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Re: Justin Patton has been assigned to the G-League Wolves

Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2017 12:02 pm
by Monster
crazy-canuck wrote:I'm hoping for a Clint capella type out of Patton.

Amir is probably the only guy in Iowa worth a look.


Yeah Patton reminds me a lot of Capela. It's nice that Patton has jumper that looks good. Capela's rebound block numbers have always been pretty good so that might be hard for Patton to do. Capela's FT% has really improved over time after starting out being pretty horrific.

It feels like the Wolves have some nice options for bigs both now and for the future but wings...idk hard to say. There are a lot of teams looking for decent wings. Look at the Pels who had Darius Miller for a few years then he went over to Europe and now looks like a pretty nice player. Just because a guy like MGH isn't playing now doesn't mean he won't be useful down the line. We need to develop some guys that's what good teams do. Not all of them will turn out to be useful but hitting on a couple will help quite a bit.

Re: Justin Patton has been assigned to the G-League Wolves

Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2017 3:15 pm
by Lipoli390
Q12543 wrote:Long, The blocks were nice, but it's so much different than the NBA that it is really hard to discern his defensive potential from watching these G-league games. He seems to have a similar problem as Dieng and KAT, in that he isn't really strong in the core/trunk muscles, making him a little soft and top heavy. We've seen what a huge deal this is in defending the paint. Often holding your ground and walling up is far better defense than chasing blocks, trying to draw charges, and generally getting toppled out of position easily. Heck, just witness the way Taj stays solid versus KAT. Such a contrast....


You are right, Q. I'm getting a chuckle out of the beginning of Patton-mania coupled with Gorgui fatigue on this Board. It's worth noting that Patton was not much of a defender or rebounder in his one college season. His only calling card statistically was his high shooting percentage.

As for shot-blocking, it should be noted that Patton blocked 1.4 shots in 25 minutes per game. In his first year at Louisville, Gorgui averaged 1.9 blocks in only 15 minutes per game. Both players have the exact same 9'3.5" overhead reach and Gogui has a half inch wider wingspan than Patton.

I'm also a bit perplexed by descriptions of Patton as a good athlete. He seems to have very good hands and he seems reasonably fast for a big guy in a straight-line sprint from end to end. But he doesn't look particularly quick laterally or bouncy off the floor. In fact, his combine numbers suggest he's not a very athletic player. His standing vertical was only 26" and his max vertical only 30.5". His agility score wasn't impressive either.

He has good, but not great length, good hands and what appears to be an accurate shot-range shot. He also seems to have pretty good pick-and-roll instincts. But he's not a super long, not a particularly good athlete and not physically strong. Most troublesome of all are his pedestrian big-man stats in college - 1.4 blocks and 6 rebounds in 25 minutes. I'm hoping for the best from Patton, but as most on this board know, I think there were better choices for Thibs.

I consider the Patton pick to be part of Thibs mediocrity as PBO. He hasn't been a bad PBO, but he hasn't done anything special. The Butler trade was a good one, but it didn't take much ingenuity or savvy to pull it off. The Bulls obviously wanted to trade Butler and the Celtics along with other potential suitors had their sights elsewhere. The Gibson signing has turned out to be a good one for the Wolves, but Thibs had to fork over a lot of money to sign him. I think Thibs overpaid for Teague. We would have been just as well off with D. Collision for $9 million less per year.

I do like that we got a first round pick for Ricky and I like that Thibs resisted the temptation to trade that pick for CJ Miles even though I'd like to have Miles on this team. Moreover, I don't consider Patton a terrible pick. So I clearly don't see Thibs as a bad or failed PBO. He just hasn't done anything special that would put him among the really good ones. He hasn't come up with an undrafted gem like Covington for example. Hopefully, Thibs will do something brilliant before next season. Actually, the smartest thing he could do as PBO would be to replace himself as our head coach. :)

Sorry this morphed into a criticique of Thibs as PBO. Back to Patton, I'll say I'm hopeful but not excited at this point. But who knows. Maybe the Patton pick will turn out to be that brilliant move that puts Thibs among the elite PBOs.

Re: Justin Patton has been assigned to the G-League Wolves

Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2017 9:26 pm
by WildWolf2813
I'll continue to say this about Patton: I'll be impressed if he contributes ANYTHING to the Wolves before the end of his deal. Let him conquer G-League before he gets called up.

Re: Justin Patton has been assigned to the G-League Wolves

Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2017 10:05 pm
by BloopOracle
lipoli390 wrote:
Q12543 wrote:Long, The blocks were nice, but it's so much different than the NBA that it is really hard to discern his defensive potential from watching these G-league games. He seems to have a similar problem as Dieng and KAT, in that he isn't really strong in the core/trunk muscles, making him a little soft and top heavy. We've seen what a huge deal this is in defending the paint. Often holding your ground and walling up is far better defense than chasing blocks, trying to draw charges, and generally getting toppled out of position easily. Heck, just witness the way Taj stays solid versus KAT. Such a contrast....


You are right, Q. I'm getting a chuckle out of the beginning of Patton-mania coupled with Gorgui fatigue on this Board. It's worth noting that Patton was not much of a defender or rebounder in his one college season. His only calling card statistically was his high shooting percentage.

As for shot-blocking, it should be noted that Patton blocked 1.4 shots in 25 minutes per game. In his first year at Louisville, Gorgui averaged 1.9 blocks in only 15 minutes per game. Both players have the exact same 9'3.5" overhead reach and Gogui has a half inch wider wingspan than Patton.

I'm also a bit perplexed by descriptions of Patton as a good athlete. He seems to have very good hands and he seems reasonably fast for a big guy in a straight-line sprint from end to end. But he doesn't look particularly quick laterally or bouncy off the floor. In fact, his combine numbers suggest he's not a very athletic player. His standing vertical was only 26" and his max vertical only 30.5". His agility score wasn't impressive either.

He has good, but not great length, good hands and what appears to be an accurate shot-range shot. He also seems to have pretty good pick-and-roll instincts. But he's not a super long, not a particularly good athlete and not physically strong. Most troublesome of all are his pedestrian big-man stats in college - 1.4 blocks and 6 rebounds in 25 minutes. I'm hoping for the best from Patton, but as most on this board know, I think there were better choices for Thibs.

I consider the Patton pick to be part of Thibs mediocrity as PBO. He hasn't been a bad PBO, but he hasn't done anything special. The Butler trade was a good one, but it didn't take much ingenuity or savvy to pull it off. The Bulls obviously wanted to trade Butler and the Celtics along with other potential suitors had their sights elsewhere. The Gibson signing has turned out to be a good one for the Wolves, but Thibs had to fork over a lot of money to sign him. I think Thibs overpaid for Teague. We would have been just as well off with D. Collision for $9 million less per year.

I do like that we got a first round pick for Ricky and I like that Thibs resisted the temptation to trade that pick for CJ Miles even though I'd like to have Miles on this team. Moreover, I don't consider Patton a terrible pick. So I clearly don't see Thibs as a bad or failed PBO. He just hasn't done anything special that would put him among the really good ones. He hasn't come up with an undrafted gem like Covington for example. Hopefully, Thibs will do something brilliant before next season. Actually, the smartest thing he could do as PBO would be to replace himself as our head coach. :)

Sorry this morphed into a criticique of Thibs as PBO. Back to Patton, I'll say I'm hopeful but not excited at this point. But who knows. Maybe the Patton pick will turn out to be that brilliant move that puts Thibs among the elite PBOs.


So are you saying John Collins isn't very agile either because they both had very similar stats in the agility test? Collins is a PF too so shouldn't he be significantly better agility-wsie? Virtually every scouting report I read on him says he is agile and a plus athlete.

http://www.nbadraft.net/players/justin-patton
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Justin-Patton-7310/
http://www.nba.com/draft/2017/prospects/justin_patton#/
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2717471-justin-patton-nba-draft-2017-scouting-report-grade-for-timberwolves-rookie
https://www.peachtreehoops.com/2017/6/10/15765146/nba-draft-prospect-breakdown-justin-patton-atlanta-hawks-creighton
http://www.nbadraftroom.com/2017/01/justin-patton.html
https://hardwoodhoudini.com/2017/02/14/hh-draft-profile-justin-patton/

As you can see all I can find are scouting reports talking about how mobile he is, how he's easily the best pick and roll defending Center in the draft, his quick burst and coordination. Quick leaper, 2nd jump faster than others, etc.

As far as you getting a chuckle about the Justin Patton hype, I probably get just as much of a laugh at you already pegging the pick as a Thibs failure along with the revisionist history around Butler claiming anyone could have done that trade lol. Do you not remember the media gushing over it the night of the draft and subsequent weeks? The billboard in Chicago screaming for GarPax to be fired? I get you don't like Thibs but you don't need to warp the narrative to suit your complaints about him, the archaic offensive he runs does that enough.

I guess I'm just a bit perplexed as to why you're perplexed about our views on Justin's defensive potential when the scouts have backed up exactly what the Patton optimists are excited about after seeing his first game?

Re: Justin Patton has been assigned to the G-League Wolves

Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2017 10:45 pm
by Lipoli390
Bloop. I havent' declared the Patton pick a failure. Those are your words, not mine. I just think there were better picks and yes, Collins was one of them. Patton may be agile, but I don't consider him a particularly good athlete overall. But athleticism's a hard thing to judge. More importantly, Collins had great rebounding numbers in college and Patton did not. I'm concerned when a big man has pedestrian "big-man" stats in college. Patton's big-man stats were pedestrian while Collins had elite rebounding numbers. Both had comparable blocked shots stats, but I'd expect more in that area from a center with a 9'3.5 overhead reach than a PF like Collins. We'll see how things work out.

Bloop -- An opinion is not revisionist history. I've never suggested that the trade wasn't considered a great trade for Minnesota. And I really don't care if some media dweebs thought the Bulls got fleeced. That was their opinion at the time and maybe they'll turn out to have been right, although it's worth noting that Dunn alone has averaged 17.8 points, 7.6 assists and 5.3 rebound over the last 7 games. It will be interesting to see now the trade works out for both teams over the long run. But if the media pundits turn out to be right about the Wolves getting fleeced, that says more about the Bulls front office than it does Thibs savvy. I don't think there was anything particularly savvy or brilliant about Thibs reflected in the Butler trade. The Bulls liked Dunn and LaVine and were apparently very high on Markkenan. Thibs wanted Butler. The fact that some think the Bulls front officer had bad judgment making the deal doesn't mean there's anything special in what Thibs did. The Bulls were aggressively shopping Butler and the whole League knew it. The Celtics had no interest. So we ended up with Butler. I think that's a good thing. I never said Thibs has been an idiot as PBO. He just hasn't been what I'd call a really good one. That's not revisionist history. That's just my opinion.