Shabazz game recap

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

The reality right now is that I'm not even sure how Shabazz would get minutes at this point. Does anyone realistically think he should leapfrog Brewer or Budinger in the SF rotation? Our full squad has five natural SFs, of which Shabazz is one of them (the others are Brewer, Budinger, Mbah Moute, and Hummel).

Perhaps earlier in the year when Shved was really awful and Budinger was hurt, Adelman could have fed him some more minutes instead of Hummel. But he didn't for whatever reason, presumably because he didn't earn those minutes in practice.

I think folks that preferred McCollum in the draft (myself included) felt that he could push Shved for minutes off the bench as our backup 2. It's nearly impossible to see Shabazz play SG given his poor defensive reactions and handles. That leaves him stuck behind a boatload of established vets at SF.

Hopefully he keeps playing well in the D-League and his value increases, whether in the form of a trade asset or as a potential backup SF next year for us if we end up trading one of our vet SFs.

[ace [enjin:6598567]]

I think he could leapfrog Barea rather easily. Run a lineup of Shved/Bud/Shabazz/LMaM/Turiaf. Three scorers, three good rebounders, and two really good defenders.

[markkbu [enjin:6588958]]

Markkbu- What are you even talking about? Bud has played 2 games this year and the bench dropped several single digit scoring games since the D Will trade. The bench is the sole reason we are .500 and not better. They've given up huge leads in several games and it has forced Adelman to bring the starters back way too early causing them to lose close games because they are gassed. We can look forward to better production now that Bud and Ronny are back, but almost your entire post doesn't even make sense as a response to mine.

Khans.........wow..........I don't know where to start with this. I guess you should start by reading the thread entitled "the bench" that Q started. That way I don't have to re-hash a bunch of already well-documented stuff.

I would also suggest that you look at average minutes played by the starters........you'll see that the only ones that play significantly more for their position than average starters are Love and Pek (our 2 highest paid players). And Love plays less than most of the top 10 players in the league. So, the "gassed" arguments really doesn't have any #s that back it.

Anyone that says that "The bench is the sole reason we are .500 and not better." doesn't sound like reality fits into their world, but you might just be uneducated on the Wolves.

Our bench was the worst in the league until the D-Will trade......that is very obvious........there has been significant improvement since then and lately the bench has been playing very well.

[khans2k5 [enjin:6608728]]

Ya dude, the bench is doing so well. Not according to the actual stats: http://www.82games.com/1314/1314MIN.HTM. Every bench player is being out-produced by their counterpart on the other team. The stats are only as of 1/5, but we've only played 3 games since that date so the stats aren't that outdated. There's also a difference between total minutes played versus how many minutes played straight down the stretch. They don't play that many total minutes because they have big leads going into the second half and the 4th quarter. But when the bench gives up that lead, Adelman has to bring the starters back early and they do get gassed at the end. When those leads crumble they have to grind out the last 8-10 minutes of a game and that is tough for any player to do, especially for guys as big as Love and Pek. The primary bench players that have been out there outside of Bud and Ronny are averaging 21.5 PPG as a collective unit. That means our starters have to score the other 80 for us to stand a chance. If two bench guys can score 10 PPG then that alone almost covers what the current 4 are giving us and some teams have guys who can give them that production alone on any given night. The starters have done everything they can do to win. They are one of the best lineups in all of basketball, so that means something else is costing us the game. A few mistakes down the stretch shouldn't matter with the leads the starters build on a regular basis.

[mjs34]

Markkbu- What are you even talking about? Bud has played 2 games this year and the bench dropped several single digit scoring games since the D Will trade. The bench is the sole reason we are .500 and not better. They've given up huge leads in several games and it has forced Adelman to bring the starters back way too early causing them to lose close games because they are gassed. We can look forward to better production now that Bud and Ronny are back, but almost your entire post doesn't even make sense as a response to mine.

SJM- Adelman is not going to run trial by error lineups in real games in hopes Bazz proves he can play. That's why guys earn their time in practice. You're risking games that we can't afford to risk just to play a rookie to see if he can help us win. If we were in a solid playoff standing, we could afford the risk, but right now we are on the outside looking in and aren't in risk taking mode.

Khans, I would agree with you if our bench has shown anything up to this point. Every time they hit the floor we are "risking games". So why does it matter who we are risking them with?

Q, you are right that it will be hard for him to see minutes over Bud and Brewer, but Luc and Hummel really haven't shown anything in their minutes to this point. If we are pounding a team, there is no reason that Shabazz couldn't see a ten minute stretch late in the game. I am also completely prepared for the next set of injuries. My concern as always, is how this team can make any significant gains if we don't improve from within. We can't give someone a few minutes and make major long term predictions about their game.

I was also on board with drafting CJ, mainly because he seemed like a guy that could create his shot. I think that is something completely lacking on this team. If we can play JJ at the SG for minutes, we could certainly afford to do the same with CJ.

[mjs34]

Markkbu- What are you even talking about? Bud has played 2 games this year and the bench dropped several single digit scoring games since the D Will trade. The bench is the sole reason we are .500 and not better. They've given up huge leads in several games and it has forced Adelman to bring the starters back way too early causing them to lose close games because they are gassed. We can look forward to better production now that Bud and Ronny are back, but almost your entire post doesn't even make sense as a response to mine.

SJM- Adelman is not going to run trial by error lineups in real games in hopes Bazz proves he can play. That's why guys earn their time in practice. You're risking games that we can't afford to risk just to play a rookie to see if he can help us win. If we were in a solid playoff standing, we could afford the risk, but right now we are on the outside looking in and aren't in risk taking mode.

Khans, I would agree with you if our bench has shown anything up to this point. Every time they hit the floor we are "risking games". So why does it matter who we are risking them with?

Q, you are right that it will be hard for him to see minutes over Bud and Brewer, but Luc and Hummel really haven't shown anything in their minutes to this point. If we are pounding a team, there is no reason that Shabazz couldn't see a ten minute stretch late in the game. I am also completely prepared for the next set of injuries. My concern as always, is how this team can make any significant gains if we don't improve from within. We can't give someone a few minutes and make major long term predictions about their game.

I was also on board with drafting CJ, mainly because he seemed like a guy that could create his shot. I think that is something completely lacking on this team. If we can play JJ at the SG for minutes, we could certainly afford to do the same with CJ.

[thedoper]

The reality right now is that I'm not even sure how Shabazz would get minutes at this point. Does anyone realistically think he should leapfrog Brewer or Budinger in the SF rotation? Our full squad has five natural SFs, of which Shabazz is one of them (the others are Brewer, Budinger, Mbah Moute, and Hummel).

Perhaps earlier in the year when Shved was really awful and Budinger was hurt, Adelman could have fed him some more minutes instead of Hummel. But he didn't for whatever reason, presumably because he didn't earn those minutes in practice.

I think folks that preferred McCollum in the draft (myself included) felt that he could push Shved for minutes off the bench as our backup 2. It's nearly impossible to see Shabazz play SG given his poor defensive reactions and handles. That leaves him stuck behind a boatload of established vets at SF.

Hopefully he keeps playing well in the D-League and his value increases, whether in the form of a trade asset or as a potential backup SF next year for us if we end up trading one of our vet SFs.

Our bench's defensive efficiency is the worst in the league. We really aren't giving up anything that way by trying Shabazz at the 2. It can't get any worse than the worst.

http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/teamstats/14/7/diffeff/1-1

[markkbu [enjin:6588958]]

LMAO.....any backtracking before I point out how dumb it is to blame the bench for recent losses? anyone? anyone?

[mjs34]

looks like Shabazz is on his way back to the wolves.

Ray Richardson: #Twolves assignee Shabazz Muhammad said he came to D-League and "took care of business." Flip took him aside, said he's coming back tonight. Twitter @twolvesnow

[khans2k5 [enjin:6608728]]

Markkbu - We're talking about the WHOLE season not just a 5 game stretch. Way to use a small sample size to prove your point. I hope you never become a statistician because you'll be making all kinds of claims on small sample sizes. Take a peek at the link above your last post and you'll see how ridiculous it is to say the bench hasn't been our most significant downfall for this WHOLE season. 23rd in offensive efficiency and last in defensive efficiency among all the NBA benches. Our starters are 4th in offensive efficiency and 5th in defensive efficiency among all starting 5's in the NBA. I wonder why we are 1 game under .500?