These two things are simultaneously true

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

These are two true statements:

#1 - Andrew Wiggins had an impressive rookie campaign where he showed incredible durability, athleticism, and the ability to score the basketball. He fully deserved the Rookie of the Year award and has tremendous upside.

#2 - Andrew Wiggins was a below average NBA basketball player last season.

[alexftbl8181 [enjin:6648741]]

ehh I dunno about that. There are a lot of bad NBA players that skew that medium line

[AbeVigodaLive]

Sometimes, Q frightens me.


[Note: We think a lot alike sometimes on this forum... his affinity for Jeff Adrien notwithstanding. To be fair, however, I think Wiggins was more "average" than "below average" though overall.]

[Coolbreeze44]

Below average NBA basketball player? No. I'm sure you would point to some metrics to back up your point, but you just can't think in a box. You have to consider the situation he was in - playing mostly with inexperienced players, playing on a very thin roster (and poor one), and having to play too many minutes as a rookie. If he was below average last year, give me 5 just like him and I will kick the shit out of most NBA teams.

[Carlos Danger]

Sort of. It really depends on how you measure. Based on advanced stats - yes. Based on eyeballs - no. And we all know sometimes stats don't tell the full story. We have to realize the kid was given a lot including often guarding the best player on the other team. I assume Wiggins advanced stats would have been better if he was spoon fed instead of being pushed into the water to sink or swim. Also (someone can verify - I gotta run), but I think Wiggins improved throughout the year, so while his overall advanced stats may not look great, I assume they looked better as the year went on if you looked on a month by month basis.

[bleedspeed]

How much does a team impact an individuals advanced stats? I would guess no matter how good you are if you play the most minutes on the worst team in the league you are not going to look to good and struggle to even be average.

[AbeVigodaLive]

How much does a team impact an individuals advanced stats? I would guess no matter how good you are if you play the most minutes on the worst team in the league you are not going to look to good and struggle to even be average.

I dunno. There's an adage about NBA players that's been around forever... something about good stats on bad teams.
Shareef Abdur Rahim is usually mentioned in those discussions.

Kevin Love has even been mentioned before.

[mjs34]

These are two true statements:

#1 - Andrew Wiggins had an impressive rookie campaign where he showed incredible durability, athleticism, and the ability to score the basketball. He fully deserved the Rookie of the Year award and has tremendous upside.

#2 - Andrew Wiggins was a below average NBA basketball player last season.

Q, I am pretty sure you could find stats that say Hummel was a better BB player last year, but that just shows how skewed some of these advanced metrics are.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

How much does a team impact an individuals advanced stats? I would guess no matter how good you are if you play the most minutes on the worst team in the league you are not going to look to good and struggle to even be average.

Team defense impacts win shares since each team member gets assigned a portion of the overall team rating. Offensive win shares are pretty much solely attributed to the individual. Wiggins had a .034 WS/48 last season. .100/48 is considered average. Had he played on a better defensive team, his WS/48 would probably be closer to .05 or .06.

PER is purely an individual advanced stat. Typically volume scorers on poor teams are viewed favorably by PER. Wiggins had a PER of 13.9 last year. Average PER is typically around 15.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

Sort of. It really depends on how you measure. Based on advanced stats - yes. Based on eyeballs - no. And we all know sometimes stats don't tell the full story. We have to realize the kid was given a lot including often guarding the best player on the other team. I assume Wiggins advanced stats would have been better if he was spoon fed instead of being pushed into the water to sink or swim. Also (someone can verify - I gotta run), but I think Wiggins improved throughout the year, so while his overall advanced stats may not look great, I assume they looked better as the year went on if you looked on a month by month basis.

First off, my statement is specific to the whole of last season - it's as simple as that.

Throwing out the advanced stats, based on my eyeballs, here is where Wiggins struggled a bit:

- Rebounding. He was often out-rebounded by his matchup.

- "50/50" balls. These often squirted out of his hands or he was beaten to the punch by an opponent.

- Long-range shooting.

- Creating deflections/turnovers.

- Taking charges.

- Out-running his opponent in transition.

- Ball handling and making plays for others off of the bounce.


All of these areas can be improved upon and are correctable.