Around the League - '23-24 Season

[Lipoli390]

Well, I could go resuscitate the "Lip was right" thread and talk about how Rudy gums up our offense, but we are far worse when he's on the bench!

Assuming we run it back, Finch and his assistants have their work cut out for them between now and the end of training camp to figure out how to get more out of an offense where the whole is less than the sum of the individual parts.

Couple thoughts.

They were able to hide Luka on Rudy. Now when Rudy sat against the Mavs the defense was not good so I’m not sure what the correct trade off is.

Lip is right that Kat is a better 3 pt shooter than horford, however horford shoots more 3s than Kat does per game during the playoffs. Kat is shooting 2.5 less 3s per game than he was the year before Ant got here. For whatever reason Kat volume has went down while the NBA volume has went up for 3 pointers.

Ant and Kat are really special players but they don’t play off each other well. Do you know Rudy Gobert had 1 less assist this season to Mike Conley than Kat had to Ant this year. For whatever reason those 2 don’t have great on court chemistry. There is no reason they can’t destroy teams in PnR and PnP game sort of like how Lavine and Gorgui had great chemistry back when we were bad.

Another thing is Kat had a career low in roll frequency this year in the PnR. A not so fun fact that zero possession this playoffs ended with a Kat PnR shot attempt or foul. Kind of crazy.

Wolves don’t have the iso creators that the Celtics do. Celtics had 4.5 good iso scorers. Wolves have 1.5. Allows teams to load up more.

Ant can’t throw a lob, if he could to Rudy a lot of issues would be solved.

The bench fell off. Naw shot 3 of 21 his last 6 games from 3. Outside of 1 game a series from Naz, Naz was bad this postseason, slow mo spacing issues and got nothing from the backup PGs

I am in team run it back but they need to figure out how to create Kat and Ant on court chemistry. Them at the moment score in spurts because of their individual talents not because they make each other better. Also go back to what made you great Kat and let it fly from 3. No reason not to have 10 3PA a game. You are the best big to ever shoot a basketball, play to your strengths and let it fly like he for the DR this summer

Good stuff Kek.

Here is what's maddening....The Wolves had the #8 offense just a few seasons ago with 3/5ths of their existing starting lineup in place: KAT, Ant, and Jaden. The other two starters? DLO and Vando (and sometimes PBev would start instead of Jaden).

Could DLO be the missing piece!? LOL...But seriously, it's pretty discouraging that Finch, his staff, and the vets on our team can't figure out a way to get more out of an offense with one of the best shooting bigs in history and a young player on the cusp of superstardom.

I agree with Ken’s analysis about what happened in the Wolves-Dallas series and what we need to do if we bring the team back next season. As to your question about the Wolves offensive decline from our 46-win season I’ll just say what should be obvious - the answer is the addition of Rudy. His presence dramatically changes the offense in a way that undermines the strengths of Ant and KAT, both individually and collectively. If we bring Rudy back, which is highly likely, I think Kek has the right answer - far more three attempts from KAT. But if we want to get back to a top 8 offense, we’d need to move Rudy and have an offense that’s faster with better spacing and more ball movement. I’ll note that we were the 8th best offense when Ant, Jaden and Naz weren’t nearly as good offensively as they are now. In fact, Naz was a non-factor that season. So this could be a high-powered offense. I’ve always thought the right move two years ago was to upgrade the PF position to a bigger and better version of Vando - someone in the mold of Aaron Gordon - improving our defense without undermining our offense and likely improving our offense. Alas, TC chose the Rudy path. There are always tradeoffs. Rudy brings a lot of good, but it’s not all good. The extra problem is that getting Rudy, with his considerable pluses but also minuses, cost us the transactional leeway to maneuver and improve the team.

[Q-is-here]

Couple thoughts.

They were able to hide Luka on Rudy. Now when Rudy sat against the Mavs the defense was not good so I’m not sure what the correct trade off is.

Lip is right that Kat is a better 3 pt shooter than horford, however horford shoots more 3s than Kat does per game during the playoffs. Kat is shooting 2.5 less 3s per game than he was the year before Ant got here. For whatever reason Kat volume has went down while the NBA volume has went up for 3 pointers.

Ant and Kat are really special players but they don’t play off each other well. Do you know Rudy Gobert had 1 less assist this season to Mike Conley than Kat had to Ant this year. For whatever reason those 2 don’t have great on court chemistry. There is no reason they can’t destroy teams in PnR and PnP game sort of like how Lavine and Gorgui had great chemistry back when we were bad.

Another thing is Kat had a career low in roll frequency this year in the PnR. A not so fun fact that zero possession this playoffs ended with a Kat PnR shot attempt or foul. Kind of crazy.

Wolves don’t have the iso creators that the Celtics do. Celtics had 4.5 good iso scorers. Wolves have 1.5. Allows teams to load up more.

Ant can’t throw a lob, if he could to Rudy a lot of issues would be solved.

The bench fell off. Naw shot 3 of 21 his last 6 games from 3. Outside of 1 game a series from Naz, Naz was bad this postseason, slow mo spacing issues and got nothing from the backup PGs

I am in team run it back but they need to figure out how to create Kat and Ant on court chemistry. Them at the moment score in spurts because of their individual talents not because they make each other better. Also go back to what made you great Kat and let it fly from 3. No reason not to have 10 3PA a game. You are the best big to ever shoot a basketball, play to your strengths and let it fly like he for the DR this summer

Good stuff Kek.

Here is what's maddening....The Wolves had the #8 offense just a few seasons ago with 3/5ths of their existing starting lineup in place: KAT, Ant, and Jaden. The other two starters? DLO and Vando (and sometimes PBev would start instead of Jaden).

Could DLO be the missing piece!? LOL...But seriously, it's pretty discouraging that Finch, his staff, and the vets on our team can't figure out a way to get more out of an offense with one of the best shooting bigs in history and a young player on the cusp of superstardom.

I agree with Ken’s analysis about what happened in the Wolves-Dallas series and what we need to do if we bring the team back next season. As to your question about the Wolves offensive decline from our 46-win season I’ll just say what should be obvious - the answer is the addition of Rudy. His presence dramatically changes the offense in a way that undermines the strengths of Ant and KAT, both individually and collectively. If we bring Rudy back, which is highly likely, I think Kek has the right answer - far more three attempts from KAT. But if we want to get back to a top 8 offense, we’d need to move Rudy and have an offense that’s faster with better spacing and more ball movement. I’ll note that we were the 8th best offense when Ant, Jaden and Naz weren’t nearly as good offensively as they are now. In fact, Naz was a non-factor that season. So this could be a high-powered offense. I’ve always thought the right move two years ago was to upgrade the PF position to a bigger and better version of Vando - someone in the mold of Aaron Gordon - improving our defense without undermining our offense and likely improving our offense. Alas, TC chose the Rudy path. There are always tradeoffs. Rudy brings a lot of good, but it’s not all good. The extra problem is that getting Rudy, with his considerable pluses but also minuses, cost us the transactional leeway to maneuver and improve the team.

But Lip, Rudy DID improve the team. He just prevented us from improving it in a different way which we can only speculate whether it would have been better. I think making the WCF has to be deemed a success and validates the trade for Rudy.

I think the guy that has to go is SloMo and we need to make sure every guy that comes off the bench for us can hit the 3 consistently. Rudy should literally be the only guy that can't make a 3 in our rotation. Ultimately Ant is a pick-and-pop/drive- and-kick player, not a pick and roll guru like Doncic or Harden or even DLO.

[thedoper]

I think it is clear that Jaden is not yet the defender that Jrue is. Hope he gets there, i'd love to see him bulk up just a bit.

[Lipoli390]

Good stuff Kek.

Here is what's maddening....The Wolves had the #8 offense just a few seasons ago with 3/5ths of their existing starting lineup in place: KAT, Ant, and Jaden. The other two starters? DLO and Vando (and sometimes PBev would start instead of Jaden).

Could DLO be the missing piece!? LOL...But seriously, it's pretty discouraging that Finch, his staff, and the vets on our team can't figure out a way to get more out of an offense with one of the best shooting bigs in history and a young player on the cusp of superstardom.

I agree with Ken’s analysis about what happened in the Wolves-Dallas series and what we need to do if we bring the team back next season. As to your question about the Wolves offensive decline from our 46-win season I’ll just say what should be obvious - the answer is the addition of Rudy. His presence dramatically changes the offense in a way that undermines the strengths of Ant and KAT, both individually and collectively. If we bring Rudy back, which is highly likely, I think Kek has the right answer - far more three attempts from KAT. But if we want to get back to a top 8 offense, we’d need to move Rudy and have an offense that’s faster with better spacing and more ball movement. I’ll note that we were the 8th best offense when Ant, Jaden and Naz weren’t nearly as good offensively as they are now. In fact, Naz was a non-factor that season. So this could be a high-powered offense. I’ve always thought the right move two years ago was to upgrade the PF position to a bigger and better version of Vando - someone in the mold of Aaron Gordon - improving our defense without undermining our offense and likely improving our offense. Alas, TC chose the Rudy path. There are always tradeoffs. Rudy brings a lot of good, but it’s not all good. The extra problem is that getting Rudy, with his considerable pluses but also minuses, cost us the transactional leeway to maneuver and improve the team.

But Lip, Rudy DID improve the team. He just prevented us from improving it in a different way which we can only speculate whether it would have been better. I think making the WCF has to be deemed a success and validates the trade for Rudy.

I think the guy that has to go is SloMo and we need to make sure every guy that comes off the bench for us can hit the 3 consistently. Rudy should literally be the only guy that can't make a 3 in our rotation. Ultimately Ant is a pick-and-pop/drive- and-kick player, not a pick and roll guru like Doncic or Harden or even DLO.

I agree, Q. Well said. My speculation is that we could be as good without Rudy (in a different way), but with more transactional flexibility and a more sustainable winner over time. Having said that, I don’t expect others to accept my speculation over the evidence. The evidence shows a Wolves team that won 56 games and made the Western Conference finals. The evidence also shows Rudy had a big positive impact on the team’s success this season after a miserable showing the season before. So while I still wouldn’t have made the trade, I can’t call it a failure and I will joyfully accept the team’s success.

[Q-is-here]

I think it is clear that Jaden is not yet the defender that Jrue is. Hope he gets there, i'd love to see him bulk up just a bit.

Yeah, White and Holiday are elite. And I think that physical strength plays a big part of it. Besides being able to move their feet well (which Jaden is really good at too), they have the strength to not get knocked off their spots and to guard physically without getting called for the types of ticky-tack fouls Jaden gets called for.

It's too bad we couldn't get past Dallas. I think we would have given Boston a good series.

[Q-is-here]

It's interesting watching this Finals. The team without an MVP-caliber talent is going to pretty easily win the title. I mean, Jaylen Brown and Tatum are going to end the series averaging a fairly pedestrian 20 PPG each. Neither were dominant or had monster games.

But damn, where is their weak link? Not sure they have one. Literally every starter can defend and shoot the 3. And almost every starter can create his own shot off the dribble if needed.

[kekgeek]

Couple thoughts.

They were able to hide Luka on Rudy. Now when Rudy sat against the Mavs the defense was not good so I’m not sure what the correct trade off is.

Lip is right that Kat is a better 3 pt shooter than horford, however horford shoots more 3s than Kat does per game during the playoffs. Kat is shooting 2.5 less 3s per game than he was the year before Ant got here. For whatever reason Kat volume has went down while the NBA volume has went up for 3 pointers.

Ant and Kat are really special players but they don’t play off each other well. Do you know Rudy Gobert had 1 less assist this season to Mike Conley than Kat had to Ant this year. For whatever reason those 2 don’t have great on court chemistry. There is no reason they can’t destroy teams in PnR and PnP game sort of like how Lavine and Gorgui had great chemistry back when we were bad.

Another thing is Kat had a career low in roll frequency this year in the PnR. A not so fun fact that zero possession this playoffs ended with a Kat PnR shot attempt or foul. Kind of crazy.

Wolves don’t have the iso creators that the Celtics do. Celtics had 4.5 good iso scorers. Wolves have 1.5. Allows teams to load up more.

Ant can’t throw a lob, if he could to Rudy a lot of issues would be solved.

The bench fell off. Naw shot 3 of 21 his last 6 games from 3. Outside of 1 game a series from Naz, Naz was bad this postseason, slow mo spacing issues and got nothing from the backup PGs

I am in team run it back but they need to figure out how to create Kat and Ant on court chemistry. Them at the moment score in spurts because of their individual talents not because they make each other better. Also go back to what made you great Kat and let it fly from 3. No reason not to have 10 3PA a game. You are the best big to ever shoot a basketball, play to your strengths and let it fly like he for the DR this summer

Good stuff Kek.

Here is what's maddening....The Wolves had the #8 offense just a few seasons ago with 3/5ths of their existing starting lineup in place: KAT, Ant, and Jaden. The other two starters? DLO and Vando (and sometimes PBev would start instead of Jaden).

Could DLO be the missing piece!? LOL...But seriously, it's pretty discouraging that Finch, his staff, and the vets on our team can't figure out a way to get more out of an offense with one of the best shooting bigs in history and a young player on the cusp of superstardom.

I agree with Ken’s analysis about what happened in the Wolves-Dallas series and what we need to do if we bring the team back next season. As to your question about the Wolves offensive decline from our 46-win season I’ll just say what should be obvious - the answer is the addition of Rudy. His presence dramatically changes the offense in a way that undermines the strengths of Ant and KAT, both individually and collectively. If we bring Rudy back, which is highly likely, I think Kek has the right answer - far more three attempts from KAT. But if we want to get back to a top 8 offense, we’d need to move Rudy and have an offense that’s faster with better spacing and more ball movement. I’ll note that we were the 8th best offense when Ant, Jaden and Naz weren’t nearly as good offensively as they are now. In fact, Naz was a non-factor that season. So this could be a high-powered offense. I’ve always thought the right move two years ago was to upgrade the PF position to a bigger and better version of Vando - someone in the mold of Aaron Gordon - improving our defense without undermining our offense and likely improving our offense. Alas, TC chose the Rudy path. There are always tradeoffs. Rudy brings a lot of good, but it’s not all good. The extra problem is that getting Rudy, with his considerable pluses but also minuses, cost us the transactional leeway to maneuver and improve the team.

Couple things when it comes to just offense rating I think the loss of Dlo does matter a little bit, he was a good passer to players not named Rudy and he could create his own shot, something a lot of the wolves struggle with. Now the trade off with Conley outweighs what Dlo brings but I do think not having another offensive scorer does hurt the team.

The Jazz had the #1 offense in the NBA with Rudy. Yes Rudy faults are glaring but it’s possible to have an elite offense around Rudy.

I know you brought up the offense with and without Rudy this year. And you are right that the wolves were better offensively in the regular season offensively when Rudy sat. Now the difference is not much and the Wolves were an above average offense without Rudy and just a slightly above average offense with Rudy in the regular season.

However the playoffs when scouting is at its highest and the game slows down were a different story.
With Rudy on the court wolves were in the 85th percentile offense in the playoffs. When Rudy sat they were a 20th percentile offense and the wolves got killed in those minutes.
But hey the eye test says Rudy affects Ants offense. Well the playoff numbers do not say that. Ant/Rudy lineups were in the 91st percentile offensively in the playoffs. When Ant was not with Rudy that dropped to 17th percentile offensively. Do you know Ant/Rudy lineups without slow mo was the best offensive lineups in the nba playoffs this year.


Rudy brings up so much hidden value on the offensive end. Draws a ton of fouls that leads to the wolves getting to bonus quicker and he is an elite screener. Rudy was 2nd in the playoffs in screen assists. Rudy screens in the playoffs lead to the ball handler scoring over 13 pts per game. Now let’s compare that to our other bigs screens. Kat screens lead to 1.9 pts per game in the playoffs and Naz screens lead to 0.3 pts per game in the playoffs. Our other bigs are trash and I mean trash screeners while Rudy is elite at it.

Now the eye test would say Rudy really hurts the offense however the numbers say the exact opposite. Now is that small sample size, I’m not sure. But why did the wolves offense in the playoffs fall off a cliff when Rudy sat? I have 2 theories, the defense was worse so they were playing against a set defense more often and Naz (and the bench) were trash outside of 1 game a series. I love Naz but I have serious doubts Naz can be a consistent contributor in the playoffs. He’s now played in 22 (88 quarters) playoff games and has had what 8ish good quarters and 4 came in G2 against the Mavs

[Q-is-here]

Good stuff Kek.

Here is what's maddening....The Wolves had the #8 offense just a few seasons ago with 3/5ths of their existing starting lineup in place: KAT, Ant, and Jaden. The other two starters? DLO and Vando (and sometimes PBev would start instead of Jaden).

Could DLO be the missing piece!? LOL...But seriously, it's pretty discouraging that Finch, his staff, and the vets on our team can't figure out a way to get more out of an offense with one of the best shooting bigs in history and a young player on the cusp of superstardom.

I agree with Ken’s analysis about what happened in the Wolves-Dallas series and what we need to do if we bring the team back next season. As to your question about the Wolves offensive decline from our 46-win season I’ll just say what should be obvious - the answer is the addition of Rudy. His presence dramatically changes the offense in a way that undermines the strengths of Ant and KAT, both individually and collectively. If we bring Rudy back, which is highly likely, I think Kek has the right answer - far more three attempts from KAT. But if we want to get back to a top 8 offense, we’d need to move Rudy and have an offense that’s faster with better spacing and more ball movement. I’ll note that we were the 8th best offense when Ant, Jaden and Naz weren’t nearly as good offensively as they are now. In fact, Naz was a non-factor that season. So this could be a high-powered offense. I’ve always thought the right move two years ago was to upgrade the PF position to a bigger and better version of Vando - someone in the mold of Aaron Gordon - improving our defense without undermining our offense and likely improving our offense. Alas, TC chose the Rudy path. There are always tradeoffs. Rudy brings a lot of good, but it’s not all good. The extra problem is that getting Rudy, with his considerable pluses but also minuses, cost us the transactional leeway to maneuver and improve the team.

Couple things when it comes to just offense rating I think the loss of Dlo does matter a little bit, he was a good passer to players not named Rudy and he could create his own shot, something a lot of the wolves struggle with. Now the trade off with Conley outweighs what Dlo brings but I do think not having another offensive scorer does hurt the team.

The Jazz had the #1 offense in the NBA with Rudy. Yes Rudy faults are glaring but it’s possible to have an elite offense around Rudy.

I know you brought up the offense with and without Rudy this year. And you are right that the wolves were better offensively in the regular season offensively when Rudy sat. Now the difference is not much and the Wolves were an above average offense without Rudy and just a slightly above average offense with Rudy in the regular season.

However the playoffs when scouting is at its highest and the game slows down were a different story.
With Rudy on the court wolves were in the 85th percentile offense in the playoffs. When Rudy sat they were a 20th percentile offense and the wolves got killed in those minutes.
But hey the eye test says Rudy affects Ants offense. Well the playoff numbers do not say that. Ant/Rudy lineups were in the 91st percentile offensively in the playoffs. When Ant was not with Rudy that dropped to 17th percentile offensively. Do you know Ant/Rudy lineups without slow mo was the best offensive lineups in the nba playoffs this year.


Rudy brings up so much hidden value on the offensive end. Draws a ton of fouls that leads to the wolves getting to bonus quicker and he is an elite screener. Rudy was 2nd in the playoffs in screen assists. Rudy screens in the playoffs lead to the ball handler scoring over 13 pts per game. Now let’s compare that to our other bigs screens. Kat screens lead to 1.9 pts per game in the playoffs and Naz screens lead to 0.3 pts per game in the playoffs. Our other bigs are trash and I mean trash screeners while Rudy is elite at it.

Now the eye test would say Rudy really hurts the offense however the numbers say the exact opposite. Now is that small sample size, I’m not sure. But why did the wolves offense in the playoffs fall off a cliff when Rudy sat? I have 2 theories, the defense was worse so they were playing against a set defense more often and Naz (and the bench) were trash outside of 1 game a series. I love Naz but I have serious doubts Naz can be a consistent contributor in the playoffs. He’s now played in 22 (88 quarters) playoff games and has had what 8ish good quarters and 4 came in G2 against the Mavs

Kek, the stuff you mention on Naz is why I wouldn't be opposed to trading him, assuming we got good value in return. I by no means see it as an addition-by-subtraction move, so it would have to be a true win/win type of deal. Otherwise, I'm fine being patient with him, as he does seem like a guy that could keep getting better.

As for the fans rebelling against trading one of their favorites, we need to remember that Marcus Smart was a beloved player in Boston - probably the heart and soul of a great Boston team for years - yet he was traded away because their front office thought the return they got would make them a better team. I don't think Boston fans are missing Smart all that much today!

But yeah, all the advanced stats point to Rudy being absolutely key to this team. We need to do everything possible to ensure the rest of the rotation can hit the open 3. Literally no one should play other than Rudy if he can't make a 3. SloMo was nice to have as we tried to go from a mediocre team to good. He's not a guy you can play once your goal is to win the Conference Finals and compete for a ring.

One other thing....Just like a Kyle Anderson can play an important role in helping a team go from bad to good, I thought DLO helped in a similar way. He gave us competent playmaking and shotmaking and then brought back Conley + NAW via trade. He was an important stepping stone in the process of going from bad to great as a franchise.

[Wolvesfan21]

Couple thoughts.

They were able to hide Luka on Rudy. Now when Rudy sat against the Mavs the defense was not good so I’m not sure what the correct trade off is.

Lip is right that Kat is a better 3 pt shooter than horford, however horford shoots more 3s than Kat does per game during the playoffs. Kat is shooting 2.5 less 3s per game than he was the year before Ant got here. For whatever reason Kat volume has went down while the NBA volume has went up for 3 pointers.

Ant and Kat are really special players but they don’t play off each other well. Do you know Rudy Gobert had 1 less assist this season to Mike Conley than Kat had to Ant this year. For whatever reason those 2 don’t have great on court chemistry. There is no reason they can’t destroy teams in PnR and PnP game sort of like how Lavine and Gorgui had great chemistry back when we were bad.

Another thing is Kat had a career low in roll frequency this year in the PnR. A not so fun fact that zero possession this playoffs ended with a Kat PnR shot attempt or foul. Kind of crazy.

Wolves don’t have the iso creators that the Celtics do. Celtics had 4.5 good iso scorers. Wolves have 1.5. Allows teams to load up more.

Ant can’t throw a lob, if he could to Rudy a lot of issues would be solved.

The bench fell off. Naw shot 3 of 21 his last 6 games from 3. Outside of 1 game a series from Naz, Naz was bad this postseason, slow mo spacing issues and got nothing from the backup PGs

I am in team run it back but they need to figure out how to create Kat and Ant on court chemistry. Them at the moment score in spurts because of their individual talents not because they make each other better. Also go back to what made you great Kat and let it fly from 3. No reason not to have 10 3PA a game. You are the best big to ever shoot a basketball, play to your strengths and let it fly like he for the DR this summer

Good stuff Kek.

Here is what's maddening....The Wolves had the #8 offense just a few seasons ago with 3/5ths of their existing starting lineup in place: KAT, Ant, and Jaden. The other two starters? DLO and Vando (and sometimes PBev would start instead of Jaden).

Could DLO be the missing piece!? LOL...But seriously, it's pretty discouraging that Finch, his staff, and the vets on our team can't figure out a way to get more out of an offense with one of the best shooting bigs in history and a young player on the cusp of superstardom.

I agree with Ken’s analysis about what happened in the Wolves-Dallas series and what we need to do if we bring the team back next season. As to your question about the Wolves offensive decline from our 46-win season I’ll just say what should be obvious - the answer is the addition of Rudy. His presence dramatically changes the offense in a way that undermines the strengths of Ant and KAT, both individually and collectively. If we bring Rudy back, which is highly likely, I think Kek has the right answer - far more three attempts from KAT. But if we want to get back to a top 8 offense, we’d need to move Rudy and have an offense that’s faster with better spacing and more ball movement. I’ll note that we were the 8th best offense when Ant, Jaden and Naz weren’t nearly as good offensively as they are now. In fact, Naz was a non-factor that season. So this could be a high-powered offense. I’ve always thought the right move two years ago was to upgrade the PF position to a bigger and better version of Vando - someone in the mold of Aaron Gordon - improving our defense without undermining our offense and likely improving our offense. Alas, TC chose the Rudy path. There are always tradeoffs. Rudy brings a lot of good, but it’s not all good. The extra problem is that getting Rudy, with his considerable pluses but also minuses, cost us the transactional leeway to maneuver and improve the team.

Who is better on offense? Rudy or Vando? I'd say Rudy. Neither shoot or should shoot outside of 5 feet. But Rudy is a much better screener (maybe best in the NBA). Better offensive rebounder (top 5 in NBA). Vando may have better hands slightly.

Not only that the Jazz were 3rd in offensive rating in 20-21, 1st in 21-22. Rudy was on those teams.

There is no excuse for this offense to not be top 10 even top 5 next year with Rudy. Teams like the Jazz have proven to have the best offense in the NBA with him just a few years ago. I put some blame on Finch, some blame on the players for not developing a lob dunk game with Rudy among other things like Ant and KAT not developing a better two man game. Ant is still young and I'd say simply his game hasn't been good enough. DLO as much as we ripped him was/is a pretty good distributor and overall pretty good on offense (still trash on defense).

Hey I love the defense we had last season, so credit due there. But to say Rudy is the problem is to me ridiculous. The Jazz did. We can too.

Another possibility is the Wolves focused a bit too much on defense. For instance you can offensive rebound heavily which will help the offensive stats, but then take away from defense. So I don't think it's that easy to say that our offense struggled. We could have been simply making sure we get back and don't give up easy points. The question is analytically. How much should you offensive rebound and with what players? Is it better or worse to push the offensive boards or get back? Depends on the team probably as well for sure.

[Q-is-here]

Good stuff Kek.

Here is what's maddening....The Wolves had the #8 offense just a few seasons ago with 3/5ths of their existing starting lineup in place: KAT, Ant, and Jaden. The other two starters? DLO and Vando (and sometimes PBev would start instead of Jaden).

Could DLO be the missing piece!? LOL...But seriously, it's pretty discouraging that Finch, his staff, and the vets on our team can't figure out a way to get more out of an offense with one of the best shooting bigs in history and a young player on the cusp of superstardom.

I agree with Ken’s analysis about what happened in the Wolves-Dallas series and what we need to do if we bring the team back next season. As to your question about the Wolves offensive decline from our 46-win season I’ll just say what should be obvious - the answer is the addition of Rudy. His presence dramatically changes the offense in a way that undermines the strengths of Ant and KAT, both individually and collectively. If we bring Rudy back, which is highly likely, I think Kek has the right answer - far more three attempts from KAT. But if we want to get back to a top 8 offense, we’d need to move Rudy and have an offense that’s faster with better spacing and more ball movement. I’ll note that we were the 8th best offense when Ant, Jaden and Naz weren’t nearly as good offensively as they are now. In fact, Naz was a non-factor that season. So this could be a high-powered offense. I’ve always thought the right move two years ago was to upgrade the PF position to a bigger and better version of Vando - someone in the mold of Aaron Gordon - improving our defense without undermining our offense and likely improving our offense. Alas, TC chose the Rudy path. There are always tradeoffs. Rudy brings a lot of good, but it’s not all good. The extra problem is that getting Rudy, with his considerable pluses but also minuses, cost us the transactional leeway to maneuver and improve the team.

Who is better on offense? Rudy or Vando? I'd say Rudy. Neither shoot or should shoot outside of 5 feet. But Rudy is a much better screener (maybe best in the NBA). Better offensive rebounder (top 5 in NBA). Vando may have better hands slightly.

Not only that the Jazz were 3rd in offensive rating in 20-21, 1st in 21-22. Rudy was on those teams.

There is no excuse for this offense to not be top 10 even top 5 next year with Rudy. Teams like the Jazz have proven to have the best offense in the NBA with him just a few years ago. I put some blame on Finch, some blame on the players for not developing a lob dunk game with Rudy among other things like Ant and KAT not developing a better two man game. Ant is still young and I'd say simply his game hasn't been good enough. DLO as much as we ripped him was/is a pretty good distributor and overall pretty good on offense (still trash on defense).

Hey I love the defense we had last season, so credit due there. But to say Rudy is the problem is to me ridiculous. The Jazz did. We can too.

Another possibility is the Wolves focused a bit too much on defense. For instance you can offensive rebound heavily which will help the offensive stats, but then take away from defense. So I don't think it's that easy to say that our offense struggled. We could have been simply making sure we get back and don't give up easy points. The question is analytically. How much should you offensive rebound and with what players? Is it better or worse to push the offensive boards or get back? Depends on the team probably as well for sure.

I think the analytics on offensive rebounding encourages "corner crashing", which is where the guy planted in the weakside corner, regardless of his position or size, crashes the O-glass. Everyone else should be getting back on defense.

Unfortunately, the 3-point shot is such an advantage these days that it usually overwhelms the advantage one might get from having more size and getting more rebounds. It's best to get the hell back, match up, and prevent those open transition 3s.