Minnesota Sports Forum

Q12543 wrote:Here is how I would characterize Wiggins: Without regard to context, he was an average defender at best and slightly below average offensively due to mediocre efficiency.

However, once you put into context his age, minutes played, and the fact his comrades were all in the M.A.S.H. unit, he had a stellar rookie year. His upside is tremendous, but I still feel he will end up closer to Paul George than Lebron James or Michael Jordan.

Pretty much agreed. It's not that Wiggins shut down many guys. It's that he was willing to try. That's HUGE for a #1 pick on the worst team in the league.

In back-to-back games, he guarded Zach Randolph in the post at the end of a close loss. The next night, he started the game guarding Chris Paul.

Granted, he was destroyed in different ways by both (Paul put on a clinic that was just insane). But that's not the point. How many top young guys have enough potential for a coach to even put him in those positions. And how many young guys would be too worried about looking foolish instead of manning up and doing his best in very tough spots?

I'm just not buying Giannis stock. I get he played pretty well at 20, but his stardom to me solely relies on whether or not he can get a jumper and I think at that size it's difficult to get a jumper if you don't have one already. He's Durant without a jumper which means he's good, but won't be a star. I also think a Parker Monroe frontcourt could prove problematic for them defensively moving forward. I'd definitely take Utah over Milwaukee moving forward. They have two all-stars in Hayward and Gobert and Favors is a solid two-way player. Lyles is a nice offensive compliment in that frontcourt and they really just need shooting in their backcourt to finish the rebuild. If they had Lavine I think they'd be the number 1 team out of this group.

I like our young.core the most, but it's tough watching the spurs get better again.

KiwiMatt wrote:Wiggins and Town is definitely the best pairing potential wise. They have all the tools and what's even more important - great attitudes and no egos, meaning they should be able to co-exist.

Just imagine if we had drafted the Greek Freak instead of Bazz..... I like Bazz, but Antetokounmpo is going to be a beast.

If Bazz can stay healthy he has shown plenty that he can be a pretty good player. Giannis has that 2-way player thing going for him, but I think people sell Bazz short all the time on ceiling upside. I liked Sergey Karasev and he hasn't done much especially compared to either of those guys.

khans2k5 wrote:I'm just not buying Giannis stock. I get he played pretty well at 20, but his stardom to me solely relies on whether or not he can get a jumper and I think at that size it's difficult to get a jumper if you don't have one already.

This same can be said about Wiggins. Wiggins shot jump shots in his rookie season with .332 accuracy while Giannis shot his with .320 accuracy in his 2nd season. That difference is not that dramatic that you could make a conclusion that one would have potentially good jump shot and other wouldn't have it even if Wiggins shot more than twice as many of those.

Giannis has also already shown signs that his jump shot is improving. Here are his career jump shot numbers season splitted to season halfs:

2013-14 1st half: 30/113 = 0.265 (4.14 jump shots per 36 minutes)
2013-14 2nd half: 29/103 = 0.282 (4.04 jump shots per 36 minutes)
2014-15 1st half: 44/164 = 0.268 (4.37 jump shots per 36 minutes)
2014-15 2nd half: 80/223 = 0.359 (6.76 jump shots per 36 minutes)

It seems that Giannis started to get some confidence to his jump shot in the 2nd half of last year that was visible also as an increase in the amount of jump shot attempts.

Below are similar numbers from Wiggins:

2014-15 1st half: 145/437 = 0.332 (9.88 jump shots per 36 minutes)
2014-15 2nd half: 109/327 = 0.333 (8.55 jump shots per 36 minutes)

Giannis is little over two months older than Wiggins and he has played organized basketball basically just two years. Before that he was playing in very low level in Greece. (I think it was 3rd highest level league in Greece) So his potential is still tremendous in all aspects of game.

Mikkeman wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:I'm just not buying Giannis stock. I get he played pretty well at 20, but his stardom to me solely relies on whether or not he can get a jumper and I think at that size it's difficult to get a jumper if you don't have one already.

This same can be said about Wiggins. Wiggins shot jump shots in his rookie season with .332 accuracy while Giannis shot his with .320 accuracy in his 2nd season. That difference is not that dramatic that you could make a conclusion that one would have potentially good jump shot and other wouldn't have it even if Wiggins shot more than twice as many of those.

Giannis has also already shown signs that his jump shot is improving. Here are his career jump shot numbers season splitted to season halfs:

2013-14 1st half: 30/113 = 0.265 (4.14 jump shots per 36 minutes)
2013-14 2nd half: 29/103 = 0.282 (4.04 jump shots per 36 minutes)
2014-15 1st half: 44/164 = 0.268 (4.37 jump shots per 36 minutes)
2014-15 2nd half: 80/223 = 0.359 (6.76 jump shots per 36 minutes)

It seems that Giannis started to get some confidence to his jump shot in the 2nd half of last year that was visible also as an increase in the amount of jump shot attempts.

Below are similar numbers from Wiggins:

2014-15 1st half: 145/437 = 0.332 (9.88 jump shots per 36 minutes)
2014-15 2nd half: 109/327 = 0.333 (8.55 jump shots per 36 minutes)

Giannis is little over two months older than Wiggins and he has played organized basketball basically just two years. Before that he was playing in very low level in Greece. (I think it was 3rd highest level league in Greece) So his potential is still tremendous in all aspects of game.

Wiggins was the best jump shooting prospect when compared to guys like Lebron, etc. at one point last year. In January at his peak he shot 46/34/79 on 16 shots and almost 3 three's a game. His 36 MPG's (38+ from January on) took his legs away from him. Look at his 3pt percentages by month. 100/42/33/34/18/19/11. Wiggins played 438 more minutes than Giannis last year. That's an extra 9 full 48 minute games for a guy who only played in 30 something games the year before in college. I think a dialed back Wiggins in terms of minutes is a much better jump shooter than Giannis through the course of a season. When you factor in Wiggins' slow start and exhausted finish I think his true numbers occurred from December-February and then he was done because of the minutes load. It's probably not likely to be found, but those are the numbers I'd want to see compared to Giannis and that's around the time I remember him receiving the praise for being the best jump shooting prospect of top young rookie players of the past like Lebron.

khans2k5 wrote: I also think a Parker Monroe frontcourt could prove problematic for them defensively moving forward.

Milwaukee had last year 2nd ranked defense in whole NBA with Parker/Ilyasova and Pachulia playing majority of minutes as their bigs. I don't see that Parker/Monroe combination would be worse than that in future. Having rim protecting small forward in Giannis helps a lot. Similar way than Kirilenko helped to cover sub-par defense of Okur/Boozer front court in Utah. I see still outside shooting as most critical problem with Milwaukee's current players. They have just Middleton, Mayo and Vasquez whom have reliable 3-point shot.

Mikkeman, Like your Giannis/Kirilenko comparison. I agree that Giannis is one of these rare players that can offer a combination of rim protection and wing defense from the small forward slot. He is going to just keep getting better and better.

Bucks and wolves will have some good battles in the next few years, too bad they don't play often enough

I wouldn't be shocked if the Magic's best player is Hezonja.