Grades Game 16- Suns

[AussieWolf3]

It's never been more evident we need a point guard. It has to happen.

Hard to argue Cool, but that said, Ant needs to figure it out too. I just rewatched the final sequence of events again and Ant just need to understand that he can't be this careless with the ball, the inbound to Dante was just reckless.
But the other horribly apparent reality is that Finch really really needed to call a timeout and calm these guys down. Not breaking news obviously, but the rewatch made it so obvious to me

[FNG]

It's never been more evident we need a point guard. It has to happen.

Hard to argue Cool, but that said, Ant needs to figure it out too. I just rewatched the final sequence of events again and Ant just need to understand that he can't be this careless with the ball, the inbound to Dante was just reckless.
But the other horribly apparent reality is that Finch really really needed to call a timeout and calm these guys down. Not breaking news obviously, but the rewatch made it so obvious to me

I hear where you guys are coming from, and I can't argue that an experienced PG wouldn't have been helpful in that last minute, but I'm still not on board with giving up assets (at least assets that a team would realistically want) to get one. I get that Mike is too old to be a 35 minute guy at PG, but I don't know that there are many (or any) "gettable" point guards that I would have trusted more than him handling the ball in that last minute. Why Finchy had him on the bench the entire time is baffling to me.

[Sundog]

Yeah, on the one hand, that was back-breaking. And on the other, the Wolves should have won, showing they should be able to hang with the +500 teams.

Connelly bet on continuity being an edge for the Wolves over other teams. But in hindsight, that was a mirage. I agree with Cool — I think it’s pretty clear they need a real point guard that can handle tough defensive pressure. Relying on the mix of players they have for that is unsustainable.

Is it time for a coaching change? Maybe Finch has taken this group of players as far as he can. Hard to move off a coach that’s taken the team to two consecutive conference finals though.

[Coolbreeze44]

Yeah, on the one hand, that was back-breaking. And on the other, the Wolves should have won, showing they should be able to hang with the +500 teams.

Connelly bet on continuity being an edge for the Wolves over other teams. But in hindsight, that was a mirage. I agree with Cool — I think it’s pretty clear they need a real point guard that can handle tough defensive pressure. Relying on the mix of players they have for that is unsustainable.

Is it time for a coaching change? Maybe Finch has taken this group of players as far as he can. Hard to move off a coach that’s taken the team to two consecutive conference finals though.

I'm afraid of how many turnovers OKC is going to force.

[AussieWolf3]

Yeah, on the one hand, that was back-breaking. And on the other, the Wolves should have won, showing they should be able to hang with the +500 teams.

Connelly bet on continuity being an edge for the Wolves over other teams. But in hindsight, that was a mirage. I agree with Cool — I think it’s pretty clear they need a real point guard that can handle tough defensive pressure. Relying on the mix of players they have for that is unsustainable.

Is it time for a coaching change? Maybe Finch has taken this group of players as far as he can. Hard to move off a coach that’s taken the team to two consecutive conference finals though.

As I said, this team is an enigma.

I prefer not to overreact to one game samples, but this was also a very loud sample. I also prefer not to get too caught up in every win or loss, it's not even Thanksgiving, and a few good wins in future will erase this bad taste - but this team is also running out of excuses/goodwill afforded to them when it comes to beating good teams.

Cause the question is: do the wolves have an existential problem?
Something I can't get out of my head is how weird it is that up and down the starting lineup players are having career years (Jaden and Julius) or settling well into their envisioned roles (Dante and to lesser extent Rudy). Ant has largely been either sensational, hurt or missing entirely - which sounds bad and inconsistent but I think it'll balance out over the season toward sensational.
So why does it feel so discomforting to watch this team. Julius having all-nba caliber start and Jaden taking THE leap are exactly the list items we would have put together a couple months ago as critical. The offense is by every measure elite and over the last few games, including last night, the defense has rounded into what looks like a top 10 unit. But then the last 58 second of last night happens and I just don't what the hell to think. They failed at every single hinge point in that time frame, and I'm entirely convinced it's because they believe they would just win regardless..... That's scary lol.

I'm not convinced they have to shake up the roster. In spite of everything, I think they've earned the chance to prove that this can all work, but I really hated how stubborned Julius was last night- driving into crowds and consistently losing to Brooks. He just doesn't handle teams that have multiple ball stoppers well. He perfectly plays into their hands and gets baited into risky drives and iso possessions. A terrifying proposition when you consider what the likes of the Thunder and the Rockets bring to bear.

On the other side, there's Ant. I'm so impressed with his offensive process for most of the season. It is just so rare to seem someone like him who just so routinely adds layers to his game. He is currently the most threatening 3 point shooter in the game and then decided he was also going to get better at playing in the middle of the defense, breaking them down and playing off two feet instead of over committing on his drives. It's so impressive. But God.... The lazy passes. Why was he even inbounding that pass that led to the 3.... Why? Tell Dante he can't handle pressure and tell him to inbound it. Understand the situation and the stakes and value every possession. It's really concerning that this still hasn't broken in through to him.

Oh well, enough word vomit, on to the next one

[FNG]

Yeah, on the one hand, that was back-breaking. And on the other, the Wolves should have won, showing they should be able to hang with the +500 teams.

Connelly bet on continuity being an edge for the Wolves over other teams. But in hindsight, that was a mirage. I agree with Cool — I think it’s pretty clear they need a real point guard that can handle tough defensive pressure. Relying on the mix of players they have for that is unsustainable.

Is it time for a coaching change? Maybe Finch has taken this group of players as far as he can. Hard to move off a coach that’s taken the team to two consecutive conference finals though.

I'm afraid of how many turnovers OKC is going to force.

I am too, Cool...the playoff series against them was tough to watch. But I think the problem is more system than personnel. Finchy seems wed to the idea that our offense works best when Ant (or sometimes Ju) originates the offense. I'm not convinced and would still prefer to see Mike running the offense for 30 MPG. We had a lot of turnovers against OkC in the playoffs, but Mike didn't. He had only 4 turnovers for the entire series. Some of that was he wasn't the primary ballhandler. But I think more of it was because he is far and away our smartest offensive player and most reliable ballhandler. It's not going to happen, but I'd love to see what would happen Wednesday if Finchy gave him the reins.

So many here think our biggest need is a PG. I'd be interested in hearing who we might think is available, and what it might take to get him. Remember that we don't have attractive draft capital, and nobody wants anyone outside of our rotation. I think it would be great to have a smart PG who doesn't turn the ball over, makes 45% of his treys and 92% of his free throws, and doesn't take shots away from our primary scorers, but the price tag for someone like that would probably start with Jaden or at least Naz. And you know what...we already have a guy that fits that profile exactly.

[Q-is-here]

Yeah, on the one hand, that was back-breaking. And on the other, the Wolves should have won, showing they should be able to hang with the +500 teams.

Connelly bet on continuity being an edge for the Wolves over other teams. But in hindsight, that was a mirage. I agree with Cool — I think it’s pretty clear they need a real point guard that can handle tough defensive pressure. Relying on the mix of players they have for that is unsustainable.

Is it time for a coaching change? Maybe Finch has taken this group of players as far as he can. Hard to move off a coach that’s taken the team to two consecutive conference finals though.

I'm afraid of how many turnovers OKC is going to force.

I am too, Cool...the playoff series against them was tough to watch. But I think the problem is more system than personnel. Finchy seems wed to the idea that our offense works best when Ant (or sometimes Ju) originates the offense. I'm not convinced and would still prefer to see Mike running the offense for 30 MPG. We had a lot of turnovers against OkC in the playoffs, but Mike didn't. He had only 4 turnovers for the entire series. Some of that was he wasn't the primary ballhandler. But I think more of it was because he is far and away our smartest offensive player and most reliable ballhandler. It's not going to happen, but I'd love to see what would happen Wednesday if Finchy gave him the reins.

So many here think our biggest need is a PG. I'd be interested in hearing who we might think is available, and what it might take to get him. Remember that we don't have attractive draft capital, and nobody wants anyone outside of our rotation. I think it would be great to have a smart PG who doesn't turn the ball over, makes 45% of his treys and 92% of his free throws, and doesn't take shots away from our primary scorers, but the price tag for someone like that would probably start with Jaden or at least Naz. And you know what...we already have a guy that fits that profile exactly.

I think the issue with Conley is whether he can really handle 30 MPG and stay healthy and effective. And the playoffs are a whole other ball of wax. He would be relentlessly targeted.

Finch's style is typically to be patient and allow these difficulties to work themselves out, with perhaps some minor adjustments and film room analysis to facilitate the process.

If one wants to be rash about it, the team I'd call is Indiana and inquire about TJ McConnell.

[AussieWolf3]

I'm afraid of how many turnovers OKC is going to force.

I am too, Cool...the playoff series against them was tough to watch. But I think the problem is more system than personnel. Finchy seems wed to the idea that our offense works best when Ant (or sometimes Ju) originates the offense. I'm not convinced and would still prefer to see Mike running the offense for 30 MPG. We had a lot of turnovers against OkC in the playoffs, but Mike didn't. He had only 4 turnovers for the entire series. Some of that was he wasn't the primary ballhandler. But I think more of it was because he is far and away our smartest offensive player and most reliable ballhandler. It's not going to happen, but I'd love to see what would happen Wednesday if Finchy gave him the reins.

So many here think our biggest need is a PG. I'd be interested in hearing who we might think is available, and what it might take to get him. Remember that we don't have attractive draft capital, and nobody wants anyone outside of our rotation. I think it would be great to have a smart PG who doesn't turn the ball over, makes 45% of his treys and 92% of his free throws, and doesn't take shots away from our primary scorers, but the price tag for someone like that would probably start with Jaden or at least Naz. And you know what...we already have a guy that fits that profile exactly.

I think the issue with Conley is whether he can really handle 30 MPG and stay healthy and effective. And the playoffs are a whole other ball of wax. He would be relentlessly targeted.

Finch's style is typically to be patient and allow these difficulties to work themselves out, with perhaps some minor adjustments and film room analysis to facilitate the process.

If one wants to be rash about it, the team I'd call is Indiana and inquire about TJ McConnell.

Finch knows and we all know that Conley can't be the answer to this problem, it won't work.

So the gamble/hope is that they can all figure it out. We'll see what happens

[FNG]

I'm afraid of how many turnovers OKC is going to force.

I am too, Cool...the playoff series against them was tough to watch. But I think the problem is more system than personnel. Finchy seems wed to the idea that our offense works best when Ant (or sometimes Ju) originates the offense. I'm not convinced and would still prefer to see Mike running the offense for 30 MPG. We had a lot of turnovers against OkC in the playoffs, but Mike didn't. He had only 4 turnovers for the entire series. Some of that was he wasn't the primary ballhandler. But I think more of it was because he is far and away our smartest offensive player and most reliable ballhandler. It's not going to happen, but I'd love to see what would happen Wednesday if Finchy gave him the reins.

So many here think our biggest need is a PG. I'd be interested in hearing who we might think is available, and what it might take to get him. Remember that we don't have attractive draft capital, and nobody wants anyone outside of our rotation. I think it would be great to have a smart PG who doesn't turn the ball over, makes 45% of his treys and 92% of his free throws, and doesn't take shots away from our primary scorers, but the price tag for someone like that would probably start with Jaden or at least Naz. And you know what...we already have a guy that fits that profile exactly.

I think the issue with Conley is whether he can really handle 30 MPG and stay healthy and effective. And the playoffs are a whole other ball of wax. He would be relentlessly targeted.

Finch's style is typically to be patient and allow these difficulties to work themselves out, with perhaps some minor adjustments and film room analysis to facilitate the process.

If one wants to be rash about it, the team I'd call is Indiana and inquire about TJ McConnell.

Yeah, 30 MPG is an exaggeration...he only played 25 last year. But while he may be targeted (he was last night a few times) in the playoffs, that doesn't mean he won't be effective. We've talked before here that he was second only to Jaden in the playoffs last year in on/off, with the Wolves 11 points better per 100 possessions when he was on the court. And most of that was because he was effective on defense. Only Jaden and Rudy had a better defensive on/off than Mike as opponents scored 8 points per 100 possessions fewer when he was on the court.

I love TJ's energy, Q, but frankly I wouldn't see him at age 33 as an upgrade over Mike. His lack of a reliable 3-point shot is a real drawback for a PG I think.

I agree with you about Finchy's style, and who am I to argue with a system that has produced a top 5 offense. Ant/Ju originating the offense works well against some of the poor defenses we've seen so far this season. I'd just prefer to have a better game manager leading the offense against a ball-hawking team like OkC, and Mike is the best option we have on our roster.

[Q-is-here]

I am too, Cool...the playoff series against them was tough to watch. But I think the problem is more system than personnel. Finchy seems wed to the idea that our offense works best when Ant (or sometimes Ju) originates the offense. I'm not convinced and would still prefer to see Mike running the offense for 30 MPG. We had a lot of turnovers against OkC in the playoffs, but Mike didn't. He had only 4 turnovers for the entire series. Some of that was he wasn't the primary ballhandler. But I think more of it was because he is far and away our smartest offensive player and most reliable ballhandler. It's not going to happen, but I'd love to see what would happen Wednesday if Finchy gave him the reins.

So many here think our biggest need is a PG. I'd be interested in hearing who we might think is available, and what it might take to get him. Remember that we don't have attractive draft capital, and nobody wants anyone outside of our rotation. I think it would be great to have a smart PG who doesn't turn the ball over, makes 45% of his treys and 92% of his free throws, and doesn't take shots away from our primary scorers, but the price tag for someone like that would probably start with Jaden or at least Naz. And you know what...we already have a guy that fits that profile exactly.

I think the issue with Conley is whether he can really handle 30 MPG and stay healthy and effective. And the playoffs are a whole other ball of wax. He would be relentlessly targeted.

Finch's style is typically to be patient and allow these difficulties to work themselves out, with perhaps some minor adjustments and film room analysis to facilitate the process.

If one wants to be rash about it, the team I'd call is Indiana and inquire about TJ McConnell.

Yeah, 30 MPG is an exaggeration...he only played 25 last year. But while he may be targeted (he was last night a few times) in the playoffs, that doesn't mean he won't be effective. We've talked before here that he was second only to Jaden in the playoffs last year in on/off, with the Wolves 11 points better per 100 possessions when he was on the court. And most of that was because he was effective on defense. Only Jaden and Rudy had a better defensive on/off than Mike as opponents scored 8 points per 100 possessions fewer when he was on the court.

I love TJ's energy, Q, but frankly I wouldn't see him at age 33 as an upgrade over Mike. His lack of a reliable 3-point shot is a real drawback for a PG I think.

I agree with you about Finchy's style, and who am I to argue with a system that has produced a top 5 offense. Ant/Ju originating the offense works well against some of the poor defenses we've seen so far this season. I'd just prefer to have a better game manager leading the offense against a ball-hawking team like OkC, and Mike is the best option we have on our roster.

McConnell was probably the best backup PG in the NBA last season. This season he is averaging on a per minute basis more points, rebounds, assists, and steals than Mike Conley. Even his assist:Turnover ratio is better than Mike's. Literally the only thing Mike is better at is 3-point shooting, but he does so in fairly low volume. Plus TJ is younger and is coming off a playoff/Finals run where he was a key rotation player. I love Mike, but I'd take TJ over him 10 out of 10 times.