sjm34 wrote:Michael Jordan averaged 13.5 pts in his freshman season with the same efficiency as Wiggins. Some might think he had a pretty good supporting cast as well.
Well MJ shot like 55%in college, and Wiggins 44% so not quite as efficient. I think MJ win the tourny in his freshman year as well
Exactly Alex. And Jordan didn't have the benefit of getting 3 points on long-range jumpers. All of his shots were worth 2 points (Wiggins shot 49% vs. Jordan's 55% on 2-pointers - but again - some of Jordan's 2 point shots were probably out beyond the current day 3-point arc, making his FG% all the more impressive).
Jordan also played college ball in a different era, when as a freshman, he was regularly competing with and against teams loaded with junior and senior starters. The fact he made the starting lineup of the UNC squad as a freshman is a testament to how talented and skilled he was right off the bat.
This is so stupid. The young man hasn't even played a regular season game yet. No one here has a clue what he is going to turn out to be. For those saying he will never be Jordan - way to go out on a limb! But don't tell me we should be happy if he ascends to the level of Batum. That's just nonsense.
I guess we skipped over the freshman year portion of my post. Jordan shot a TS% of 56.7 while Wiggins was 57.2. Even if you take out extra points for 3pt shots, Wiggins was still 53.1%. Of course if you are taking away the 3 pt shots, then you have to take into account things like more advanced scouting against Wiggins.
I am completely ignoring the fact that Jordan didn't' take a lot of "long-range jumpers" in college because he hadn't developed that part of his game yet. You should also note that Wiggins took 30% of his shots from 3, and yet still got to the line over twice as many times as MJ did.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:This is so stupid. The young man hasn't even played a regular season game yet. No one here has a clue what he is going to turn out to be. For those saying he will never be Jordan - way to go out on a limb! But don't tell me we should be happy if he ascends to the level of Batum. That's just nonsense.
Of course no one can be certain about anything, but I actually think we do have a clue. It's not like Wiggins has been hidden away for no one to see. The fundamental outlines of these high-level prospects that have been playing for many years in elite competitions are fairly well established. I think Batum is a very reasonable comp. He could be better, he could be worse. "Ceiling" implies best-case scenario. Batum is somewhere in the mid-range of what I think he can achieve.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:This is so stupid. The young man hasn't even played a regular season game yet. No one here has a clue what he is going to turn out to be. For those saying he will never be Jordan - way to go out on a limb! But don't tell me we should be happy if he ascends to the level of Batum. That's just nonsense.
Of course no one can be certain about anything, but I actually think we do have a clue. It's not like Wiggins has been hidden away for no one to see. The fundamental outlines of these high-level prospects that have been playing for many years in elite competitions are fairly well established. I think Batum is a very reasonable comp. He could be better, he could be worse. "Ceiling" implies best-case scenario. Batum is somewhere in the mid-range of what I think he can achieve.
Okay I'll play along here. If Batum is his mid-range, what IS his ceiling and floor as far as you're concerned?
CoolBreeze44 wrote:This is so stupid. The young man hasn't even played a regular season game yet. No one here has a clue what he is going to turn out to be. For those saying he will never be Jordan - way to go out on a limb! But don't tell me we should be happy if he ascends to the level of Batum. That's just nonsense.
Cool, I agree with you completely. Q kept proposing this ariza-derozan-batum level for wiggins. I think thats absurd. For one, Im fairly certain wiggins will be way better than all 3. Ariza isnt even a floor for wiggins. Come on now. Wiggins has been highly touted and ranked since high school. He has scouts scruntinizing his game since he was a teen and he still is by the way. He is also a much better athlete than those 3 and they are pretty good athletes themselves. Batum/derozan/Gay are wiggins floor fo me and im confident he will be better than those 3.
While were at it, stop with this mj comparison as well. MJ is the arguably the best basketball player ever. Kobe and bron arent better than jordan so why are we comparing wiggins to jordan and making a case for it?
For me, Paul George/Paul Pierce is a more apt ceiling for wiggins. He cetainly has the tools to be better than those 2 as well. Just tired of seeing posts comparing him to mj or this ariza/batum/derozan level that is being harped on.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:This is so stupid. The young man hasn't even played a regular season game yet. No one here has a clue what he is going to turn out to be. For those saying he will never be Jordan - way to go out on a limb! But don't tell me we should be happy if he ascends to the level of Batum. That's just nonsense.
Of course no one can be certain about anything, but I actually think we do have a clue. It's not like Wiggins has been hidden away for no one to see. The fundamental outlines of these high-level prospects that have been playing for many years in elite competitions are fairly well established. I think Batum is a very reasonable comp. He could be better, he could be worse. "Ceiling" implies best-case scenario. Batum is somewhere in the mid-range of what I think he can achieve.
Okay I'll play along here. If Batum is his mid-range, what IS his ceiling and floor as far as you're concerned?
I've mentioned this before, but I think his floor is Harrison Barnes and his ceiling is Paul George. A floor and a ceiling implies worst case and best case and therefore the odds are limited that either one happens. That's why I think he is most likely to end up in the Ariza-DeRozan-Batum-Leonard range. Those are all real solid players.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:This is so stupid. The young man hasn't even played a regular season game yet. No one here has a clue what he is going to turn out to be. For those saying he will never be Jordan - way to go out on a limb! But don't tell me we should be happy if he ascends to the level of Batum. That's just nonsense.
Cool, I agree with you completely. Q kept proposing this ariza-derozan-batum level for wiggins. I think thats absurd. For one, Im fairly certain wiggins will be way better than all 3. Ariza isnt even a floor for wiggins. Come on now. Wiggins has been highly touted and ranked since high school. He has scouts scruntinizing his game since he was a teen and he still is by the way. He is also a much better athlete than those 3 and they are pretty good athletes themselves. Batum/derozan/Gay are wiggins floor fo me and im confident he will be better than those 3.
While were at it, stop with this mj comparison as well. MJ is the arguably the best basketball player ever. Kobe and bron arent better than jordan so why are we comparing wiggins to jordan and making a case for it?
For me, Paul George/Paul Pierce is a more apt ceiling for wiggins. He cetainly has the tools to be better than those 2 as well. Just tired of seeing posts comparing him to mj or this ariza/batum/derozan level that is being harped on.
I didn't compare him to MJ, that was SJM when he used MJ as an example of a superstar that had what he thought was just an OK-ish freshman season, implying that we can't rule out Wiggins becoming a superstar someday just because he didn't have a dominant year at KU. I really do think we learned a lot about Wiggins in his one season at KU and it provided a good outline of his game and his potential in the NBA. By no means is the picture complete, but the outline is there.....
I actually agree that Paul George is Wiggins' ceiling. But ceiling implies realistic best-case scenerio, not realistic most likely case scenario. My comparisons focus on what will most likely happen, not what I hope happens.
Q, I know that your comparisons is based on what you think will likely happen. My take is its off. No way wiggins end up on ariza level, thats just ridiculous. The George/pierce comp from me is also what I think will most likely happen and not what I hope.
You ignored the scouts/analysts that have followed wiggins since he was a teen and those who do it for a living. Never in their right minds would they have ariza/batum/derozan ranked #1 over a jabari parker.
worldK wrote:Q, I know that your comparisons is based on what you think will likely happen. My take is its off. No way wiggins end up on ariza level, thats just ridiculous. The George/pierce comp from me is also what I think will most likely happen and not what I hope.
You ignored the scouts/analysts that have followed wiggins since he was a teen and those who do it for a living. Never in their right minds would they have ariza/batum/derozan ranked #1 over a jabari parker.
I remember reading many of those same scouts and analysts telling us how great Harrison Barnes, John Wall, Shabazz Muhammed, OJ Mayo, and DeMar DeRozan were going to be. None of them have turned into the superstars that some predicted they would become when they were in high school.
You are saying that Wiggins' most likely scenario is Paul George. That's pretty damn bold in my opinion. What's his best case scenario then in your opinion?
