I SWEAR TO GAWD... THE NEXT POSTER WHO MENTIONS THE FUCKING TIMELINE I'M GOING TO FUCKING SNAP AND FUCKING DESTROY YOU!!!!!!!
[Note: Whew. Ok. That felt better... even if slightly in jest. Timelines... LOL.]
It legit went through my head Abe is going to destroy you when I read the post. Once again Timeline in todays NBA is so overrated. The Wolves have had 5 #1 picks over the last 10 years. Rose, Bennett, Kat, Wiggins, Edwards and look where we are at.
The Wolves are in legit in danger of being relocated the Wolves, the Wolves can't afford a long rebuild of being really really shitty. Wolves obviously don't need to make the playoffs every year but I think the Wolves need to be semi competitive and where the Wolves are they can't "trust the process" Wolves don't have the leeway
ALLDAYCHRIS wrote:trading away your future draft picks for a max salary player and having no cap space isn't my idea of a rebuild.
The Wolves haven't been built since KG left, so technically we're still rebuilding.
I completely understand the frustration on where the Wolves are at being caped out. But it isn't like we have been selecting super low in the draft. We selected Dunn, Culver and Edwards all in the top 6 in the last 5 years and we still suck. If we can get productive players for Kat you have to do that and continue to try and draft well.
Well, I got on board with the idea of trading KAT last year. It's clear as day that this team is going nowhere even with a healthy KAT. I mean, may be they get to 30-35 wins at best if KAT were 100% for a full season, but that's what we're capped out given the lack of improvement we are seeing from the young guys.
So yeah...trade him for at least one proven, young asset + picks. And ideally we could trade DLO too for an expiring set of contracts, but I'm not sure that would be available. I feel like we'd need to unload another pick to get rid of him - just like we did with Wiggins!
But here is the problem. Rosas has staked his job on building around KAT and Taylor is glacial in his decision making, so Rosas won't make this kind of trade and Glen won't make a decision on Rosas.
I think we probably have this season and next season to suffer through before KAT himself basically forces his way out.
ALLDAYCHRIS wrote:trading away your future draft picks for a max salary player and having no cap space isn't my idea of a rebuild.
The Wolves haven't been built since KG left, so technically we're still rebuilding.
I completely understand the frustration on where the Wolves are at being caped out. But it isn't like we have been selecting super low in the draft. We selected Dunn, Culver and Edwards all in the top 6 in the last 5 years and we still suck. If we can get productive players for Kat you have to do that and continue to try and draft well.
We already have picks, we don't need to get worse! Unless KAT demands out then he is off the table.
In this case I really hate to say I told you so, but we are so poorly constructed and have so little hope that a complete teardown is really all that is left. At the time of the DLO trade last year I went on a week long tirade about how fed up I was with the organization, and how this was never going to work. Well the chickens have come home to roost and here we are. We need a brand new culture and it starts with hiring a PBO who has vision. Need to find the Theo Epstein of the NBA. And I know you hate to hear it, but he needs to be able to build this thing the right way. And it's not going to happen overnight.
I realize this is probably wishful thinking on my part. Some of you are going to get your wish, we will strive for mediocrity with this cast of characters. Chances are about 50/50 whether we can achieve said mediocrity and in 2 or 3 years we will still be shooting for that low range goal. Nothing can be built on a soft foundation and the Wolves foundation is made from jello.
It all starts with getting the right leadership, aka - not Rosas. The right guy would look at this situation and determine we don't have much to build on. He might try to convince KAT to stick around while he puts things together, but ultimately KAT will not want to be part of a complete rebuild and should be allowed to leave via trade. Here's the blueprint if I'm Glen:
1) Find and hire the visionary I'm talking about
2) Trade as much as you can to build up draft capital, and don't bring back salary
3) Get our cap situation straightened out. A piss poor team should never be up against the cap.
4) Hire a coach who can manage people and adapt his strategy to the personnel
5) Invest heavily in scouting
6) Draft for value and trade down frequently to increase opportunity
7) Hopefully our next stars come along during this process. But once the nucleus is established, make strategic moves to bring in more star talent either by trade or free agency.
8) Focus on getting playoff experience while the nucleus is young, and then take the next step each year after.
9) Remain a contender by knowing when to get rid of a player. Do not strap yourself with long term contracts that rarely pay off.
10) Be nimble with the roster and be innovative to adapt as the game evolves.
You follow this plan and you will eventually get some shots at the championship. You're not guaranteed to win the ultimate prize, but this is how you should approach it.
I SWEAR TO GAWD... THE NEXT POSTER WHO MENTIONS THE FUCKING TIMELINE I'M GOING TO FUCKING SNAP AND FUCKING DESTROY YOU!!!!!!!
[Note: Whew. Ok. That felt better... even if slightly in jest. Timelines... LOL.]
I'm not trolling anyone but just for fun........ TIMELINE TIMELINE TIMELINE TIMELINE TIMELINE TIMELINE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :) did you snap yet????????????
In all seriousness though I love the wolves and feel like the best option would be to shop KAT now. Whether you think that is for young players with real upside and or draft picks is fine with me. Keeping him however will only end badly for us when he demands a trade. We are looking at being a bottom 5 team with him along with the privilege of overpaying his buddy DLO.
I don't see how that is a better situation than moving on and getting the best haul possible for him now.
CoolBreeze44 wrote:In this case I really hate to say I told you so, but we are so poorly constructed and have so little hope that a complete teardown is really all that is left. At the time of the DLO trade last year I went on a week long tirade about how fed up I was with the organization, and how this was never going to work. Well the chickens have come home to roost and here we are. We need a brand new culture and it starts with hiring a PBO who has vision. Need to find the Theo Epstein of the NBA. And I know you hate to hear it, but he needs to be able to build this thing the right way. And it's not going to happen overnight.
I realize this is probably wishful thinking on my part. Some of you are going to get your wish, we will strive for mediocrity with this cast of characters. Chances are about 50/50 whether we can achieve said mediocrity and in 2 or 3 years we will still be shooting for that low range goal. Nothing can be built on a soft foundation and the Wolves foundation is made from jello.
It all starts with getting the right leadership, aka - not Rosas. The right guy would look at this situation and determine we don't have much to build on. He might try to convince KAT to stick around while he puts things together, but ultimately KAT will not want to be part of a complete rebuild and should be allowed to leave via trade. Here's the blueprint if I'm Glen:
1) Find and hire the visionary I'm talking about
2) Trade as much as you can to build up draft capital, and don't bring back salary
3) Get our cap situation straightened out. A piss poor team should never be up against the cap.
4) Hire a coach who can manage people and adapt his strategy to the personnel
5) Invest heavily in scouting
6) Draft for value and trade down frequently to increase opportunity
7) Hopefully our next stars come along during this process. But once the nucleus is established, make strategic moves to bring in more star talent either by trade or free agency.
8) Focus on getting playoff experience while the nucleus is young, and then take the next step each year after.
9) Remain a contender by knowing when to get rid of a player. Do not strap yourself with long term contracts that rarely pay off.
10) Be nimble with the roster and be innovative to adapt as the game evolves.
You follow this plan and you will eventually get some shots at the championship. You're not guaranteed to win the ultimate prize, but this is how you should approach it.
Did you want to draft Ball? Why do you think Glen would hire the right guy in the first place?
I SWEAR TO GAWD... THE NEXT POSTER WHO MENTIONS THE FUCKING TIMELINE I'M GOING TO FUCKING SNAP AND FUCKING DESTROY YOU!!!!!!!
[Note: Whew. Ok. That felt better... even if slightly in jest. Timelines... LOL.]
I'm not trolling anyone but just for fun........ TIMELINE TIMELINE TIMELINE TIMELINE TIMELINE TIMELINE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :) did you snap yet????????????
In all seriousness though I love the wolves and feel like the best option would be to shop KAT now. Whether you think that is for young players with real upside and or draft picks is fine with me. Keeping him however will only end badly for us when he demands a trade. We are looking at being a bottom 5 team with him along with the privilege of overpaying his buddy DLO.
I don't see how that is a better situation than moving on and getting the best haul possible for him now.
I don't think Abe is anti a Kat trade he is anti a trade where the best thing the Wolves get back is picks or unproven young players who we can hope to he good (like Wiseman). We need an established young player back in the deal to make it worth it.
This certainly limits teams, but they are out there. Atlanta was mentioned, and I would say they are a realistic trade partner IMO. I believe Atlanta is making a HUGE mistake in apparently prioritizing Trae over Collins. Trae is SOOOOOOO overrated, but the league has shited towards these guys than can draw bogus fouls.
But what does that look like?
What if they offered Collins, Capela and 3 unprotected 1st round picks? I would certainly consider.
This certainly limits teams, but they are out there. Atlanta was mentioned, and I would say they are a realistic trade partner IMO. I believe Atlanta is making a HUGE mistake in apparently prioritizing Trae over Collins. Trae is SOOOOOOO overrated, but the league has shited towards these guys than can draw bogus fouls.
But what does that look like?
What if they offered Collins, Capela and 3 unprotected 1st round picks? I would certainly consider.
I think Atlanta would be a good trade partner but I would have to get hunter involved if I'm giving up KAT
Something like KAT for Hunter, Collins, and picks + salary filler
or
Kat, Naz, and okogie or culver for capela, collins, and hunter. I'm not sure they would give up that much though.
