move Vucevic to as he's incapable of playing next to Hassan Whiteside. I think he'd look good in Minnesota and I think he could be had relatively easily if that trade is made.

[Hicks123 [enjin:6700838]]

Boy, the talk of trading one of our big 3 for good starter/non-all-star level players is a little baffling. The patience is clearly thin on this board. We have the youngest trio ever to score 20 points each per game and people want to break it up for a few more wins today. It's going to be a legit big 3. You just have to let it mature. I've said it before and I'll say it again. 21 year olds don't run this league. Just wait until they're 23-24-25. They're going to be a great trio. In 2-3-4 years our guys are just going to be better than the other names brought up here.

And I would argue that this team will absolutely NOT look the same way in a few years. The way the league has moved, any yahoo that can score more than 10 ppg, or be 7' tall gets a max deal. It used to be reserved for actual good players, but not any more. Thus, the reality of signing Wiggins, Towns and Lavine for $30MM each is simply not going to be feasible, despite the optimism on this board. And it's not just them, it's because now your 15 mpg role player, like Biyambo, get nearly $20MM as well.

And yes, patience is thin. I have watched ever year since year 1, and we are ALWAYS in the perpetual....wait until next year. And what do we have, after all the lotteries, and the waiting.....the 5th worst team in the NBA. All everyone sees are guys that can pour in points. Meanwhile, actual good teams find better ways to win (SA has 1 guy over 20 ppg). Like playing defense, and playing as a team. Many on this board have already crowned the Wolves with a championship in 2020. People in OKC and Portland are simply saying....good luck with that!

I don't know what the right answer is, but waiting another 3-4-5 years is NOT it. I have loved the Wolves forever, but they have lost most of my interest....and I have to believe I am not alone.

Sorry I blew up.

[khans2k5 [enjin:6608728]]

Boy, the talk of trading one of our big 3 for good starter/non-all-star level players is a little baffling. The patience is clearly thin on this board. We have the youngest trio ever to score 20 points each per game and people want to break it up for a few more wins today. It's going to be a legit big 3. You just have to let it mature. I've said it before and I'll say it again. 21 year olds don't run this league. Just wait until they're 23-24-25. They're going to be a great trio. In 2-3-4 years our guys are just going to be better than the other names brought up here.

And I would argue that this team will absolutely NOT look the same way in a few years. The way the league has moved, any yahoo that can score more than 10 ppg, or be 7' tall gets a max deal. It used to be reserved for actual good players, but not any more. Thus, the reality of signing Wiggins, Towns and Lavine for $30MM each is simply not going to be feasible, despite the optimism on this board. And it's not just them, it's because now your 15 mpg role player, like Biyambo, get nearly $20MM as well.

And yes, patience is thin. I have watched ever year since year 1, and we are ALWAYS in the perpetual....wait until next year. And what do we have, after all the lotteries, and the waiting.....the 5th worst team in the NBA. All everyone sees are guys that can pour in points. Meanwhile, actual good teams find better ways to win (SA has 1 guy over 20 ppg). Like playing defense, and playing as a team. Many on this board have already crowned the Wolves with a championship in 2020. People in OKC and Portland are simply saying....good luck with that!

I don't know what the right answer is, but waiting another 3-4-5 years is NOT it. I have loved the Wolves forever, but they have lost most of my interest....and I have to believe I am not alone.

Sorry I blew up.

An ultimatum of win now or we'll leave as fans in the next year or two is not the answer either. You negotiate/trade/manage out of strength, not out of desperate weakness if you want this thing turned around and to do that you have to be willing to wait 3-4-5 more years if it needs to happen. The wait doesn't have to happen, but if you aren't willing to wait at all you're likely not going to get the right value for any moves you make to try to turn it around. We got Wiggins because Flip was willing to hang on to Love and ride it out. If you start dealing guys for wins now you both might come up short and you might be giving away a future all-star. You better be right when you make those trades or you set us back again which nobody wants.