Minnesota Sports Forum

I'd do the trade in a heartbeat.

C Bamba
PF Towns
SF Butler
SG #20
PG Teague

Off and running

CoolBreeze44 wrote:The way I look at it is we could move Butler, or he is going to move himself. This season is going to be a shit show. Thibs may not make it through the entire year. Butler is going to get hurt again. And Kat isn't suddenly going to become a defensive force. Butler will be itching to leave by the end of the year.

Well said, Cool. We move Butler or he'll move himself. The problem is that Thibodeau would never trade Butler. Jimmy is his crown jewel. He'll keep Jimmy and re-sign Rose. This is why I wanted to replace Thibodeau after last season. We're approaching the luxury tax threshold as an 8th seed that came within one game of the lottery this past season. Butler is coming off knee surgery at age 29 with an injury-plagued career behind him in his early and mid-20s. I like Butler and recognize what he did for the Wolves this past season, but this team will come nowhere near a championship building around Butler. We have the play the long game and add talent in their early to mid 20s to combine with KAT and Wiggins.

Getting a guy like Doncic is how this franchise can get on a track to eventually get past the Warriors when they begin to decline. Draft Doncic at #4, and Okogie or Khyrie Thomas at #20. See how we do this next season with KAT, Wiggins, Teague, Gibson, Tyus, Doncic and Thomas or Okogie. Then make good use cap space next summer when Gibson comes off the books, maybe move Teague and draft wisely. Perhaps Patton starts to emerge as a bona fide NBA player along the way. That's the path. Keeping Butler eventually takes us into a ditch.

lipoli390 wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:The way I look at it is we could move Butler, or he is going to move himself. This season is going to be a shit show. Thibs may not make it through the entire year. Butler is going to get hurt again. And Kat isn't suddenly going to become a defensive force. Butler will be itching to leave by the end of the year.

Well said, Cool. We move Butler or he'll move himself. The problem is that Thibodeau would never trade Butler. Jimmy is his crown jewel. He'll keep Jimmy and re-sign Rose. This is why I wanted to replace Thibodeau after last season. We're approaching the luxury tax threshold as an 8th seed that came within one game of the lottery this past season. Butler is coming off knee surgery at age 29 with an injury-plagued career behind him in his early and mid-20s. I like Butler and recognize what he did for the Wolves this past season, but this team will come nowhere near a championship building around Butler. We have the play the long game and add talent in their early to mid 20s to combine with KAT and Wiggins.

Getting a guy like Doncic is how this franchise can get on a track to eventually get past the Warriors when they begin to decline. Draft Doncic at #4, and Okogie or Khyrie Thomas at #20. See how we do this next season with KAT, Wiggins, Teague, Gibson, Tyus, Doncic and Thomas or Okogie. Then make good use cap space next summer when Gibson comes off the books, maybe move Teague and draft wisely. Perhaps Patton starts to emerge as a bona fide NBA player along the way. That's the path. Keeping Butler eventually takes us into a ditch.

The Pacers were smart, and could see what was going to happen with Paul George...hopefully we are as well but its hard to imagine after not making Wiggins work hard this past season before gifting him a max when we had absolutely no reason to give it to him so quickly!

Fire Thibs right now. Trade Butler for Doncic. Grow some balls Taylor. You've already done enough damage hiring the fat slob.

khans2k5 wrote:I'm keeping Butler. He and Towns were both 3rd team all-NBA. We shouldn't be breaking that duo up. That's two top 15 guys. A majority of teams in the league don't have that. I would still keep Wiggins more than likely. He's an iron man and those are rare. I saw enough improvement last year to believe he can contribute in key ways to a good team.

That duo gives you a treadmill team in today's league. Trade Butler for picks and lay low. Nobody wins shit next 3-4 years. Thanks KD.

Brooklyn_Wolves wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:I'm keeping Butler. He and Towns were both 3rd team all-NBA. We shouldn't be breaking that duo up. That's two top 15 guys. A majority of teams in the league don't have that. I would still keep Wiggins more than likely. He's an iron man and those are rare. I saw enough improvement last year to believe he can contribute in key ways to a good team.

That duo gives you a treadmill team in today's league. Trade Butler for picks and lay low. Nobody wins shit next 3-4 years. Thanks KD.

Ya, let's just go back to being lottery bound losers again. That'll do wonders for keeping KAT around. We have the ability to win a lot now even if it isn't for a title and then re-tool when KAT and Wiggins hit their prime to actually take our shot when the Warriors are aged out. Everyone just wants to jump from garbage to contender in a few years like it'll be just flipping a switch and that's not how any of this works. Getting Lebron has been the only way that has happened and he's not coming here. Everyone else has had to build a winner and that takes time. We have the best of both worlds right now and people want to blow it up to try to raise our ceiling. It's pretty damn hard to find one top 15 player let alone 2 so a majority of your options you present will be worse for the team than better. A lot of sure thing analysis going on here when we're the ones with he two top 15 player already and the rest is just potential...again...

khans2k5 wrote:

Brooklyn_Wolves wrote:

khans2k5 wrote:I'm keeping Butler. He and Towns were both 3rd team all-NBA. We shouldn't be breaking that duo up. That's two top 15 guys. A majority of teams in the league don't have that. I would still keep Wiggins more than likely. He's an iron man and those are rare. I saw enough improvement last year to believe he can contribute in key ways to a good team.

That duo gives you a treadmill team in today's league. Trade Butler for picks and lay low. Nobody wins shit next 3-4 years. Thanks KD.

Ya, let's just go back to being lottery bound losers again. That'll do wonders for keeping KAT around. We have the ability to win a lot now even if it isn't for a title and then re-tool when KAT and Wiggins hit their prime to actually take our shot when the Warriors are aged out. Everyone just wants to jump from garbage to contender in a few years like it'll be just flipping a switch and that's not how any of this works. Getting Lebron has been the only way that has happened and he's not coming here. Everyone else has had to build a winner and that takes time. We have the best of both worlds right now and people want to blow it up to try to raise our ceiling. It's pretty damn hard to find one top 15 player let alone 2 so a majority of your options you present will be worse for the team than better. A lot of sure thing analysis going on here when we're the ones with he two top 15 player already and the rest is just potential...again...

Well, firing Thibs will boost KAT's morale. Butler is leaving in a year on his own so it's now or never to cash in. Of course it's better to win games than lottery but you can't just let butler go without compensation. Jimmy is too hollywood for Minny. He was back partying in CHI as soon as game 5 was lost. He has no ties to Minny and Thipsy is fired too in a year.

I'd do that Wiggins trade in a heartbeat.

Wiggins isn't worth anywhere NEAR that contract (4 or 5 more years?!). Eating the Parsons money for two years gets us out of that deal quicker.

The thought of getting Doncic makes me salivate, but I'd take a lot of those guys in the top several picks. There are a lot of bigs there who, if they worked out, might push KAT back to the 4, which isn't ideal. But a lot of those guys look like they have a pretty modern skillset, including some range. Carter or Bamba could both be potentially good next to Towns. Watching Gobert's impact this year defensively makes me more interested in a guy like Bamba. Porter's health scares me a bit, but he'd allow KAT to stay at the 5. We could also just try to trade back a bit and get Mikal Bridges, who would be a GREAT fit.

As far as the impact of losing Wiggins, Honestly, there are probably a decent number of role players you could just sign and plug into Wiggins' starting spot and the team would honestly be just as good and probably better because we'd have more scoring coming from more efficient shooters who do more to help make their team better.

For those worried about losing Butler to free agency, I don't think trading him is the best response. I think he's much more likely to go if we DON'T replace Wiggins with a more 3 and D guy who would actually fit. Instead, make it clear that you are building around Butler and Towns. Trading Butler should get a good haul, but he's an actual star, and there's never a sure thing you'll get a star out of the return.

SameOldNudityDrew wrote:I'd do that Wiggins trade in a heartbeat.

Wiggins isn't worth anywhere NEAR that contract (4 or 5 more years?!). Eating the Parsons money for two years gets us out of that deal quicker.

The thought of getting Doncic makes me salivate, but I'd take a lot of those guys in the top several picks. There are a lot of bigs there who, if they worked out, might push KAT back to the 4, which isn't ideal. But a lot of those guys look like they have a pretty modern skillset, including some range. Carter or Bamba could both be potentially good next to Towns. Watching Gobert's impact this year defensively makes me more interested in a guy like Bamba. Porter's health scares me a bit, but he'd allow KAT to stay at the 5. We could also just try to trade back a bit and get Mikal Bridges, who would be a GREAT fit.

As far as the impact of losing Wiggins, Honestly, there are probably a decent number of role players you could just sign and plug into Wiggins' starting spot and the team would honestly be just as good and probably better because we'd have more scoring coming from more efficient shooters who do more to help make their team better.

For those worried about losing Butler to free agency, I don't think trading him is the best response. I think he's much more likely to go if we DON'T replace Wiggins with a more 3 and D guy who would actually fit. Instead, make it clear that you are building around Butler and Towns. Trading Butler should get a good haul, but he's an actual star, and there's never a sure thing you'll get a star out of the return.

Drew -- I just don't see the Grizzlies giving us the 4th pick for Wiggins. It's just not going to happen. But I'm fairly certain they'd do the deal for Butler and perhaps give us another asset - maybe their second round pick. That's a realistic deal and one I think the Wolves should do but won't as long as Thibodeau runs the organization. I just don't see much merit in building around the 29 year old Butler and 23 year old Towns. The age differential coupled with Butler's injury propensity, Golden State's continuing prowess the next couple seasons, the Wolves cap situation, and the risk Butler bolts after next season make the Butler/KAT pairing a bad one.

This team with that pair and all the other players Thibodeau brought in barely ended up as the 8th seed last season. The Wolves have only around $5.5 million and the 20th pick in this year's draft to improve the roster this summer. This team simply won't be in a position to compete with the Warriors or the Rockets next season and may not even be competitive with the Lakers. Butler will miss at least 15 games because he almost always does and Wiggins hasn't given us much reason to believe he'll take a big leap forward. Gibson had a career year last season and won't likely play at that same level next season.

Bottom line is that the Wolves were the 7th oldest team in the League last season. The organization with its current roster, including Butler, is clearly not on a trajectory to eventually displace the Warriors and win the Western Conference. The organization should be forcused on extending KAT and then pursuing young high upside players through the draft in search of another young allstar to pair with KAT for the next 7+ years. Butler is the one asset we have who could get us a pick high enough to potentially land that kind of young talent. The time to act is this summer. But alas, Thibodeau will probably keep Butler, re-sign Rose and trade for Lual Deng as he continues his nostalgic effort to put the old band back together.

Grizzlies want to win with Conley, Gasol and the new star. That's not Wiggins. That's Derozan. Butler, maybe Beal, But it's certainly not Wiggins. Don't be dense people, use your brains.