Wolves offseason outlook.

[60WinTim]

I wasn't ready to start a new thread on this topic, but I have convinced myself there is a better than 50/50 chance Randle will be traded on or by the day of the draft. Just reading the tea leaves, knowing a Giannis trade will almost surely go down on or by draft day, seeing all the trade possibilities out there, and knowing that other teams willing to trade one of their players will want to have it settled before free agency begins, it seems rather obvious a Randle trade goes down by then.

On another note, I see the "trade of last resort" being Randle and Donte for Morant and something else. And while I'll keep a positive outlook with Morant, I hope it is for someone else!

[WildWolf2813]

They have all their young players under deals. They're under the second apron. They have no bad contracts. How are they in cap hell?

Do you really believe that both Randle and Rudy are on tradable contracts without having to sweeten the deals. We have Jaden, Ant and Naz under deals, but who else? We don't have any significant room to sign a FA other than on the mle and that might be next to nothing if they re-sign Ayo (which will likely be another overpaid deal with a player option).

Randle makes 33 per year 2 more years with a player option in the second year. That 33 is about the middle for starting power forwards To say we need to attach something is ridiculous. Yea they don't have big money to spend on free agents. Newsflash though, nobody has big free agent money anymore. It's so about moving salary slots. Come on man do some research

Randle's issue isn't his contract. At worst he's slightly overpaid, but probably neutral deal in terms of dollars and years.


What makes Randle tough to move is that he's not ideal for any team construct. If you wanna win a ring, not your guy. If you wanna tank, you won't get much back and those teams might want you to attach something. If you want someone to raise your floor, two teams got to work on that by the deadline. He's best suited to be on a team spinning their wheels and teams don't admit that so early. They wanna sell hope. Randle doesn't sell hope.

[Q-is-here]

What makes Randle tough to move is that he's not ideal for any team construct. If you wanna win a ring, not your guy. If you wanna tank, you won't get much back and those teams might want you to attach something. If you want someone to raise your floor, two teams got to work on that by the deadline. He's best suited to be on a team spinning their wheels and teams don't admit that so early. They wanna sell hope. Randle doesn't sell hope.

But don't you think the anti-tanking rules provide some teams a reason to get Randle? The bottom three teams will now be penalized - or relegated is the term being used - by getting one less lottery ball than the 4 thru 10 teams. Well, guess who can lift a team from being a bottom dweller to just plain mediocre? Julius Randle!

So if a team's goal is to maximize lottery balls while developing their talent, they can only go so far with it and actually have to be competitive enough to not end up in the bottom three. And since literally no one has any incentive to be in the bottom 3, teams could be fighting like cats and dogs to stay out of the relegation zone. Randle could prove quite useful to one or more of those teams.

BTW, I think this helps Rudy's market too if the Wolves decide to trade him, but I also think he could be attractive to teams that want to break into the playoffs as well.

[WildWolf2813]

What makes Randle tough to move is that he's not ideal for any team construct. If you wanna win a ring, not your guy. If you wanna tank, you won't get much back and those teams might want you to attach something. If you want someone to raise your floor, two teams got to work on that by the deadline. He's best suited to be on a team spinning their wheels and teams don't admit that so early. They wanna sell hope. Randle doesn't sell hope.

But don't you think the anti-tanking rules provide some teams a reason to get Randle? The bottom three teams will now be penalized - or relegated is the term being used - by getting one less lottery ball than the 4 thru 10 teams. Well, guess who can lift a team from being a bottom dweller to just plain mediocre? Julius Randle!

So if a team's goal is to maximize lottery balls while developing their talent, they can only go so far with it and actually have to be competitive enough to not end up in the bottom three. And since literally no one has any incentive to be in the bottom 3, teams could be fighting like cats and dogs to stay out of the relegation zone. Randle could prove quite useful to one or more of those teams.

BTW, I think this helps Rudy's market too if the Wolves decide to trade him, but I also think he could be attractive to teams that want to break into the playoffs as well.

Let's look at who that impacts:

Utah - went and got JJJ
Washington- went and got Davis
BK- weren't gonna tank anyway; Houston can swap picks with them
Indiana- weren't gonna tank anyway, plus they have Siakam anyway
Charlotte- much more of a possibility for Gobert if anything
Memphis- in a full rebuild but will land Boozer or Wilson
Chicago- see Memphis
Dallas- mystery team
Golden State- never were gonna tank, still have Green
Clippers- likely a fit by this logic
Miami- also a fit by this logic
Milwaukee- in a full rebuild to where it might not matter if they fall in the relegation zone
NO- didn't tank this year, but still have Zion
Sacramento- in a full rebuild, but they're guilty of being extremely short sighted.

So of the teams I named

Nets, Mavs, Clippers, Heat, maybe Kings would consider it

[Q-is-here]

What makes Randle tough to move is that he's not ideal for any team construct. If you wanna win a ring, not your guy. If you wanna tank, you won't get much back and those teams might want you to attach something. If you want someone to raise your floor, two teams got to work on that by the deadline. He's best suited to be on a team spinning their wheels and teams don't admit that so early. They wanna sell hope. Randle doesn't sell hope.

But don't you think the anti-tanking rules provide some teams a reason to get Randle? The bottom three teams will now be penalized - or relegated is the term being used - by getting one less lottery ball than the 4 thru 10 teams. Well, guess who can lift a team from being a bottom dweller to just plain mediocre? Julius Randle!

So if a team's goal is to maximize lottery balls while developing their talent, they can only go so far with it and actually have to be competitive enough to not end up in the bottom three. And since literally no one has any incentive to be in the bottom 3, teams could be fighting like cats and dogs to stay out of the relegation zone. Randle could prove quite useful to one or more of those teams.

BTW, I think this helps Rudy's market too if the Wolves decide to trade him, but I also think he could be attractive to teams that want to break into the playoffs as well.

Let's look at who that impacts:

Utah - went and got JJJ
Washington- went and got Davis
BK- weren't gonna tank anyway; Houston can swap picks with them
Indiana- weren't gonna tank anyway, plus they have Siakam anyway
Charlotte- much more of a possibility for Gobert if anything
Memphis- in a full rebuild but will land Boozer or Wilson
Chicago- see Memphis
Dallas- mystery team
Golden State- never were gonna tank, still have Green
Clippers- likely a fit by this logic
Miami- also a fit by this logic
Milwaukee- in a full rebuild to where it might not matter if they fall in the relegation zone
NO- didn't tank this year, but still have Zion
Sacramento- in a full rebuild, but they're guilty of being extremely short sighted.

So of the teams I named

Nets, Mavs, Clippers, Heat, maybe Kings would consider it

Good list and research! All we need is one team to be interested!

[guest81]

Do you really believe that both Randle and Rudy are on tradable contracts without having to sweeten the deals. We have Jaden, Ant and Naz under deals, but who else? We don't have any significant room to sign a FA other than on the mle and that might be next to nothing if they re-sign Ayo (which will likely be another overpaid deal with a player option).

Randle makes 33 per year 2 more years with a player option in the second year. That 33 is about the middle for starting power forwards To say we need to attach something is ridiculous. Yea they don't have big money to spend on free agents. Newsflash though, nobody has big free agent money anymore. It's so about moving salary slots. Come on man do some research

Randle's issue isn't his contract. At worst he's slightly overpaid, but probably neutral deal in terms of dollars and years.


What makes Randle tough to move is that he's not ideal for any team construct. If you wanna win a ring, not your guy. If you wanna tank, you won't get much back and those teams might want you to attach something. If you want someone to raise your floor, two teams got to work on that by the deadline. He's best suited to be on a team spinning their wheels and teams don't admit that so early. They wanna sell hope. Randle doesn't sell hope.

I think Randle's stock is getting way out of hand here. Yes he struggled against the Spurs and Thunder, but those are also the two best defenses and are set up to destroy players like Randle. On the other hand, Randle destroyed Lebron and Green last year in the playoffs. I think if you put Randle on any east team and he would be a pretty effective player, including both team in the eastern finals. Yea he's not going to be good against the Spurs or Thunder, but how many teams have that goal next year?

[AbeVigodaLive]

What makes Randle tough to move is that he's not ideal for any team construct. If you wanna win a ring, not your guy. If you wanna tank, you won't get much back and those teams might want you to attach something. If you want someone to raise your floor, two teams got to work on that by the deadline. He's best suited to be on a team spinning their wheels and teams don't admit that so early. They wanna sell hope. Randle doesn't sell hope.

But don't you think the anti-tanking rules provide some teams a reason to get Randle? The bottom three teams will now be penalized - or relegated is the term being used - by getting one less lottery ball than the 4 thru 10 teams. Well, guess who can lift a team from being a bottom dweller to just plain mediocre? Julius Randle!

So if a team's goal is to maximize lottery balls while developing their talent, they can only go so far with it and actually have to be competitive enough to not end up in the bottom three. And since literally no one has any incentive to be in the bottom 3, teams could be fighting like cats and dogs to stay out of the relegation zone. Randle could prove quite useful to one or more of those teams.

BTW, I think this helps Rudy's market too if the Wolves decide to trade him, but I also think he could be attractive to teams that want to break into the playoffs as well.

Came here to write something similar. I heard this angle on a recent podcast (Dane Moore?) and there's probably some level of merit to it.

Something like "Randle can be the #1 option on a 35 - 47 team..." so fans have a reason to go to games without worrying about the win impacting lottery odds too much.

The Promise of Hope re-re-re-builds in the NBA are dying. I need a new gimmick.

[FNG]

Randle makes 33 per year 2 more years with a player option in the second year. That 33 is about the middle for starting power forwards To say we need to attach something is ridiculous. Yea they don't have big money to spend on free agents. Newsflash though, nobody has big free agent money anymore. It's so about moving salary slots. Come on man do some research

Randle's issue isn't his contract. At worst he's slightly overpaid, but probably neutral deal in terms of dollars and years.


What makes Randle tough to move is that he's not ideal for any team construct. If you wanna win a ring, not your guy. If you wanna tank, you won't get much back and those teams might want you to attach something. If you want someone to raise your floor, two teams got to work on that by the deadline. He's best suited to be on a team spinning their wheels and teams don't admit that so early. They wanna sell hope. Randle doesn't sell hope.

I think Randle's stock is getting way out of hand here. Yes he struggled against the Spurs and Thunder, but those are also the two best defenses and are set up to destroy players like Randle. On the other hand, Randle destroyed Lebron and Green last year in the playoffs. I think if you put Randle on any east team and he would be a pretty effective player, including both team in the eastern finals. Yea he's not going to be good against the Spurs or Thunder, but how many teams have that goal next year?

Every team has a whipping boy, and ours is Julius Randle. I was as frustrated as anyone with his poor play in the playoffs and his often indifferent defense during the season, but GMs are going to look at his production last year relative to his contract. He put up 21 PPG (23rd in the league), 6.7 RPG (37th) and 5 APG (35th in the league and 8th among forwards and centers) for the season, and his $31 million was 55th in the Association last season...and he's locked in for the next two years with a small increase. His VORP was equal to Bane, Booker and Butler, and his ws/48 was equal to Anonoby, Castle and Jaylen Brown. You guys know that I am a fan of outscoring your opponent when you are on the court because my understanding of the NBA rules is that the team that outscores the other team is awarded a win...and Ju was a +2.5 on the season. Yes his defense can be an issue...the Wolves gave up 5.1 more points per 100 when he was on the court, almost as bad as Ant's team-worse 5.6. But his +7.6 on offense was the best on the team, better than second place Ant at +5.8. I agree that we are likely to move Ju in the offseason and I will not be heartbroken if we do (I also won't be suicidal if we don't, but I will be doing wellness checks on some posters here), but I don't agree that he will be difficult to move...his contract is a bargain relative to his production in both raw and advanced stats. I suspect we will be happy with what we get back for him.

[guest81]

Randle's issue isn't his contract. At worst he's slightly overpaid, but probably neutral deal in terms of dollars and years.


What makes Randle tough to move is that he's not ideal for any team construct. If you wanna win a ring, not your guy. If you wanna tank, you won't get much back and those teams might want you to attach something. If you want someone to raise your floor, two teams got to work on that by the deadline. He's best suited to be on a team spinning their wheels and teams don't admit that so early. They wanna sell hope. Randle doesn't sell hope.

I think Randle's stock is getting way out of hand here. Yes he struggled against the Spurs and Thunder, but those are also the two best defenses and are set up to destroy players like Randle. On the other hand, Randle destroyed Lebron and Green last year in the playoffs. I think if you put Randle on any east team and he would be a pretty effective player, including both team in the eastern finals. Yea he's not going to be good against the Spurs or Thunder, but how many teams have that goal next year?

Every team has a whipping boy, and ours is Julius Randle. I was as frustrated as anyone with his poor play in the playoffs and his often indifferent defense during the season, but GMs are going to look at his production last year relative to his contract. He put up 21 PPG (23rd in the league), 6.7 RPG (37th) and 5 APG (35th in the league and 8th among forwards and centers) for the season, and his $31 million was 55th in the Association last season...and he's locked in for the next two years with a small increase. His VORP was equal to Bane, Booker and Butler, and his ws/48 was equal to Anonoby, Castle and Jaylen Brown. You guys know that I am a fan of outscoring your opponent when you are on the court because my understanding of the NBA rules is that the team that outscores the other team is awarded a win...and Ju was a +2.5 on the season. Yes his defense can be an issue...the Wolves gave up 5.1 more points per 100 when he was on the court, almost as bad as Ant's team-worse 5.6. But his +7.6 on offense was the best on the team, better than second place Ant at +5.8. I agree that we are likely to move Ju in the offseason and I will not be heartbroken if we do (I also won't be suicidal if we don't, but I will be doing wellness checks on some posters here), but I don't agree that he will be difficult to move...his contract is a bargain relative to his production in both raw and advanced stats. I suspect we will be happy with what we get back for him.

I'd put his value higher than D'lo when he was on the Wolves and look how that turned out

[Q-is-here]

I think Randle's stock is getting way out of hand here. Yes he struggled against the Spurs and Thunder, but those are also the two best defenses and are set up to destroy players like Randle. On the other hand, Randle destroyed Lebron and Green last year in the playoffs. I think if you put Randle on any east team and he would be a pretty effective player, including both team in the eastern finals. Yea he's not going to be good against the Spurs or Thunder, but how many teams have that goal next year?

Every team has a whipping boy, and ours is Julius Randle. I was as frustrated as anyone with his poor play in the playoffs and his often indifferent defense during the season, but GMs are going to look at his production last year relative to his contract. He put up 21 PPG (23rd in the league), 6.7 RPG (37th) and 5 APG (35th in the league and 8th among forwards and centers) for the season, and his $31 million was 55th in the Association last season...and he's locked in for the next two years with a small increase. His VORP was equal to Bane, Booker and Butler, and his ws/48 was equal to Anonoby, Castle and Jaylen Brown. You guys know that I am a fan of outscoring your opponent when you are on the court because my understanding of the NBA rules is that the team that outscores the other team is awarded a win...and Ju was a +2.5 on the season. Yes his defense can be an issue...the Wolves gave up 5.1 more points per 100 when he was on the court, almost as bad as Ant's team-worse 5.6. But his +7.6 on offense was the best on the team, better than second place Ant at +5.8. I agree that we are likely to move Ju in the offseason and I will not be heartbroken if we do (I also won't be suicidal if we don't, but I will be doing wellness checks on some posters here), but I don't agree that he will be difficult to move...his contract is a bargain relative to his production in both raw and advanced stats. I suspect we will be happy with what we get back for him.

I'd put his value higher than D'lo when he was on the Wolves and look how that turned out

I think the answer is somewhere in between what FNG thinks and the more pessimistic "we have to attach an asset" take.

DeMar DeRozan yielded Chicago a couple of 2nd rounders and the infamous cash considerations. That isn't a great return but they didn't have to attach anything to DeMar either. They were basically able to get off his deal for free.

Zach LaVine yielded Chicago Zach Collins, Tre Jones, and Kevin Huerter. Not great, but not bad. Tre is a damn solid PG.

DeAndre Ayton was traded by Phoenix to Portland for Nurkic, Grayson Allen, Nassir Little, and Keon Johnson. Nothing great there, but again, Phoenix didn't have to attach assets to get off Ayton's deal.