monsterpile wrote:So where is the actual evidence that Thibs doesn't personally connect with the current players?
You know better, monster. There isn't any actual evidence at our disposal, but there is plenty of biased speculation based on little to nothing.
Thibs wasn't my first choice for head coach and I made it abundantly clear during the hiring process. Yet, I'm still preaching patience as he breaks the colts down and hopefully has a plan to build them back up. I feel for Cam, and at the same time respect him on this issue. Before the hire was made, Cam led a virtual army of people on this board in the pro-Thibs movement. Yet today he is the only guy going to bat for his guy. Where are the rest of you who were so vocal about Thibs being the obvious choice? I know there was less than a handful of us who wanted someone else. 95% of you got the guy you wanted, but today you wouldn't know it.
monsterpile wrote:So where is the actual evidence that Thibs doesn't personally connect with the current players?
You know better, monster. There isn't any actual evidence at our disposal, but there is plenty of biased speculation based on little to nothing.
Thibs wasn't my first choice for head coach and I made it abundantly clear during the hiring process. Yet, I'm still preaching patience as he breaks the colts down and hopefully has a plan to build them back up. I feel for Cam, and at the same time respect him on this issue. Before the hire was made, Cam led a virtual army of people on this board in the pro-Thibs movement. Yet today he is the only guy going to bat for his guy. Where are the rest of you who were so vocal about Thibs being the obvious choice? I know there was less than a handful of us who wanted someone else. 95% of you got the guy you wanted, but today you wouldn't know it.
I don't know if I'd go that far. Obviously, this thread is a bit tongue-in-cheek for the doomsdayers.
It seems like there's a disconnect somewhere because the team has regressed. And let's just say there really is a disconnect for the sake of argument...
Is that even all on Thibs? What if the players behind the scenes are simply adverse to learning some of these principles. Or they've been swept up in the hype and figure that they're still scoring 20+ ppg so they've already made it.
I can barely relate to the 21 year old making me my overpriced latte. Relating to a 21 year old millionaire who's been coddled his entire life and is constantly being told he's the next big thing...?
monsterpile wrote:So where is the actual evidence that Thibs doesn't personally connect with the current players?
You know better, monster. There isn't any actual evidence at our disposal, but there is plenty of biased speculation based on little to nothing.
Thibs wasn't my first choice for head coach and I made it abundantly clear during the hiring process. Yet, I'm still preaching patience as he breaks the colts down and hopefully has a plan to build them back up. I feel for Cam, and at the same time respect him on this issue. Before the hire was made, Cam led a virtual army of people on this board in the pro-Thibs movement. Yet today he is the only guy going to bat for his guy. Where are the rest of you who were so vocal about Thibs being the obvious choice? I know there was less than a handful of us who wanted someone else. 95% of you got the guy you wanted, but today you wouldn't know it.
I don't know if I'd go that far. Obviously, this thread is a bit tongue-in-cheek for the doomsdayers.
It seems like there's a disconnect somewhere because the team has regressed. And let's just say there really is a disconnect for the sake of argument...
Is that even all on Thibs? What if the players behind the scenes are simply adverse to learning some of these principles. Or they've been swept up in the hype and figure that they're still scoring 20+ ppg so they've already made it.
I can barely relate to the 21 year old making me my overpriced latte. Relating to a 21 year old millionaire who's been coddled his entire life and is constantly being told he's the next big thing...?
I wouldn't know where to start.
I used to always feel good about working with teens and people in their early 20's For some reason I just liked working with that age group. Since I don't do it as much for work I do wonder if I connect like I used to with that age group, but I think I do its just a little different since I am older. I still spend some time with the young folk though and I have plenty of good interactions with them. I think there are differences, but as a principal I worked for (back in the late 90's) said on a number of occasions when people said times were so different "The more things change the more they stay the same". Show interest in people and what they are interested in. Tell a funny story that relates to what they shared. Value their contributions. I don't think its that different than what I did over 10 years ago when I was working at schools but maybe I don't know that the world has passed me by. =)
Also Cool Cam isn't alone. I've been trying to be sensible about Thibs for weeks now. Bloop just posted a thread about how Thibs is being a developmental coach. I do think the feel of the board about Thibs is closer to the sky is falling though but I don't think all the posters feel that way.
I've never considered myself a coaching expert or had really strong opinions about them, but I do know coaches can make a big impact on defense more than offense and that's why the Thibs hire resonated with me. But the fact is we suck right now and most of it is due to mental limitations versus physical limitations. There could be a myriad of reasons for this, including the "we need to break them down and get worse before we get better" excuse. I'm willing to hold out hope, but I have no qualms with someone critizing Thibs based on the results we see on the floor. Hopefully it changes.
monsterpile wrote:So where is the actual evidence that Thibs doesn't personally connect with the current players?
Other than the fact that the team has regressed from last year, I don't know that there is any specific evidence that Thibs doesn't connect with these guys, monster. I know that some of the guys that attend games more regularly (Lipoli and me, to name two) have noticed some body language that suggests there's room for improvement in the relationship between players and coach, but at least openly the players are all saying the proper things about him.
The question is whether Thibs is maximizing the value of his roster (like Fizdale seems to be), and I think it's a stretch to suggest that he is.
It's been said already, and I'll say it when I see this Fizdale/Thibodeau topic arise, but the comparison between Memphis and Minnesota is invalid and the primary reason is veteran production/leadership. We do not have Marc Gasol, Tony Allen, and Zach Randolph. They simply aren't mentors from the sideline. They're on the floor impacting the game with their play first, and with their knowledge/experience second. Those three and Conley (injured) are the cogs of that Grit & Grind machine that churns out playoff berths year after year. The pieces around those guys, however unimpressive they are, are for the most part interchangeable and the reason is because the veterans make weaker players play better on the floor.
Memphis has smart players. More than the ability of the coach to connect, we seem to have valued athleticism on this team at the expense of any sort of basketball IQ for the most part (and for a guy like Dunn who was supposed to have a high BBIQ, what's his excuse?)
I think you can be 100% behind Thibs and yet still question whether his coaching style or some strategic decisions he's made have been good for this young team. Those two thoughts can co-exist 26 games into a season that has started 7-19.
By the end of the season it should be more apparent what the true Thibs affect is. We are clearly a better team on paper this year and most "experts" predicted we would win about half our games. If we don't come anywhere close to this, without major injuries, and possibly win less games than last year, then the only logical conclusion is Thibs didn't get it done. Regardless, he'll get a second year to right the ship anyway (maybe trade for the guys he wants), so might as well get used to that growl on the sidelines because it's going to be here for a while.
