Rubio

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

I see Rubio as a bridge to the future, where he helps take some of the ball handling and decision making pressure off of guys like DLO, Culver, and Edwards while also being a positive contributor to winning. He's on a contract that could be a very valuable trade asset next offseason.

I'm always skeptical of claims that superior veterans somehow stymie the development of younger players. It seems like players like Wiggins, Wes Johnson, Derrick Williams, and countless other young Wolves prospects over the years have been perfectly capable of stymieing themselves despite plenty of playing time.

Guys can and do improve through team practices, individual workouts, and the G-League. Eventually injuries and illness will open up playing time for [insert name of your current favorite Wolves prospect] this season.

[Lipoli390]

No he doesnt move the needle enough. But he's likeable, and Taylor is grasping at straws to have any positive narrative around the team hes trying to sell.

I agree that he moves the needle, but not enough. I think Cam's analysis is spot on, especially his point about Ricky stifling the development of some of our younger guys. I also agree with Kahns that Ricky wasn't worth the 17th pick given the team's needs. And I'm a big Rubio fan.

But I'll just note that I doubt the Rubio acquisition had nothing to do with Glen Taylor. This was all Rosas. Remember that Rosas pursued Ricky in free agency last year and came up short. So, in typical Rosas fashion, he pursued him again in a trade. It's exactly what he did with DLO. Ricky was one of Gersson's guys, for better or for worse, from the moment he got here. Rosas fell in love with H-Gomez and Beasley and wasn't about to let either one get away in free agency. By the way, I'm OK with the Beasley signing.

The sometimes popular narrative that Glen injects himself into front office decision-making is false. Jon K has said that and I've talked with insiders over the years who have said the same thing. Glen didn't stop Thibodeau from trading Ricky. He also allowed Thibodeau to trade Zach LaVine and others. He's allowed Rosas to completely make over the roster and spend the team into luxury tax territory. He signed off on McHale's illegal Joe Smith. Glen generally makes bad hiring decisions and then lets his bad hires fail before replacing them with other bad hires. It's the sad tale of this franchise. If anything, I'd argue that Glen hasn't interferred enough to. The one time he intervened was when Butler was acting out. But in that case, I think Glen waited too long. And note that Glen's intervention in that instance was simple to delegate authority to Scott Layden to take over the Butler trade talks because Thibodeau was passively-aggressively resisting.

I dont think Glen has to inject himself in every day to day decision, but he's established in multiple interviews that he likes to be aware and approve transactions, it seems he doesnt meddle until big decisions need to be made, when his initial bad hiring necessitates change. Glen forced Rosas with a novice coach, top level meddling in basketball decisions. You think that when Rosas announced his potential initial pursuit of Rubio he wasnt emboldened by the enthusiastic response of his boss and his "head coach"? I think he was so emboldened that he even gave up a draft pick that no other team as bad as us would give up for Rubio. Glen meddled with KG, meddled post KG, fell asleep for a few years while the team rotted, meddled with love, and now we are reaping the results of Glens biggest meddling move of forcing an experienced coach into a position of power in the organization based on a relationship. Jon K loves his occasional chats with Taylor, hes not going to give up that access by being too hard on the guy. I get that everyone wants to honor his stubbornness in keeping the team in Minnesota, its admirable. But he's the worst kind of owner, inept when he motivates himself to get involved, and asleep at all other times.

Every owner expects to be kept informed and have sign-off authority on big deals. Any owner who doesn't is an idiot. And let's be clear, Glen didn't force Rosas into hiring a novice coach. It should be clear that Glen gives his executives free rein. Glen absolutely loved Ricky Rubio, but didn't lift a finger to stop Thibodeau from trading him. He had to know the Joe Smith deal violated NBA rules, but he signed off on it anyway. Rosas hired Ryan because that's the guy he wanted. Rosas went on and on about how he and Ryan were in alignment. Give how obsessed Rosas obviously is with a certain style of play or "system" it shouldn't be surprising that he's want a head coach totally committed to that system and who isn't a strong personality who might resist. In Ryan, Rosas has an extension of himself on the court. That's what he wanted and that's what he got in Ryan.

I'm not saying these things out of affection for Glen as the guy who kept the Wolves in Minnesota even though Wolves fans should always be thankful to him fro that. I have long since gone on record with my view that we need new ownership. But Glen's failing has never been meddling; it's been his terrible hiring judgment, which was never more apparent than in his decision to hire David Kahn - a guy no other NBA owner would have hired. I'm told that Glen was not thrilled with the decision to give Wiggins the max extension, but that's what Thibodeau wanted. Thibodeau was rightly convinced of Wiggins' incredible talented and he believed that Butler would bring the best out in him. The fact that Glen had that silly "look me in the eye" meeting didn't reflect Glen's desire to give Wiggins a max deal; instead it reflected Glen's doubts about Wiggins coupled with Glen's consistent tendency to defer to the executives he hires. If I had owned the team at the time, I would have said no to Thibs and that's what Glen should have done instead of having the ridiculous heart-to-heart conversation with Andrew.

Again, I'm not defending Glen as an owner. The team's record speaks for itself in that regard. I'm simply calling out the baseless and erroneous narrative that Glen injects himself into major front office decisions. The fact is that he doesn't. But his hiring judgment is absolutely horrible.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Sorry, Lip, but I just don't buy that. Glen Taylor gets involved more than he should for an owner.

Several years ago, Taylor told Sid Hartman that he was giving Andrew Wiggins a max contract and that Wiggins was unavailable in any trade package, including one for Kyrie Irving. That wasn't Tom Thibodeau. That was Taylor.

And then there's Taylor's reluctance to allow Thibodeau to include Wiggins in trade offers to Chicago for Jimmy Butler.

"I'm led to believe that Thibs had a somewhat open mind on moving Wiggins to Chicago, but Glen Taylor stepped in almost immediately and said no, Andrew is staying. They told Chicago within the first ten minutes of talk that Wiggins is off the table."

- Darren Wolfson on SKOR North

Link: https://twitter.com/skornorth/status/971893696856842240?s=21

And then there's Taylor's insistence on keeping Ryan Saunders around this franchise. When Taylor hired Thibodeau he allowed him to fill out his staff as long as Saunders remained on the bench. Weird, but okay. And then when Taylor fired Thibodeau he promoted Saunders to head coach over other assistant coaches that had more experience and frankly deserved that interim job over him. Nothing too crazy here yet, though. The old man just threw the kid a bone. I can deal with that.

But then Taylor was looking for a new POBO to hire with two likely conditions. Taylor wanted to keep Scott Layden in the front office and Saunders was to continue being the head coach.

"The Minnesota Timberwolves are planning to open a search for a new president of basketball operations, although owner Glen Taylor prefers to keep general manager Scott Layden and interim coach Ryan Saunders as part of a revised organizational structure, league sources told ESPN.

The Timberwolves are hopeful to award Saunders a multiyear deal as coach, sources said. Saunders is likely to get a three-year deal with a team option on the final season, sources said."

Link: https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/26486073/sources-wolves-looking-team-president

Rosas was hired and conducted a light search for a head coach, but anyone with common sense saw that was just for show. Taylor got his way yet again. This is bizarre micromanagement from one of the worst owners in the league.

[thedoper]

I dont think its baseless and erroneous to call the Ryan hiring meddling. There is no way Ryan gets that job without Glen wanting it to happen. Wether it was a direct condition of Rosas getting the POBO job no one will ever know, but it certainly was meddling. Glen calling into question KG's effort was probably the worst meddling ever done by an owner and the legacy still haunts us today. Glen had no business speaking to player's effort on the court, especially a HOF player who is arguably the cream of the crop in terms of effort. Glen also publicly said signing Spree and Cassel and paying the luxury tax was a mistake. If you come and speak over your GM/POBO to the media that is meddling.

Our current state of the Wolves is that Rosas is going to please Glen at all costs with his blind optimism in a systems based approach. Glen doesn't have to meddle when he set up a conflict free environment that can skirt his ineptitude.

[Lipoli390]

I dont think its baseless and erroneous to call the Ryan hiring meddling. There is no way Ryan gets that job without Glen wanting it to happen. Wether it was a direct condition of Rosas getting the POBO job no one will ever know, but it certainly was meddling. Glen calling into question KG's effort was probably the worst meddling ever done by an owner and the legacy still haunts us today. Glen had no business speaking to player's effort on the court, especially a HOF player who is arguably the cream of the crop in terms of effort. Glen also publicly said signing Spree and Cassel and paying the luxury tax was a mistake. If you come and speak over your GM/POBO to the media that is meddling.

Our current state of the Wolves is that Rosas is going to please Glen at all costs with his blind optimism in a systems based approach. Glen doesn't have to meddle when he set up a conflict free environment that can skirt his ineptitude.

Glen has said some really dumb things, especially his comment about KG. And I'll grant you that comment could be construed as meddling. But ultimately, it was McHale's decision to trade KG because he couldn't see another path. McHale also loved Al Jefferson. In the end, it was McHale's call to trade KG. Glen Taylor loved Flip, but he allowed McHale to fire him. He loved Ricky, but allowed Thibs to trade him.

Yes, Glen preferred to keep Layden and Ryan in the organization and it was Layden's decision to make Ryan interim head coach with Glen's blessing. But the decision to elevate Ryan from interim to permanent head coach was ultimately Gersson's. Glen wasn't going to stop him from replacing Ryan as head coach any more than he stopped Thibs from trading Ricky or stopped McHale from firing Flip. If Rosas didn't have the backbone to replace Ryan in spite of Glen's "preference," then that's on Rosas. Honestly, Rosas could have appeased Rosas simply by keeping Ryan on as an assistant coach or an assistant GM. I think it's clear Rosas wanted Ryan as his head coach. I think he likes having someone there who isn't going to challenge him and his beloved system.

As for Wiggins, I'm simply not inclined to rely on a report from Doogie. I've heard from people I trust that it was Thibs who ultimately decided he didn't want to give up Wiggins because he knew how talented Wiggins was and thought Butler could mentor and drive him. If what I've heard is wrong, and Doogie is right, then that's one example of interference. As for Spree and Sam, McHale signed them. What they demanded to be re-signed seemed unreasonable to me at the time. It's perfectly appropriate for an owner to object to a transaction on financial grounds. In that regard, he's not alone. But he allowed McHale to sign KG to the largest contract in sports history at the time.

I'm done arguing this point. In a sense, it doesn't matter. Bottom line is that Glen done a horrendous job hiring his top basketball executives over the years. That's the real problem with his ownership. As owner, he clearly allowed one bad decision after another by those executives he hired, even when it meant paying the luxury tax, signing KG's friends like T-HUD, trading his favorite player Ricky, firing his favorite coach Flip or allowing the illegal Joe Smith deal. Most recently, he's allowed Rosas to completely remake the roster, relentlessly shaped to fit some vision of a system in Gersson's mind. If anything, I wish Glen would intervene as much as some seem to think he has. Then again, Glen's judgment is as bad as the judgment of the executives he's hired.

[KG4Ever]

As a veteran presence does he sway the needle enough in the W/L department to justify his salary? Or does he handicap the the youngsters by eating up their minutes and not letting them realize more talent then he ever realized?

I'm not sure why you are picking on Rubio. There are so many more overpaid players on this roster. He is proven to move the needle if the minutes are there. Just look at his stint in Phoenix.

[Coolbreeze44]

I have to side with Lip on this one. Whenever you own a team for as long as Glen has, there are going to be some instances of meddling over one thing or another. But when I think of Glen, it's not the meddling that comes to mind. It's definitely the terrible hiring choices he's made. Outside of Flip, the buffoons he's had running his basketball operation have been one joke after another. And Lip is right, there have been times when as the owner he should have meddled more. I think this Rosas character is actually worse than Thibs was. I'd like to know what the interview script is when he hires these guys. The first question should be, do you have any idea what it takes to build a winner in the NBA? And the second question should be, okay, can you recommend someone that does? Keep asking those two questions until you find a guy who knows how to answer the first one.