Another damn fork - Wolves at Pelicans GDT

[kekgeek]

Again I ask. What is the payoff for waiting for him to learn how to play basketball?

He has an all star upside, or at worst a combo gaurd of the bench.

My question back to you is what is the upside in trading him.

[thedoper]

I think Zach could be packaged for real established talent, because like many on this board, people still think he has all star upside. Also, like Cam pointed out he is cheap. Right now he is our best trade chip (apart from Wiggins and KAT). I like wildwolf don't think he will become much of a player and think we could really cash in on him before the game of diminishing returns begins. I don't think this is giving up, I think this is using this opportunity to address bigger needs, like a PF and a pg that can shoot.

[Lipoli390]

Giving up on Zach after a season and a half with modest playing time would be silly given his talent and the stretches of really good play he's had, especially the last month of last season. It would be dumb to give up on any of our young guys based on their lack of development under this head coach.

Every one of our young players has regressed in nearly every major statistical category this season under Sam compared to last season and, if here, the season before. Wiggins has improved in only one statistical category - PPG - and that's a function of him taking more shots. His FG percentage is the same while he's worse in every other category, including three-point shooting, rebounds, assists, and steals. Bazz has regressed in every major category through half of his third season. Note that he improved a lot under Flip from his first to second season. Of course, Zach has regressed. He finished really strong the last month of last season under Flip and appeared to be picking up where he left off early this season. But like all the other young players on this team, Zach has regressed under Sam. Even Dieng hasn't improved statistically in most areas. And of course the team has gotten worse over the course of this season. If that's not a pattern indicative of poor coaching I don't know what would be.

Nothing we've seen so far this season, absolutely nothing, should be relied upon for any personnel decisions related to any of our young players. It would be like relying on a tainted blood sample to lock someone up for a crime based on DNA. Sam has to go. In his place we need a competent head coach and high caliber coaching staff running this team for at least half a season before we make any decisions regarding Zach, Wiggns, Bazz, Dieng, KAT or Belly. Making personnel decisions on these guys under current circumstances would be akin to medical malpractice.

[kekgeek]

Zach will become an all star, he is putting up similar number that Harden put up in his second year and similar role.

Zach would be a junior in college right now give him time he has improved and has all the tools and motor to be great

[kekgeek]

Giving up on Zach after a season and a half with modest playing time would be silly given his talent and the stretches of really good play he's had, especially the last month of last season. It would be dumb to give up on any of our young guys based on their lack of development under this head coach.

Every one of our young players has regressed in nearly every major statistical category this season under Sam compared to last season and, if here, the season before. Wiggins has improved in only one statistical category - PPG - and that's a function of him taking more shots. His FG percentage is the same while he's worse in every other category, including three-point shooting, rebounds, assists, and steals. Bazz has regressed in every major category through half of his third season. Note that he improved a lot under Flip from his first to second season. Of course, Zach has regressed. He finished really strong the last month of last season under Flip and appeared to be picking up where he left off early this season. But like all the other young players on this team, Zach has regressed under Sam. Even Dieng hasn't improved statistically in most areas. And of course the team has gotten worse over the course of this season. If that's not a pattern indicative of poor coaching I don't know what would be.

Nothing we've seen so far this season, absolutely nothing, should be relied upon for any personnel decisions related to any of our young players. It would be like relying on a tainted blood sample to lock someone up for a crime based on DNA. Sam has to go. In his place we need a competent head coach and high caliber coaching staff running this team for at least half a season before we make any decisions regarding Zach, Wiggns, Bazz, Dieng, KAT or Belly. Making personnel decisions on these guys under current circumstances would be akin to medical malpractice.

Lip what do you think of dantoni as the next head coach I think he would be my number 1 choice assuming we can't get JVG or thibbs (I have dantoni a little behind)

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Again I ask. What is the payoff for waiting for him to learn how to play basketball?

Maybe I just don't understand what you're asking. LaVine's ceiling is an upper echelon player in the league, as in an annual All-Star. That's the payoff if he continues to improve and understand the game better. You ever heard of a professional athlete talk about "the game slowing down for me." Yeah, that's because they had enough repetition, trial-and-error, mistakes, successes, ups and downs, etc. to learn the ins and outs of the game. LaVine's got the physical tools that set him apart from damn near everyone else in basketball. His biggest weakness, aside from his confidence, is obviously his mental game. That won't just come overnight and it'll take even longer with a poor coaching staff.

[khans2k5 [enjin:6608728]]

Again I ask. What is the payoff for waiting for him to learn how to play basketball?

When Zach fills out he is going to be an unstoppable offensive force in this league. He's still learning how to finish at the basket (specifically working on the left hand finish) and getting stronger will only help him in that area. There's probably not a faster 2 in the league than him so he will be able to get to the rim at will and finish when he gets stronger. On top of that he has a good touch on his jump shot and will be able to offset his drives to the hoop with competent jump shooting. He's one of the most physically gifted players in the league who has a handle and a good enough shooting touch that once he bulks up a little more, the only guy who will be able to check him in the league will be himself. But ya, let's deal him now to a different team who will get that player because we couldn't wait two whole off-seasons for the guy to build up the strength needed to reach his potential as a player.

Oh and he's averaging 20/4.5/4.5 on 46/42/87 splits in 6 games as starter so maybe he should be put in the starting lineup. Those are great numbers for anyone let alone a sophomore.

[thedoper]

Giving up on Zach after a season and a half with modest playing time would be silly given his talent and the stretches of really good play he's had, especially the last month of last season. It would be dumb to give up on any of our young guys based on their lack of development under this head coach.

Every one of our young players has regressed in nearly every major statistical category this season under Sam compared to last season and, if here, the season before. Wiggins has improved in only one statistical category - PPG - and that's a function of him taking more shots. His FG percentage is the same while he's worse in every other category, including three-point shooting, rebounds, assists, and steals. Bazz has regressed in every major category through half of his third season. Note that he improved a lot under Flip from his first to second season. Of course, Zach has regressed. He finished really strong the last month of last season under Flip and appeared to be picking up where he left off early this season. But like all the other young players on this team, Zach has regressed under Sam. Even Dieng hasn't improved statistically in most areas. And of course the team has gotten worse over the course of this season. If that's not a pattern indicative of poor coaching I don't know what would be.

Nothing we've seen so far this season, absolutely nothing, should be relied upon for any personnel decisions related to any of our young players. It would be like relying on a tainted blood sample to lock someone up for a crime based on DNA. Sam has to go. In his place we need a competent head coach and high caliber coaching staff running this team for at least half a season before we make any decisions regarding Zach, Wiggns, Bazz, Dieng, KAT or Belly. Making personnel decisions on these guys under current circumstances would be akin to medical malpractice.

Bazz is shooting a better TS% this year than last, he is scoring more efficiently through more games in fewer minutes played. Wiggins is also shooting a better TS% as a result of getting to the line more and being more agressive. Dieng has made strides as well. I think the only young player that is regressing is Lavine. I think his decision making is a real problem and not something to gloss over. He wouldnt be the first NBA player with world class athletic gifts who didn't have the head on his shoulders to make it work. Would a better coach have gotten more out of all of these players, yes I agree on that point. But I think its fair to question this assumed narrative that Zach truly has all star potential when he has been so awful this year.

[kekgeek]

Giving up on Zach after a season and a half with modest playing time would be silly given his talent and the stretches of really good play he's had, especially the last month of last season. It would be dumb to give up on any of our young guys based on their lack of development under this head coach.

Every one of our young players has regressed in nearly every major statistical category this season under Sam compared to last season and, if here, the season before. Wiggins has improved in only one statistical category - PPG - and that's a function of him taking more shots. His FG percentage is the same while he's worse in every other category, including three-point shooting, rebounds, assists, and steals. Bazz has regressed in every major category through half of his third season. Note that he improved a lot under Flip from his first to second season. Of course, Zach has regressed. He finished really strong the last month of last season under Flip and appeared to be picking up where he left off early this season. But like all the other young players on this team, Zach has regressed under Sam. Even Dieng hasn't improved statistically in most areas. And of course the team has gotten worse over the course of this season. If that's not a pattern indicative of poor coaching I don't know what would be.

Nothing we've seen so far this season, absolutely nothing, should be relied upon for any personnel decisions related to any of our young players. It would be like relying on a tainted blood sample to lock someone up for a crime based on DNA. Sam has to go. In his place we need a competent head coach and high caliber coaching staff running this team for at least half a season before we make any decisions regarding Zach, Wiggns, Bazz, Dieng, KAT or Belly. Making personnel decisions on these guys under current circumstances would be akin to medical malpractice.

Bazz is shooting a better TS% this year than last, he is scoring more efficiently through more games in fewer minutes played. Wiggins is also shooting a better TS% as a result of getting to the line more and being more agressive. Dieng has made strides as well. I think the only young player that is regressing is Lavine. I think his decision making is a real problem and not something to gloss over. He wouldnt be the first NBA player with world class athletic gifts who didn't have the head on his shoulders to make it work. Would a better coach have gotten more out of all of these players, yes I agree on that point. But I think its fair to question this assumed narrative that Zach truly has all star potential when he has been so awful this year.

Until tyus into the rotation lavine was in second in the 6th man of the year race. Is he playing mediocre now yes but to say he has been awful is a terrible take

[Mstermisty [enjin:6864008]]

Lavine/Bazz/Kmart dumbest lineup ever. No point guards, no ball movement, no defense. Sam is clueless.