Mike, Rob, and Bones

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Q-is-here
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Re: Mike, Rob, and Bones

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AussieWolf3 wrote: Wed Dec 10, 2025 8:38 pm The question that needs to be asked is what kinda of backcourt mate needs to be next to Ant- and to a lesser extend Julius if he stays with the team.

I'm not sure I know the answer to this, before the it was unequivocally Mike and that archetype. Ant has grown in that time tho, on paper his game should be flexible enough to play next to another ball dominant guard, but he doesn't want play off play really. He watches a lot of Luka, and SGA and imo wants to model his game off of them.

To that end it would seem a better defensive version of Dante is likely the best running mate for him anyway, ideally they can also handle the ball up the court and help set the table some. Which of course aka the dirty little question that no seems to talk about, which is that Dante is having a GREAT season.... So why are we trying to replace him in the lineup? Maybe the answer, for now, is just more Dante as the backup, which would be Bones imo

This team is a real puzzle right now
The ideal archetype next to Ant and Julius would be pre-injury Lonzo Ball (emphasis on Lonzo!) circa 2021. It's basically a high level 3 & D game manager that has the size and tenacity to be a POA defender and can knock down the open 3.

The closest thing to that right now is Scottie Pippen Jr., although he'd likely come off the bench for us since I think Finch likes DDV as a starter more than a bench guard. Oh, and he hasn't played a lick this season due to injury.
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Q-is-here
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Re: Mike, Rob, and Bones

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FNG wrote: Wed Dec 10, 2025 8:59 pm I hear your point about Rob needing more minutes, Lip, but then I wonder what our coaching staff is seeing in practice and shootarounds. After three games in which he had 7 assists and only 1 turnover, I fully expected him to get a lot of minutes against the Suns. The fact that he's out of the rotation after three okay games tells me that he might be showing even less in practice than he is in games, and that's not a good thing. I suspect they might think his shot is really broken...it looks like it to me. He seems to be solidly behind a 38-year-old veteran and an erratic role player...really bad for a second year lottery pick. It would be a big "sell low" probably if we moved him now, so instead I would suggest we let him play 35 a night in Iowa. I don't see him developing with the big club.
I agree that Rob should go to Iowa, but it seems like it's almost taboo for recent lottery picks to spend long stretches down there. You rarely see it even if it may be the most logical move, which is a shame because he needs to prove himself against a lower tier of compeition before getting minutes in the NBA again.

I'm afraid if Rob doesn't get extended run in the G-League now while on a lucrative rookie deal and still very young, he's going to probably have to go there eventually under much more humbling circumstances. See Killian Hayes, who is currently toiling for the Cleveland Charge.
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Q-is-here
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Re: Mike, Rob, and Bones

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thedoper wrote: Wed Dec 10, 2025 7:54 pm Its sad that Bones is our best option at PG. If we are calling this a transition year just play him and Rob or make a trade.
Well, technically Ant is the best option at PG since he's starting and doing most of the ball handling.

The question is who should be the primary backup PG coming off the bench. I think that person needs to be traded for, but I will be rooting for Bones to prove me wrong.
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Re: Mike, Rob, and Bones

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Q-is-here wrote: Wed Dec 10, 2025 9:26 pm
AussieWolf3 wrote: Wed Dec 10, 2025 8:38 pm The question that needs to be asked is what kinda of backcourt mate needs to be next to Ant- and to a lesser extend Julius if he stays with the team.

I'm not sure I know the answer to this, before the it was unequivocally Mike and that archetype. Ant has grown in that time tho, on paper his game should be flexible enough to play next to another ball dominant guard, but he doesn't want play off play really. He watches a lot of Luka, and SGA and imo wants to model his game off of them.

To that end it would seem a better defensive version of Dante is likely the best running mate for him anyway, ideally they can also handle the ball up the court and help set the table some. Which of course aka the dirty little question that no seems to talk about, which is that Dante is having a GREAT season.... So why are we trying to replace him in the lineup? Maybe the answer, for now, is just more Dante as the backup, which would be Bones imo

This team is a real puzzle right now
The ideal archetype next to Ant and Julius would be pre-injury Lonzo Ball (emphasis on Lonzo!) circa 2021. It's basically a high level 3 & D game manager that has the size and tenacity to be a POA defender and can knock down the open 3.

The closest thing to that right now is Scottie Pippen Jr., although he'd likely come off the bench for us since I think Finch likes DDV as a starter more than a bench guard. Oh, and he hasn't played a lick this season due to injury.
I really don't think it's necessary that they add a starting guard to replace Dante although I do think that would be best. Just having a bankable backup guard could be enough
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Re: Mike, Rob, and Bones

Post by Q-is-here »

AussieWolf3 wrote: Wed Dec 10, 2025 10:23 pm
Q-is-here wrote: Wed Dec 10, 2025 9:26 pm
AussieWolf3 wrote: Wed Dec 10, 2025 8:38 pm The question that needs to be asked is what kinda of backcourt mate needs to be next to Ant- and to a lesser extend Julius if he stays with the team.

I'm not sure I know the answer to this, before the it was unequivocally Mike and that archetype. Ant has grown in that time tho, on paper his game should be flexible enough to play next to another ball dominant guard, but he doesn't want play off play really. He watches a lot of Luka, and SGA and imo wants to model his game off of them.

To that end it would seem a better defensive version of Dante is likely the best running mate for him anyway, ideally they can also handle the ball up the court and help set the table some. Which of course aka the dirty little question that no seems to talk about, which is that Dante is having a GREAT season.... So why are we trying to replace him in the lineup? Maybe the answer, for now, is just more Dante as the backup, which would be Bones imo

This team is a real puzzle right now
The ideal archetype next to Ant and Julius would be pre-injury Lonzo Ball (emphasis on Lonzo!) circa 2021. It's basically a high level 3 & D game manager that has the size and tenacity to be a POA defender and can knock down the open 3.

The closest thing to that right now is Scottie Pippen Jr., although he'd likely come off the bench for us since I think Finch likes DDV as a starter more than a bench guard. Oh, and he hasn't played a lick this season due to injury.
I really don't think it's necessary that they add a starting guard to replace Dante although I do think that would be best. Just having a bankable backup guard could be enough
I agree. And I think assuming Bones is just meh and Conley continues to struggle they will try to trade for a guy that will backup Ant, but is also bankable as you say and can even be a credible starter from time to time:

Here are some potential trade targets in that ~ $10M or less range that have been mentioned here or elsewhere:
Scotty Pippen Jr.
Payton Pritchard
Jaden Ivey
Kris Dunn
Jose Alvarado
TJ McConnell
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Re: Mike, Rob, and Bones

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I’m on the Jrue Holiday train. Trade Randle for him (might need to be three team deal). Or maybe Portland would like the idea of pairing him with DL next year.
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Re: Mike, Rob, and Bones

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cpg29 wrote: Wed Dec 10, 2025 11:33 pm I’m on the Jrue Holiday train. Trade Randle for him (might need to be three team deal). Or maybe Portland would like the idea of pairing him with DL next year.
This is my favorite target as well. Portland had hoped Jrue would help lead the young Blazers to a strong season, but that has not panned out thus far. Jrue is on his last big contract and will continue to lose value as time goes on. Randle would give the Blazers a productive, veteran presence at PF to pair with the return of Lillard and have that duo lead the young Blazers next year.

A straight trade works if the Wolves include Bones...
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Re: Mike, Rob, and Bones

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Lipoli390 wrote: Wed Dec 10, 2025 8:39 pm As I’ve mentioned many times, we don’t know what we have in Rob because he hasn’t played enough minutes. If the organization refuses to given him the minutes necessary to fully evaluate him, as well as develop him, that’s understandable even though I think it’s a bad decision. I think he should get 25 minutes a game for a long stretch and let’s see where it takes us. It could pay off this season and, if not, it could pay dividends next season and beyond. However, if we don’t do that and we’re basing PG minutes on what we actually know about our three PGs, then Rob is the odd man out, in which case I think it’s Bones and Conley in that order barring some sort of trade for a PG.

I wouldn’t give up value for a mercurial 33 year old coming off a torn ACL. If I wanted to trade for a PG, I’d set my sights on Jrue Holiday and Derrick White. We could make a run at Tyus Jones who is having a terrible year and playing very little. We should be able to get him without giving up much. Maybe Conley for Jones. But honestly, I don’t think Tyus Jones or his equivalent moves the needle and makes this team a title contender. Jrue Holiday or Derrick White might be enough, depending on who we give up to get one of them.

For now, I think we should go with Bones as our main PG and see what happens unless and until Finch is ready to give Rob the run he needs to see whether he can take the next step his former backcourt mate at Kentucky has taken this season.


There are JJ McCarthy parallels here.

The Timberwolves are a veteran team... a perennial playoff team. Dillingham is just not even remotely close to the same level. He might get there eventually, but at what cost to the other players and organization? How much should they be expected to deal with such glaring flaws? Is there enough untapped potential to make it worthwhile?

At this point, Dillingham just hasn't earned more minutes. He's actually playing worse than last season. Can we point to one thing he does well? Not serviceably well... one thing he's better than most players at?

- It's not defense (although his scrappiness on that side might be the biggest surprise... and actually the best thing he has going right now). But it's universally accepted he's going to be below average defensively and targeted often. It's simply a size thing.
- It's not shooting (35/29/69 this season... 44/34/53 last year). There are so many moving parts on his jumper that can potentially limit improvement here. And he's been a poor finisher.
- It's not creating for others. Statistically, he's pedestrian in volume and has a 2/1 A/TO ratio both years. He might be a pretty solid lob passer, but most of his assists are just moving the ball to an open player who hits a jump shot. He's not creating guys open for easy looks. There's a subtle difference, but it's a BIG one.
- He's not very aggressive for a young, athletic guard. This is an eye test thing, but I think it's maybe most telling of all. Count how many times Dillingham is out ahead of the play with the ball -- often with a numbers advantage -- and yet instead of staying on the attack as ALL guards should do... the Wolves PG of the future often ends up passing the ball backwards to a trailer on the play. Even guys like Reid end up with the ball 30 feet from the hoop now facing a set defense instead of the young athletic guard leading a numbers-advantage opportunity. This is HUGE RED FLAG about Dillingham's chops as a potential legit starter in this league.

Either he just doesn't have the skills... or his head is too messed up and he's playing scared. Either way, it's a terrible sign.

- The minutes. Again... kinda tough to give undeserved minutes to a guy on a vet-laden team, making the team worse at least in the short term. As for those minutes, pro sports are a billions-dollars business. You either show off something or you're forgotten, leap-frogged, or even dismissed.

Look at a guy like Collin Gillespie. He played only about 600 minutes in his career coming into this season. But even in those minutes, he showed he had at least one "better than average" skill... he shot 40% and 43% on threes his first two seasons on decent volume. Ryan Nembhard has only played 200+ minutes in his career... and look at what he's doing.

Former college teammate, Reed Sheppard, might be the best (favorable) comp for Dillingham. He had a TERRIBLE rookie season, very comparable to Dillingham, even worse. He's shown he can be a good high-volume three point shooter this season... shooting 45% on pretty good volume. Granted, he was given more of an opportunity in year two in part because the starting PG went down. But in a results-driven industry, he's made himself more indispensable by being better than other players in at least one part of the game.

- Most telling of all as I also mentioned elsewhere... when the star of the organization (the guy who could get ANYONE fired) is championing for the journeyman, flawed 3rd stringer to play over the #8 pick in the draft... it's a very bad sign. What we think doesn't matter. What the coaches think... matters. What Anthony Edwards thinks... really matters. And obviously, there's not a lot of confidence on the Wolves sideline when it comes to their prized young PG.

- I feel for the kid. But at the same time, he's a millionaire many times over. And pro sports are littered with guys that simply didn't pan out like they were supposed to. It happens. And it may very well be happening with Rob Dillingham... at least on the Timberwolves.

I think he'd benefit greatly from getting run (and regaining confidence) on a team with a lot less at stake. A team that is more prepared to live with his development... and willing to take a chance on him figuring things out eventually despite short-term costs.
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Re: Mike, Rob, and Bones

Post by AbeVigodaLive »

60WinTim wrote: Thu Dec 11, 2025 8:03 am
cpg29 wrote: Wed Dec 10, 2025 11:33 pm I’m on the Jrue Holiday train. Trade Randle for him (might need to be three team deal). Or maybe Portland would like the idea of pairing him with DL next year.
This is my favorite target as well. Portland had hoped Jrue would help lead the young Blazers to a strong season, but that has not panned out thus far. Jrue is on his last big contract and will continue to lose value as time goes on. Randle would give the Blazers a productive, veteran presence at PF to pair with the return of Lillard and have that duo lead the young Blazers next year.

A straight trade works if the Wolves include Bones...
The trade would be a "win RIGHT now" trade, because as you mentioned, Holiday's value will keep going down.

Holiday might be comparable to Pat Beverley (sans the antics) at this stage. He was an 11/4/4 guy last season and his defense dropped last year as well. He missed 20 games. He missed 13 the previous season. 15 before that. He's already missed 12 games and counting this season. There's no timetable for his return.

The good part is that he's an ultimate glue guy though... so he'd bring GREAT VIBES and can still offer a lot more than the Conley/Bones/Dillingham crew.

Randle is a better stats guy... but I think we all question the great vibes stuff.

_______

So if the Timberwolves want to go all in on good vibes for THIS season, go for Holiday and hope his calf strain is a fluke. But I think there's a legit chance we'd be looking at Mike Conley v2.0 with more injuries and for a lot more money in a couple of seasons.
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Re: Mike, Rob, and Bones

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AbeVigodaLive wrote: Thu Dec 11, 2025 9:22 am
So if the Timberwolves want to go all in on good vibes for THIS season, go for Holiday and hope his calf strain is a fluke. But I think there's a legit chance we'd be looking at Mike Conley v2.0 with more injuries and for a lot more money in a couple of seasons.
Would this be a net bad thing tho? How would you feel if I came in here and said, "hey I de-aged Mike 3 years!"

It's kicking the can down the road in terms of viable PG play, but we all feel like we had a real starter there for at least a few years. At which point, maybe Ant is really ready to step into primary playmaking.

I don't love Randle for Jrue straight up, but it would be tough to work in another player because of the salary.

The biggest issue I have with a trade like this is:
1- you're betting on synergy being better for team overall then raw talent (Randle is a better player right now)

2- without another move Naz would become a starter and I don't like that idea. I really like him in a role as a super 6, not a starter. I think he's playing better right now than he's given credit for but he shouldn't start for this team
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