Good to hear that Flip is talking with Rubio's agent about an extension but I fail to understand the significance of Parsons having the same agent. I am sure that happens all the time, and should have no bearing on the negotiation what so ever.
Darren Wolfson @DarrenWolfson about 38 minutes ago
Yes, there's been dialogue w/ Rubio's camp. Eligible to sign extension this summer. Won't be an easy negotiation. Agent also has Parsons.
Read more: http://hoopshype.com/twitter/tag/minnesota_timberwolves#ixzz36EilDnfL
Rubio Extension?
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Hicks123 [enjin:6700838]
- Posts: 931
- Joined: Thu Jul 18, 2013 12:00 am
Re: Rubio Extension?
Yeah, one thing has nothing to do with the other.
I am curious to know what other fans think of Rubio's current value. Personally, I am not a huge fan. I believe Curry got paid a salary starting at just over $10M, which is turning into a bargain. Unfortunately, based on other recent salaries for PG, Rubio will probably get the same, which is unfortunate. Rubio is a $6-8M player that will get paid $10-12M per. I know many on this board will freak out over that last comment, but I stand by it. The issue with the NBA today is that when one middle-of-the-road PG gets more than he deserves (i.e. Holiday), then the next similar guy gets a little bit more, and so on and so forth. Many of the worst decisions owners and GM's make is feeling "forced" to keep that guy just because you are scared to lose them. These guys are seemingly more often than not on the trade block the following years, but hard to deal because of their contract.
Now, this is the tough part about discussing an early extension. If, by some miracle from god, Rubio all of the sudden develops his jumpshot as well as his ability to score near the basket, then $10-12M will be appropriate when considering the rest of his skillset. But if he doesn't (I am in this wagon), then a contract that large, over the course of 4-5 seasons, could be extremely burdensome.
What are others thoughts?
I am curious to know what other fans think of Rubio's current value. Personally, I am not a huge fan. I believe Curry got paid a salary starting at just over $10M, which is turning into a bargain. Unfortunately, based on other recent salaries for PG, Rubio will probably get the same, which is unfortunate. Rubio is a $6-8M player that will get paid $10-12M per. I know many on this board will freak out over that last comment, but I stand by it. The issue with the NBA today is that when one middle-of-the-road PG gets more than he deserves (i.e. Holiday), then the next similar guy gets a little bit more, and so on and so forth. Many of the worst decisions owners and GM's make is feeling "forced" to keep that guy just because you are scared to lose them. These guys are seemingly more often than not on the trade block the following years, but hard to deal because of their contract.
Now, this is the tough part about discussing an early extension. If, by some miracle from god, Rubio all of the sudden develops his jumpshot as well as his ability to score near the basket, then $10-12M will be appropriate when considering the rest of his skillset. But if he doesn't (I am in this wagon), then a contract that large, over the course of 4-5 seasons, could be extremely burdensome.
What are others thoughts?
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northernhoops [enjin:9491634]
- Posts: 313
- Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2014 12:00 am
Re: Rubio Extension?
Hicks123 wrote:Yeah, one thing has nothing to do with the other.
I am curious to know what other fans think of Rubio's current value. Personally, I am not a huge fan. I believe Curry got paid a salary starting at just over $10M, which is turning into a bargain. Unfortunately, based on other recent salaries for PG, Rubio will probably get the same, which is unfortunate. Rubio is a $6-8M player that will get paid $10-12M per. I know many on this board will freak out over that last comment, but I stand by it. The issue with the NBA today is that when one middle-of-the-road PG gets more than he deserves (i.e. Holiday), then the next similar guy gets a little bit more, and so on and so forth. Many of the worst decisions owners and GM's make is feeling "forced" to keep that guy just because you are scared to lose them. These guys are seemingly more often than not on the trade block the following years, but hard to deal because of their contract.
Now, this is the tough part about discussing an early extension. If, by some miracle from god, Rubio all of the sudden develops his jumpshot as well as his ability to score near the basket, then $10-12M will be appropriate when considering the rest of his skillset. But if he doesn't (I am in this wagon), then a contract that large, over the course of 4-5 seasons, could be extremely burdensome.
What are others thoughts?
I'd offer him 6-8/Year. Tell him in order to build a team around him, he's gotta sacrifice. If he turns it down, match someone else's offer if it comes to that
Re: Rubio Extension?
Doogie brought up Parsons because he could be a Love trade target. If Flip gets stingy with Ricky then the agent could steer Parsons away from Minnesota.
I can see where people come from about not being a fan of Ricky especially with the way the NBA is now with big time scoring point guards but I love Rickys game and feel that getting away from a stationary game plan will really bring out the best in him. I think 10 would be a fine price and eventually a bargain.
I can see where people come from about not being a fan of Ricky especially with the way the NBA is now with big time scoring point guards but I love Rickys game and feel that getting away from a stationary game plan will really bring out the best in him. I think 10 would be a fine price and eventually a bargain.
Re: Rubio Extension?
Its tough but this reminds me of last summer when I ripped (but understood why they did it) Wall getting 5 years 80 million. He played well this year and his team won.
I am a believer in Rubio and if we could lock him up for 10 million a year It may be a bit of a tough pill to swallow but he could improve a lot and make that contract look very good. So if he doesn't improve much and he is still worth say 7 million per we are over paying 3 million a year. That's not good but that's not terrible either. I can think of worse contracts. We don't know what his camp is looking for though. He finished what top 5 in assists and steals? I think they are going to ask for more than 10 million. I wish Ricky would get ahead of the times and take less money now on his first big contract so we can add more players. That's asking a lot I know. If I was a team trying to sign him I'd give him 8 million a year without batting an eye and that's even if he doesn't get better.
I am a believer in Rubio and if we could lock him up for 10 million a year It may be a bit of a tough pill to swallow but he could improve a lot and make that contract look very good. So if he doesn't improve much and he is still worth say 7 million per we are over paying 3 million a year. That's not good but that's not terrible either. I can think of worse contracts. We don't know what his camp is looking for though. He finished what top 5 in assists and steals? I think they are going to ask for more than 10 million. I wish Ricky would get ahead of the times and take less money now on his first big contract so we can add more players. That's asking a lot I know. If I was a team trying to sign him I'd give him 8 million a year without batting an eye and that's even if he doesn't get better.
Re: Rubio Extension?
If I was Ricky, I wouldn't take less so the wolves could throw it away on guys like Buddinger and Pek. You gave Pek 12 mil, and now some think 10 is too much for Ricky. Ricky is way more important to this team than Pek is. I would offer Ricky something around 9 to start which would be a little over 40 for 4 years. Would be real happy with that. I think signing the extension this off season should get the wovles a discount, and I think the agent should know that risking a match in RFA could cost Ricky substantial dollars.
Maybe they could give an incentive for TS%.
Maybe they could give an incentive for TS%.
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Hicks123 [enjin:6700838]
- Posts: 931
- Joined: Thu Jul 18, 2013 12:00 am
Re: Rubio Extension?
sjm34 wrote:If I was Ricky, I wouldn't take less so the wolves could throw it away on guys like Buddinger and Pek. You gave Pek 12 mil, and now some think 10 is too much for Ricky. Ricky is way more important to this team than Pek is. I would offer Ricky something around 9 to start which would be a little over 40 for 4 years. Would be real happy with that. I think signing the extension this off season should get the wovles a discount, and I think the agent should know that risking a match in RFA could cost Ricky substantial dollars.
Maybe they could give an incentive for TS%.
SJM,
The bolded part above is precisely the problem I outlined before. The Pek contract, as many agreed at the time, was substantially more than he was worth. You don't compound the problem by overpaying another player just because you overextended yourself with a guy like Pek. The rationale needs to be held seperate.
Seems like Lowry is a guy that is going to get in the area of $10M per. Would the board prefer Ricky or Lowry for 4yr/$40M if given the option? I think Lowry is a much more complete, and simply better overall player, yet they will probably make the same (btw...current rumor has Lowry in Miami after Bosh takes $11M per and Wade takes $12M). I understand Lowry isn't available to us at the moment, but I think you need to look at market value before you jump on a guy like Rubio.
Re: Rubio Extension?
Several Points:
First, we can't set a player's value based on an assessment of his stats or abilities relative to others at his position or relative to players at any other position. The market sets a player's value. And unfortunately, the market requires a franchise like the Timberwolves to pay a premium for good players because of our history, current roster, prospects for success, market size, climate and front office personnel. We have a history of losing, a mediocre non-playoff roster in the midst of uncertainty over Love, questionable prospects of success, a cold winter market without much of any glitz or cache. In addition, our front office staff is completely unproven and lacks anyone like a Pat Riley, Phil Jackson or even Kevin McHale who might be a draw for some players. So, the Wolves will have to pay more than other teams to keep Ricky here. How much will that be? Depends on what other teams would likely to willing to pay. Get that number and then add a percentage upcharge and that's what it would take to re-sign Ricky. Note that we'd have to add an upcharge to sign Kyle Lowry as well.
Second, Ricky has value beyond his stats and performance on the court. His personality, looks, style of play and international stature add to his value and will utimately be reflected in his contract regardless of who signs him. These characteristics put butts in seats, but even from a basketball standpoint, they can help attract talent. Other players like playing with a pass-first PG and Ricky is the pentultimate pass-first PG.
Third, Ricky's value on the court tends to be undervalued by some on this board. Yes, his shot needs work. But he's not just a good playmaker, he's a great playmaker. And it's not just his passing; it's also how he runs the offense and gets people in position. It's not even just his playmaking. He's one of the top rebounders at its position and one of the best ball-theives as well. He's also still young with upside.
Put it all together and I would expect it will take at least what we paid Pek to keep him here on a 4-year deal. I'd definitely give Ricky that deal and I'd look to deal Pek.
First, we can't set a player's value based on an assessment of his stats or abilities relative to others at his position or relative to players at any other position. The market sets a player's value. And unfortunately, the market requires a franchise like the Timberwolves to pay a premium for good players because of our history, current roster, prospects for success, market size, climate and front office personnel. We have a history of losing, a mediocre non-playoff roster in the midst of uncertainty over Love, questionable prospects of success, a cold winter market without much of any glitz or cache. In addition, our front office staff is completely unproven and lacks anyone like a Pat Riley, Phil Jackson or even Kevin McHale who might be a draw for some players. So, the Wolves will have to pay more than other teams to keep Ricky here. How much will that be? Depends on what other teams would likely to willing to pay. Get that number and then add a percentage upcharge and that's what it would take to re-sign Ricky. Note that we'd have to add an upcharge to sign Kyle Lowry as well.
Second, Ricky has value beyond his stats and performance on the court. His personality, looks, style of play and international stature add to his value and will utimately be reflected in his contract regardless of who signs him. These characteristics put butts in seats, but even from a basketball standpoint, they can help attract talent. Other players like playing with a pass-first PG and Ricky is the pentultimate pass-first PG.
Third, Ricky's value on the court tends to be undervalued by some on this board. Yes, his shot needs work. But he's not just a good playmaker, he's a great playmaker. And it's not just his passing; it's also how he runs the offense and gets people in position. It's not even just his playmaking. He's one of the top rebounders at its position and one of the best ball-theives as well. He's also still young with upside.
Put it all together and I would expect it will take at least what we paid Pek to keep him here on a 4-year deal. I'd definitely give Ricky that deal and I'd look to deal Pek.
Re: Rubio Extension?
Rumor has it that the Raptors are offering Lowry $14.5M. Hopefully that's not the case otherwise I can see Ricky getting something along those lines. If I'm Ricky's agent I'm going for the max, casual Wolves fans will herald Ricky as a hero after Love leaves and marketability counts even if Ricky's NBA skills aren't sharp as the payday demands
Re: Rubio Extension?
Hicks123 wrote:
...Seems like Lowry is a guy that is going to get in the area of $10M per. Would the board prefer Ricky or Lowry for 4yr/$40M if given the option? I think Lowry is a much more complete, and simply better overall player, yet they will probably make the same (btw...current rumor has Lowry in Miami after Bosh takes $11M per and Wade takes $12M). I understand Lowry isn't available to us at the moment, but I think you need to look at market value before you jump on a guy like Rubio.
Adrian Wojnarowski @WojYahooNBA
After Toronto/Houston visits, Lowry huddling w/ agent Andy Miller. Heat, Lakers want meetings. Holding pattern, mulling Raps/Rockets offers.
Lets hope this stays true and he picks one of those 2, pref Toronto since the West is tough enough already.