Let me know when NBA players are kicked out of the league at the age of 25.
Otherwise... please don't move the goal posts.
[Note: It can be argued Ricky Rubio is a top 10 PG. Most people outside this forum would challenge that though. Again, sorry for the derailing. It's a pretty minor quibble. My bad.]
I realize that, but I am pointing out that Ricky is relatively young in terms of quality point guards in the league. Its a factor in his favor. The other factor that doesn't get mentioned a lot is his cap friendly contract. His shooting efficiency is really the only subpar part of his game (and hopefully it will improve), his age, contract, defense, passing and turnovers are all very good plus being a likeable guy and good teammate doesn't hurt.
But that shooting efficiency thing is REALLY big. I think it has improved the past season or so, but at one point he had the 3rd worse shooting percentage of anyone who played 5k minutes since 1960.
Another thing to remember is that he turned pro at 14, so if a U.S. player turned pro at 19, he would have 6 years experience at age 25. Blonde Ricky has ELEVEN.
{Sidenote: Wow. 14. I think the best 14 y/o I ever saw live was Sam Jacobson. I never thought for a minute he belonged in the NBA at 14, and evidently at 22 according to Phil Jackson. But who knows, maybe he could have played in the league that Blonde Ricky played in when he was 14.}
Ricky's efficiency isn't that horrible (because he shoots great at the line and gets there quite often and his three point shooting isn't horrible) and his overall game puts him in the TOP 5 for both Real Plus Minus and Win Shares for point guards.
Depending what stats you choose to use... there are about 15 PGs that could be considered top 10... or even flirting with top 5 PG status in this league.
Let me know when NBA players are kicked out of the league at the age of 25.
Otherwise... please don't move the goal posts.
[Note: It can be argued Ricky Rubio is a top 10 PG. Most people outside this forum would challenge that though. Again, sorry for the derailing. It's a pretty minor quibble. My bad.]
I realize that, but I am pointing out that Ricky is relatively young in terms of quality point guards in the league. Its a factor in his favor. The other factor that doesn't get mentioned a lot is his cap friendly contract. His shooting efficiency is really the only subpar part of his game (and hopefully it will improve), his age, contract, defense, passing and turnovers are all very good plus being a likeable guy and good teammate doesn't hurt.
But that shooting efficiency thing is REALLY big. I think it has improved the past season or so, but at one point he had the 3rd worse shooting percentage of anyone who played 5k minutes since 1960.
Another thing to remember is that he turned pro at 14, so if a U.S. player turned pro at 19, he would have 6 years experience at age 25. Blonde Ricky has ELEVEN.
{Sidenote: Wow. 14. I think the best 14 y/o I ever saw live was Sam Jacobson. I never thought for a minute he belonged in the NBA at 14, and evidently at 22 according to Phil Jackson. But who knows, maybe he could have played in the league that Blonde Ricky played in when he was 14.}
Ricky's efficiency isn't that horrible (because he shoots great at the line and gets there quite often and his three point shooting isn't horrible) and his overall game puts him in the TOP 5 for both Real Plus Minus and Win Shares for point guards.
Let me know when NBA players are kicked out of the league at the age of 25.
Otherwise... please don't move the goal posts.
[Note: It can be argued Ricky Rubio is a top 10 PG. Most people outside this forum would challenge that though. Again, sorry for the derailing. It's a pretty minor quibble. My bad.]
I realize that, but I am pointing out that Ricky is relatively young in terms of quality point guards in the league. Its a factor in his favor. The other factor that doesn't get mentioned a lot is his cap friendly contract. His shooting efficiency is really the only subpar part of his game (and hopefully it will improve), his age, contract, defense, passing and turnovers are all very good plus being a likeable guy and good teammate doesn't hurt.
But that shooting efficiency thing is REALLY big. I think it has improved the past season or so, but at one point he had the 3rd worse shooting percentage of anyone who played 5k minutes since 1960.
Another thing to remember is that he turned pro at 14, so if a U.S. player turned pro at 19, he would have 6 years experience at age 25. Blonde Ricky has ELEVEN.
{Sidenote: Wow. 14. I think the best 14 y/o I ever saw live was Sam Jacobson. I never thought for a minute he belonged in the NBA at 14, and evidently at 22 according to Phil Jackson. But who knows, maybe he could have played in the league that Blonde Ricky played in when he was 14.}
Ricky's efficiency isn't that horrible (because he shoots great at the line and gets there quite often and his three point shooting isn't horrible) and his overall game puts him in the TOP 5 for both Real Plus Minus and Win Shares for point guards.
The story is very even-handed. It acknowledges his many strengths.
I get it you hate Ricky and add nothing new to the debate that this board hasn't discussed hundreds of times. Lets not turn every thread into anti-Ricky tirade.
Let me know when NBA players are kicked out of the league at the age of 25.
Otherwise... please don't move the goal posts.
[Note: It can be argued Ricky Rubio is a top 10 PG. Most people outside this forum would challenge that though. Again, sorry for the derailing. It's a pretty minor quibble. My bad.]
I realize that, but I am pointing out that Ricky is relatively young in terms of quality point guards in the league. Its a factor in his favor. The other factor that doesn't get mentioned a lot is his cap friendly contract. His shooting efficiency is really the only subpar part of his game (and hopefully it will improve), his age, contract, defense, passing and turnovers are all very good plus being a likeable guy and good teammate doesn't hurt.
But that shooting efficiency thing is REALLY big. I think it has improved the past season or so, but at one point he had the 3rd worse shooting percentage of anyone who played 5k minutes since 1960.
Another thing to remember is that he turned pro at 14, so if a U.S. player turned pro at 19, he would have 6 years experience at age 25. Blonde Ricky has ELEVEN.
{Sidenote: Wow. 14. I think the best 14 y/o I ever saw live was Sam Jacobson. I never thought for a minute he belonged in the NBA at 14, and evidently at 22 according to Phil Jackson. But who knows, maybe he could have played in the league that Blonde Ricky played in when he was 14.}
Ricky's efficiency isn't that horrible (because he shoots great at the line and gets there quite often and his three point shooting isn't horrible) and his overall game puts him in the TOP 5 for both Real Plus Minus and Win Shares for point guards.
The story is very even-handed. It acknowledges his many strengths.
I get it you hate Ricky and add nothing new to the debate that this board hasn't discussed hundreds of times. Lets not turn every thread into anti-Ricky tirade.
That's not fair. I liked Blonde Ricky up until about a week ago or so when he (lightly) demanded a trade. Most guys who develop Johan-Love Syndrome are usually the very best player on an average or below-average team and not the 3rd or 4th on a below average team, but it's a free county. And besides, The Star Tribune published that article and Michael Rand wrote it. I had very little involvement.
Let me know when NBA players are kicked out of the league at the age of 25.
Otherwise... please don't move the goal posts.
[Note: It can be argued Ricky Rubio is a top 10 PG. Most people outside this forum would challenge that though. Again, sorry for the derailing. It's a pretty minor quibble. My bad.]
I realize that, but I am pointing out that Ricky is relatively young in terms of quality point guards in the league. Its a factor in his favor. The other factor that doesn't get mentioned a lot is his cap friendly contract. His shooting efficiency is really the only subpar part of his game (and hopefully it will improve), his age, contract, defense, passing and turnovers are all very good plus being a likeable guy and good teammate doesn't hurt.
But that shooting efficiency thing is REALLY big. I think it has improved the past season or so, but at one point he had the 3rd worse shooting percentage of anyone who played 5k minutes since 1960.
Another thing to remember is that he turned pro at 14, so if a U.S. player turned pro at 19, he would have 6 years experience at age 25. Blonde Ricky has ELEVEN.
{Sidenote: Wow. 14. I think the best 14 y/o I ever saw live was Sam Jacobson. I never thought for a minute he belonged in the NBA at 14, and evidently at 22 according to Phil Jackson. But who knows, maybe he could have played in the league that Blonde Ricky played in when he was 14.}
Ricky's efficiency isn't that horrible (because he shoots great at the line and gets there quite often and his three point shooting isn't horrible) and his overall game puts him in the TOP 5 for both Real Plus Minus and Win Shares for point guards.
The story is very even-handed. It acknowledges his many strengths.
I get it you hate Ricky and add nothing new to the debate that this board hasn't discussed hundreds of times. Lets not turn every thread into anti-Ricky tirade.
And the pro-Ricky guys never bring anything new to the debate either so get off your high horse.
Jason take it for what you want but Jon K from the AP who has a very strong relationship with Ricky said that sound bite where it sounded like Ricky said something about a trade was far from his intent. Jon says Rubio really likes it here and really wants to win in MN. So you can fall back in love with Blonde Ricky if you want. :)
monsterpile wrote:Jason take it for what you want but Jon K from the AP who has a very strong relationship with Ricky said that sound bite where it sounded like Ricky said something about a trade was far from his intent. Jon says Rubio really likes it here and really wants to win in MN. So you can fall back in love with Blonde Ricky if you want. :)
The GM/coach situation in Minnesota has improved immeasurably since Rubio was drafted.
That's not just a nod to Thibodeau... you can't get any worse than Kahn and Rambis.
monsterpile wrote:Jason take it for what you want but Jon K from the AP who has a very strong relationship with Ricky said that sound bite where it sounded like Ricky said something about a trade was far from his intent. Jon says Rubio really likes it here and really wants to win in MN. So you can fall back in love with Blonde Ricky if you want. :)
Good. The strain of just being another guy who hates BlondeRicky was taking its toll. Going back to being just another guy who likes BlondeRicky is much healthier.
That being said: The shooting is an issue. As far as I'm concerned, the secret behind the Spurs is Chip Engelland, the shooting coach. The Spurs literally don't sign/draft a guy until he says he can work with his shot. It allows them to get guys who fall down the draft chart because other teams say "Oh he can't score". So, why can't MIN do this?
monsterpile wrote:Jason take it for what you want but Jon K from the AP who has a very strong relationship with Ricky said that sound bite where it sounded like Ricky said something about a trade was far from his intent. Jon says Rubio really likes it here and really wants to win in MN. So you can fall back in love with Blonde Ricky if you want. :)
Good. The strain of just being another guy who hates BlondeRicky was taking its toll. Going back to being just another guy who likes BlondeRicky is much healthier.
That being said: The shooting is an issue. As far as I'm concerned, the secret behind the Spurs is Chip Engelland, the shooting coach. The Spurs literally don't sign/draft a guy until he says he can work with his shot. It allows them to get guys who fall down the draft chart because other teams say "Oh he can't score". So, why can't MIN do this?
You bring up a great point he deserves a lot of credit for their success. Is it possible Chip is a really special shooting coach? Possibly. If it was so easy why don't a bunch of teams do the same thing? On Wolfson's podcast Layden was effusive in the praise of his time with the Spurs saying it was the best work environment you could ask for. He felt so fortunate and blessed that they wanted him. There is something special over there and I think sometimes we almost get tired of giving the Spurs credit and almost lose sight of what they have there.
