Julius Randle

[rapsuperstar31]

While this analysis makes sense on its face, I don't believe Jaden's drop off is due to Randle or any of the other players around him...it's solely because of his failure to make his corner threes. He's only making 29% of them this season. His worst corner percentage prior to this season was 36% in 2021-2! I don't have stats on this, but it seems to me that a lot of his wide open corner looks (and misses) are created by Ju's drive and kicks...imagine how productive Jaden would be if he was just having an average season on those corner three's Ju is creating. Further evidence of my assertion that Ju helps Jaden rather than hurts him is this: only NAW has a better 2-man lineup net rating with Jaden than Ju!

There's also a narrative here that Ju is hurting Ant's production, but again, the numbers don't support that assertion. Similar to the Jaden data, Ant's 2-man net rating with Ju is only exceeded by Ant/NAW. Ant is more successful with Ju on the court than anyone other than NAW! I guess based on all this information, it's not surprising that far and away our best 3-man lineup at 13.8 is Ju/Ant/NAW...no other lineup with more than 300 minutes is even close!

I admit the eye test has never been kind to Ju. His body language is not positive, and his propensity to back into the lane to draw two players and then kick to the open man is not aesthetically pleasing basketball for those of us who prefer motion and ball movement. And his handle is often way too loose for my taste...his turnovers are too high, and his "near turnovers" annoy me. But the numbers after 44 games are pretty difficult to dispute if you believe net ratings have any validity...Ju works better with our young starters (Jaden and Ant) than anyone other than NAW. My stance remains the same: I'm not ready to write this season off. TC should trade Ju if he can find a deal that improves our chances of winning this season, but I'm pessimistic about such a deal being out there. Ju's drive and kick game along with his ability to get a bucket when he sees the right matchup is invaluable...his comfort in fitting into this offense is the main reason for our recent offensive resurgence. Imaging how potent this offense could be with a return of Donte and Jaden progressing back to his 3-point mean...this is a 120 PPG offense on the horizon. Obviously, I hope we don't see a Ju deal before the deadline.

Perhaps the reason why Ant and Ju have one of the better offensive ratings together is because they both happen to be above average offensive players versus any sort of great synergy between the two of them.

Did you know that in 2021-22 that Ant's best pairing in terms of starters was DLO? They had a net rating of +7.1 when they played together. He and Randle are a +3 as a player pair with 1,234 minutes played together. Did you want DLO back on the team?

I think the issue with our offense is an accumulation of sub-optimal fits. Any one of the sub-optimal fits in isolation isn't a big deal since every one of our rotation players are good basketball players that have some sublime strengths.

But the sheer number of fit issues take their toll on the offense:

- Jaden can't hit corner 3's and punish defenses for collapsing in the lane.
- Randle can sometimes make 3's but defenses really don't respect it and won't guard him out there.
- Rudy can't catch anything but the perfect pass and has absolutely zero offensive go-to moves other than open dunks.
- Conley can't break down a defense anymore.
- Ant is late in recognizing open team mates and plays too much hero ball late in games.
- NAW and DDV are solid secondary ball handlers, but unreliable and turnover prone when asked to be primary PGs.

I could go on, but the point is that you probably can't eliminate 100% of the weaknesses and dis-synergies that come from a group of otherwise good players, but can we make progress in reducing them so there aren't so many!?

For example, Jaden's poor outside shooting wasn't as big of a deal when KAT played Center. Rudy's bad hands and lack of any post moves didn't prevent Utah from being the #1 offense with Bojan Bogdanovic starting at the 4 and 40% corner 3 shooters Joe Ingles and Royce O'Neale at the 3. Etc., etc.

I've been a big McDaniels fan from the beginning but let's be honest here at this point the guy on offense more of a fringe starter like NAW who is a better 3 point shooter and can handle the ball. I still think there is potential for him to develop his offense more but I don't see any significant signs of that happening and his 3point shooting is underwhelming. He is shooting an easily career worst 29% from the corners so there is hope this season he will improve but he needs to be more consistent in that area.

I'd be curious to know what Knicks players Randle held back from being good offensively.

I don't think the book is finished on Jaden's offensive game. NAW at 23 years old shot 31% from 3 and has made huge strides since. Jaden's future just might be at the power forward position if his recent rebounding rate is sustainable. Jaden's 3pt percentages have been bad ever since he punched that wall. Maybe it didn't heal correctly, who knows. But there is still plenty of time for Jaden to find his place in the offense.

[FNG]

While this analysis makes sense on its face, I don't believe Jaden's drop off is due to Randle or any of the other players around him...it's solely because of his failure to make his corner threes. He's only making 29% of them this season. His worst corner percentage prior to this season was 36% in 2021-2! I don't have stats on this, but it seems to me that a lot of his wide open corner looks (and misses) are created by Ju's drive and kicks...imagine how productive Jaden would be if he was just having an average season on those corner three's Ju is creating. Further evidence of my assertion that Ju helps Jaden rather than hurts him is this: only NAW has a better 2-man lineup net rating with Jaden than Ju!

There's also a narrative here that Ju is hurting Ant's production, but again, the numbers don't support that assertion. Similar to the Jaden data, Ant's 2-man net rating with Ju is only exceeded by Ant/NAW. Ant is more successful with Ju on the court than anyone other than NAW! I guess based on all this information, it's not surprising that far and away our best 3-man lineup at 13.8 is Ju/Ant/NAW...no other lineup with more than 300 minutes is even close!

I admit the eye test has never been kind to Ju. His body language is not positive, and his propensity to back into the lane to draw two players and then kick to the open man is not aesthetically pleasing basketball for those of us who prefer motion and ball movement. And his handle is often way too loose for my taste...his turnovers are too high, and his "near turnovers" annoy me. But the numbers after 44 games are pretty difficult to dispute if you believe net ratings have any validity...Ju works better with our young starters (Jaden and Ant) than anyone other than NAW. My stance remains the same: I'm not ready to write this season off. TC should trade Ju if he can find a deal that improves our chances of winning this season, but I'm pessimistic about such a deal being out there. Ju's drive and kick game along with his ability to get a bucket when he sees the right matchup is invaluable...his comfort in fitting into this offense is the main reason for our recent offensive resurgence. Imaging how potent this offense could be with a return of Donte and Jaden progressing back to his 3-point mean...this is a 120 PPG offense on the horizon. Obviously, I hope we don't see a Ju deal before the deadline.

Perhaps the reason why Ant and Ju have one of the better offensive ratings together is because they both happen to be above average offensive players versus any sort of great synergy between the two of them.

Did you know that in 2021-22 that Ant's best pairing in terms of starters was DLO? They had a net rating of +7.1 when they played together. He and Randle are a +3 as a player pair with 1,234 minutes played together. Did you want DLO back on the team?

I think the issue with our offense is an accumulation of sub-optimal fits. Any one of the sub-optimal fits in isolation isn't a big deal since every one of our rotation players are good basketball players that have some sublime strengths.

But the sheer number of fit issues take their toll on the offense:

- Jaden can't hit corner 3's and punish defenses for collapsing in the lane.
- Randle can sometimes make 3's but defenses really don't respect it and won't guard him out there.
- Rudy can't catch anything but the perfect pass and has absolutely zero offensive go-to moves other than open dunks.
- Conley can't break down a defense anymore.
- Ant is late in recognizing open team mates and plays too much hero ball late in games.
- NAW and DDV are solid secondary ball handlers, but unreliable and turnover prone when asked to be primary PGs.

I could go on, but the point is that you probably can't eliminate 100% of the weaknesses and dis-synergies that come from a group of otherwise good players, but can we make progress in reducing them so there aren't so many!?

For example, Jaden's poor outside shooting wasn't as big of a deal when KAT played Center. Rudy's bad hands and lack of any post moves didn't prevent Utah from being the #1 offense with Bojan Bogdanovic starting at the 4 and 40% corner 3 shooters Joe Ingles and Royce O'Neale at the 3. Etc., etc.

I've been a big McDaniels fan from the beginning but let's be honest here at this point the guy on offense more of a fringe starter like NAW who is a better 3 point shooter and can handle the ball. I still think there is potential for him to develop his offense more but I don't see any significant signs of that happening and his 3point shooting is underwhelming. He is shooting an easily career worst 29% from the corners so there is hope this season he will improve but he needs to be more consistent in that area.

I'd be curious to know what Knicks players Randle held back from being good offensively.

Not sure, Monster. But I do know Donte has credited Randle for rejuvenating his offensive game.

I'm also a big Jaden fan, and I agree that his offensive inconsistency makes him look more like a fringe starter. But it's his defense that keeps him a starter. Not many guys with his length are called upon to guard PGs, but he does it well...and his reduced fouling has made his defense even more elite this season. The 3-point shooting has ben frustrating, but I also have hope he will improve...it's unusual for a player to have results so much worse than his mean, so progression is likely. I also think he will get even more 3-point looks if he starts making his shots...often I see Ant, Ju or Conley not pass to him even though he is open. Start making those shots, and his teammates will become more willing passers. Meanwhile it seems like his ability to get to the basket or into the lane and score has greatly improved in the past couple weeks, as well as his willingness to push the ball up the court after a defensive rebound. Add in some more normal 3-point shooting and I think we have the makings of an above average offensive player. He's not there yet, but he's only 24...I don't think he is close to reaching his ceiling yet.

[Lipoli390]

We talk a lot about Randle (combined with Rudy) as a poor fit with Ant. But we shouldn’t overlook Randle’s poor fit with Jaden McDaniels. Here’s a telling excerpt from a recent Canishoopus article:

The “Barometer for Ball Movement”
It’s been one of the infamous phrases that Chris Finch has previously used to describe McDaniels’ role in the offense dating back to last season.

Its meaning is simple: when the ball is zipping around, it’s likely McDaniels’ production will follow suit. If the Wolves fall into their dreaded ways of iso ball and your turn - my turn offense, it’s likely to end with a disappointing night in tow. He’s not someone who gets plays called for him and often has to act as a counterbalance and supplementary piece to what the higher-usage players are trying to do.

We’ve all been frustrated by Jaden’s lack of consistent offensive production and overall offensive development. But part of the problem, I believe, is that the roster and resulting playing style is just as sub-optimal for Jaden as it is for Ant. We’d all like Jaden to be a 3-&-D guy and when his three is falling he’s a very good one. Perhaps it’s time to accept that Jaden might not fit the mold want him to fit. He’s really quick to the rim, both with and without the ball (two long strides) and a great finisher when there with his length and body control. A space-and-pace offense would likely bring out the best offensively in both Ant and Jaden. Just one more reason to move Randle and why moving him would be addition by subtraction.

While this analysis makes sense on its face, I don't believe Jaden's drop off is due to Randle or any of the other players around him...it's solely because of his failure to make his corner threes. He's only making 29% of them this season. His worst corner percentage prior to this season was 36% in 2021-2! I don't have stats on this, but it seems to me that a lot of his wide open corner looks (and misses) are created by Ju's drive and kicks...imagine how productive Jaden would be if he was just having an average season on those corner three's Ju is creating. Further evidence of my assertion that Ju helps Jaden rather than hurts him is this: only NAW has a better 2-man lineup net rating with Jaden than Ju!

There's also a narrative here that Ju is hurting Ant's production, but again, the numbers don't support that assertion. Similar to the Jaden data, Ant's 2-man net rating with Ju is only exceeded by Ant/NAW. Ant is more successful with Ju on the court than anyone other than NAW! I guess based on all this information, it's not surprising that far and away our best 3-man lineup at 13.8 is Ju/Ant/NAW...no other lineup with more than 300 minutes is even close!

I admit the eye test has never been kind to Ju. His body language is not positive, and his propensity to back into the lane to draw two players and then kick to the open man is not aesthetically pleasing basketball for those of us who prefer motion and ball movement. And his handle is often way too loose for my taste...his turnovers are too high, and his "near turnovers" annoy me. But the numbers after 44 games are pretty difficult to dispute if you believe net ratings have any validity...Ju works better with our young starters (Jaden and Ant) than anyone other than NAW. My stance remains the same: I'm not ready to write this season off. TC should trade Ju if he can find a deal that improves our chances of winning this season, but I'm pessimistic about such a deal being out there. Ju's drive and kick game along with his ability to get a bucket when he sees the right matchup is invaluable...his comfort in fitting into this offense is the main reason for our recent offensive resurgence. Imaging how potent this offense could be with a return of Donte and Jaden progressing back to his 3-point mean...this is a 120 PPG offense on the horizon. Obviously, I hope we don't see a Ju deal before the deadline.

I think Jaden’s offensive drop off is largely attributable to his reduced three-point efficiency. My point is that there’s another aspect of Jaden’s offensive potential that has yet to be developed - namely his inside scoring on cuts without the ball and dribble drives. But that part of his game has a hard enough time developing with a guy like Rudy on the floor. It’s far more difficult with Rudy AND Randle clogging the middle and with Randle and Ant holding the ball. I believe that unlocking Jaden’s full offensive potential requires a space and pace style that we can’t even come close to with Rudy and Randle on the floor together with Jaden and Ant. We all want Jaden to be a 3-and-D guy but maybe that’s not really his optimal offensive profile. He is so long and has tremendous body control at the rim. He’s actually a terrific finisher. His handle is a bit high and still needs work but he’s a great cutter without the ball and his dribble drive game isn’t bad.

[Monster]

We talk a lot about Randle (combined with Rudy) as a poor fit with Ant. But we shouldn’t overlook Randle’s poor fit with Jaden McDaniels. Here’s a telling excerpt from a recent Canishoopus article:

The “Barometer for Ball Movement”
It’s been one of the infamous phrases that Chris Finch has previously used to describe McDaniels’ role in the offense dating back to last season.

Its meaning is simple: when the ball is zipping around, it’s likely McDaniels’ production will follow suit. If the Wolves fall into their dreaded ways of iso ball and your turn - my turn offense, it’s likely to end with a disappointing night in tow. He’s not someone who gets plays called for him and often has to act as a counterbalance and supplementary piece to what the higher-usage players are trying to do.

We’ve all been frustrated by Jaden’s lack of consistent offensive production and overall offensive development. But part of the problem, I believe, is that the roster and resulting playing style is just as sub-optimal for Jaden as it is for Ant. We’d all like Jaden to be a 3-&-D guy and when his three is falling he’s a very good one. Perhaps it’s time to accept that Jaden might not fit the mold want him to fit. He’s really quick to the rim, both with and without the ball (two long strides) and a great finisher when there with his length and body control. A space-and-pace offense would likely bring out the best offensively in both Ant and Jaden. Just one more reason to move Randle and why moving him would be addition by subtraction.

While this analysis makes sense on its face, I don't believe Jaden's drop off is due to Randle or any of the other players around him...it's solely because of his failure to make his corner threes. He's only making 29% of them this season. His worst corner percentage prior to this season was 36% in 2021-2! I don't have stats on this, but it seems to me that a lot of his wide open corner looks (and misses) are created by Ju's drive and kicks...imagine how productive Jaden would be if he was just having an average season on those corner three's Ju is creating. Further evidence of my assertion that Ju helps Jaden rather than hurts him is this: only NAW has a better 2-man lineup net rating with Jaden than Ju!

There's also a narrative here that Ju is hurting Ant's production, but again, the numbers don't support that assertion. Similar to the Jaden data, Ant's 2-man net rating with Ju is only exceeded by Ant/NAW. Ant is more successful with Ju on the court than anyone other than NAW! I guess based on all this information, it's not surprising that far and away our best 3-man lineup at 13.8 is Ju/Ant/NAW...no other lineup with more than 300 minutes is even close!

I admit the eye test has never been kind to Ju. His body language is not positive, and his propensity to back into the lane to draw two players and then kick to the open man is not aesthetically pleasing basketball for those of us who prefer motion and ball movement. And his handle is often way too loose for my taste...his turnovers are too high, and his "near turnovers" annoy me. But the numbers after 44 games are pretty difficult to dispute if you believe net ratings have any validity...Ju works better with our young starters (Jaden and Ant) than anyone other than NAW. My stance remains the same: I'm not ready to write this season off. TC should trade Ju if he can find a deal that improves our chances of winning this season, but I'm pessimistic about such a deal being out there. Ju's drive and kick game along with his ability to get a bucket when he sees the right matchup is invaluable...his comfort in fitting into this offense is the main reason for our recent offensive resurgence. Imaging how potent this offense could be with a return of Donte and Jaden progressing back to his 3-point mean...this is a 120 PPG offense on the horizon. Obviously, I hope we don't see a Ju deal before the deadline.

I think Jaden’s offensive drop off is largely attributable to his reduced three-point efficiency. My point is that there’s another aspect of Jaden’s offensive potential that has yet to be developed - namely his inside scoring on cuts without the ball and dribble drives. But that part of his game has a hard enough time developing with a guy like Rudy on the floor. It’s far more difficult with Rudy AND Randle clogging the middle and with Randle and Ant holding the ball. I believe that unlocking Jaden’s full offensive potential requires a space and pace style that we can’t even come close to with Rudy and Randle on the floor together with Jaden and Ant. We all want Jaden to be a 3-and-D guy but maybe that’s not really his optimal offensive profile. He is so long and has tremendous body control at the rim. He’s actually a terrific finisher. His handle is a bit high and still needs work but he’s a great cutter without the ball and his dribble drive game isn’t bad.

How much does the supposed clog lane matter Jaden's man doesn't really have to guard him at the 3 point line? That's always a big deal for guys offensivly who maybe have some sort of deficiency to begin with. McDaniels hasn't really shown much consistent game off the dribble and having to drive into a guy playing to make you shoot isn't gonna help. His offense at this point resembles more of an active big that can take a 3 sometimes than a perimeter player. That can be fine but it's also dissapointing because I personally thought he would have developed more to this point. Honestly I don't think his game was any different playing with Towns who was on the perimeter a lot. To me it's more mental than anything. I think his dribble game probbaly isn't up to part but I also think he just doesn't really go for it either. Idk if that's a lack of confidence or what he has been told by the coaching staff or some of both.

Obviously a quicker pace moving the ball would help him but you could say that for a bunch of players. Right now he is a guy teams don't really have to worry about scoring. It sounds like they may have to start worry about him beating them on the glass and if that's the case then teams are gonna have to worry about him more and that will help the offense. I don't want to make it sound like I think McDaniels sucks or anything he does some things that don't show up on the box score but his lack of offense is an issue especially for a team that has had problems scoring and that's not just this year it goes back multiple years. That's partly why they drafted Dillingham and we're willing to make the Towns trade because it included DVV.

[Q-is-here]

One of the things Jaden is doing is rather than just take the open corner 3, he's using all that space defenses give him to just take a couple of dribbles and pull up or get all the way to the bucket for a high percentage 2 or ally oop. It's kind of what players used to do before analytics told everyone they should always take the open 3. If a defender gives you 10 feet, then take up that space and take a much shorter shot!

Jaden might be evolving his game to be an Aaron Gordon or later career Shawn Marion type of combo forward that contributes to winning in multiple ways. I wouldn't have thought that was possible a year ago, but with him rebounding the ball better and providing some more off-ball defense at the 4 for stints, he seems to be evolving into more of a swiss army knife than a pure 3 & D wing.

[Lipoli390]

While this analysis makes sense on its face, I don't believe Jaden's drop off is due to Randle or any of the other players around him...it's solely because of his failure to make his corner threes. He's only making 29% of them this season. His worst corner percentage prior to this season was 36% in 2021-2! I don't have stats on this, but it seems to me that a lot of his wide open corner looks (and misses) are created by Ju's drive and kicks...imagine how productive Jaden would be if he was just having an average season on those corner three's Ju is creating. Further evidence of my assertion that Ju helps Jaden rather than hurts him is this: only NAW has a better 2-man lineup net rating with Jaden than Ju!

There's also a narrative here that Ju is hurting Ant's production, but again, the numbers don't support that assertion. Similar to the Jaden data, Ant's 2-man net rating with Ju is only exceeded by Ant/NAW. Ant is more successful with Ju on the court than anyone other than NAW! I guess based on all this information, it's not surprising that far and away our best 3-man lineup at 13.8 is Ju/Ant/NAW...no other lineup with more than 300 minutes is even close!

I admit the eye test has never been kind to Ju. His body language is not positive, and his propensity to back into the lane to draw two players and then kick to the open man is not aesthetically pleasing basketball for those of us who prefer motion and ball movement. And his handle is often way too loose for my taste...his turnovers are too high, and his "near turnovers" annoy me. But the numbers after 44 games are pretty difficult to dispute if you believe net ratings have any validity...Ju works better with our young starters (Jaden and Ant) than anyone other than NAW. My stance remains the same: I'm not ready to write this season off. TC should trade Ju if he can find a deal that improves our chances of winning this season, but I'm pessimistic about such a deal being out there. Ju's drive and kick game along with his ability to get a bucket when he sees the right matchup is invaluable...his comfort in fitting into this offense is the main reason for our recent offensive resurgence. Imaging how potent this offense could be with a return of Donte and Jaden progressing back to his 3-point mean...this is a 120 PPG offense on the horizon. Obviously, I hope we don't see a Ju deal before the deadline.

I think Jaden’s offensive drop off is largely attributable to his reduced three-point efficiency. My point is that there’s another aspect of Jaden’s offensive potential that has yet to be developed - namely his inside scoring on cuts without the ball and dribble drives. But that part of his game has a hard enough time developing with a guy like Rudy on the floor. It’s far more difficult with Rudy AND Randle clogging the middle and with Randle and Ant holding the ball. I believe that unlocking Jaden’s full offensive potential requires a space and pace style that we can’t even come close to with Rudy and Randle on the floor together with Jaden and Ant. We all want Jaden to be a 3-and-D guy but maybe that’s not really his optimal offensive profile. He is so long and has tremendous body control at the rim. He’s actually a terrific finisher. His handle is a bit high and still needs work but he’s a great cutter without the ball and his dribble drive game isn’t bad.

How much does the supposed clog lane matter Jaden's man doesn't really have to guard him at the 3 point line? That's always a big deal for guys offensivly who maybe have some sort of deficiency to begin with. McDaniels hasn't really shown much consistent game off the dribble and having to drive into a guy playing to make you shoot isn't gonna help. His offense at this point resembles more of an active big that can take a 3 sometimes than a perimeter player. That can be fine but it's also dissapointing because I personally thought he would have developed more to this point. Honestly I don't think his game was any different playing with Towns who was on the perimeter a lot. To me it's more mental than anything. I think his dribble game probbaly isn't up to part but I also think he just doesn't really go for it either. Idk if that's a lack of confidence or what he has been told by the coaching staff or some of both.

Obviously a quicker pace moving the ball would help him but you could say that for a bunch of players. Right now he is a guy teams don't really have to worry about scoring. It sounds like they may have to start worry about him beating them on the glass and if that's the case then teams are gonna have to worry about him more and that will help the offense. I don't want to make it sound like I think McDaniels sucks or anything he does some things that don't show up on the box score but his lack of offense is an issue especially for a team that has had problems scoring and that's not just this year it goes back multiple years. That's partly why they drafted Dillingham and we're willing to make the Towns trade because it included DVV.

The packed lane and lack of ball movement and pace reduces Jaden’s cutting and driving opportunities. So he’s left with 3-point chances that he hasn’t been able to exploit because of his inconsistent three-point shot. But you make a great point that his offensive game didn’t differ much when KAT was here, although even when KAT was here, we had Rudy in the middle and KAT was often inside as well. The ball moved better than this season, but still not the way it should on a team with Ant and Jaden in my view. As you noted, much of Jaden’s failure thus far to develop other aspects of his offensive game suggests it’s a mental or confidence thing for him.

[FNG]

I thought I would post a list of PFs averaging more than 19/7/4.5:

Giannis
Sabonis (if you think he is a PF)
Randle

That’s it. I’m guessing TCs mindset is that $31 million is a bargain, and he may even be talking with Ju about an extension…maybe 3/75. 25 a year might not seem acceptable to a PF with his production. But he loves Finchie and seems to love Minnesota, so he might bite.

Edit: Just to put Ju's salary in perspective, Giannis and Sabonis make closer to $45 million per season.

Second edit: If you expand the sample size to include centers, you only add Jokic and Sengun

[shrink]

I thought I would post a list of PFs averaging more than 19/7/4.5:

Giannis
Sabonis (if you think he is a PF)
Randle

That’s it. I’m guessing TCs mindset is that $31 million is a bargain, and he may even be talking with Ju about an extension…maybe 3/75. 25 a year might not seem acceptable to a PF with his production. But he loves Finchie and seems to love Minnesota, so he might bite.

Edit: Just to put Ju's salary in perspective, Giannis and Sabonis make closer to $45 million per season.

Second edit: If you expand the sample size to include centers, you only add Jokic and Sengun

With two All NBA awards under his belt, that level of production you demonstrated, and the rising cap because of the TV deal, I doubt even Tim Connelly can get Randle to accept $25 mil a year. I even think it’s unlikely he exercises his player’s option for $31 next year. He’s 30 now, so his next contract is likely his last chance for a big number deal. But then again, you never know what’s most important to a vet until he negotiates a free agent deal.

If I was forced to put money down on all his options, I think he gets traded in the off-season to a destination he likes, and MIN gets back a decent 4th-5th starter on a cheaper contract, salary relief, and maybe a pick.

[Lipoli390]

I thought I would post a list of PFs averaging more than 19/7/4.5:

Giannis
Sabonis (if you think he is a PF)
Randle

That’s it. I’m guessing TCs mindset is that $31 million is a bargain, and he may even be talking with Ju about an extension…maybe 3/75. 25 a year might not seem acceptable to a PF with his production. But he loves Finchie and seems to love Minnesota, so he might bite.

Edit: Just to put Ju's salary in perspective, Giannis and Sabonis make closer to $45 million per season.

Second edit: If you expand the sample size to include centers, you only add Jokic and Sengun

With two All NBA awards under his belt, that level of production you demonstrated, and the rising cap because of the TV deal, I doubt even Tim Connelly can get Randle to accept $25 mil a year. I even think it’s unlikely he exercises his player’s option for $31 next year. He’s 30 now, so his next contract is likely his last chance for a big number deal. But then again, you never know what’s most important to a vet until he negotiates a free agent deal.

If I was forced to put money down on all his options, I think he gets traded in the off-season to a destination he likes, and MIN gets back a decent 4th-5th starter on a cheaper contract, salary relief, and maybe a pick.

I wouldn’t want to keep Randle even if he agreed to $25 million per season. Again, it’s not that I don’t value Randle as a player; I just don’t like his fit here. In my view, he’s too ball dominant and paint-oriented to fit well with Ant, Naz, Jaden, DDV, TSJ and Dilly (key parts of Wolves 2.0). I think he’ll look around the League for something better than his $30 million one-year opt in. But I don’t think his value around the League matches his production so I question whether he’ll get the sort of multi-year he’ll be looking for.

I still believe the critical value from trading Randle is cap relief to get below the 2nd apron and possibly the 1st apron while still re-signing Naz and possibly keeping NAW. That means trading Randle for significantly less salary and picks. So I don’t see us getting an impact player in return for Randle. I think we get a limited role player or a young player with potential.

[kekgeek]

I thought I would post a list of PFs averaging more than 19/7/4.5:

Giannis
Sabonis (if you think he is a PF)
Randle

That’s it. I’m guessing TCs mindset is that $31 million is a bargain, and he may even be talking with Ju about an extension…maybe 3/75. 25 a year might not seem acceptable to a PF with his production. But he loves Finchie and seems to love Minnesota, so he might bite.

Edit: Just to put Ju's salary in perspective, Giannis and Sabonis make closer to $45 million per season.

Second edit: If you expand the sample size to include centers, you only add Jokic and Sengun

With two All NBA awards under his belt, that level of production you demonstrated, and the rising cap because of the TV deal, I doubt even Tim Connelly can get Randle to accept $25 mil a year. I even think it’s unlikely he exercises his player’s option for $31 next year. He’s 30 now, so his next contract is likely his last chance for a big number deal. But then again, you never know what’s most important to a vet until he negotiates a free agent deal.

If I was forced to put money down on all his options, I think he gets traded in the off-season to a destination he likes, and MIN gets back a decent 4th-5th starter on a cheaper contract, salary relief, and maybe a pick.

I wouldn’t want to keep Randle even if he agreed to $25 million per season. Again, it’s not that I don’t value Randle as a player; I just don’t like his fit here. In my view, he’s too ball dominant and paint-oriented to fit well with Ant, Naz, Jaden, DDV, TSJ and Dilly (key parts of Wolves 2.0). I think he’ll look around the League for something better than his $30 million one-year opt in. But I don’t think his value around the League matches his production so I question whether he’ll get the sort of multi-year he’ll be looking for.

I still believe the critical value from trading Randle is cap relief to get below the 2nd apron and possibly the 1st apron while still re-signing Naz and possibly keeping NAW. That means trading Randle for significantly less salary and picks. So I don’t see us getting an impact player in return for Randle. I think we get a limited role player or a young player with potential.

Randle getting hurt today could really effect what value/what they are going to do with him at the deadline