LloydBraun wrote:But..but..I was told by our experts on this board that Wiggins doesn't have what other highly drafted rookies have demonstrated after 25 games, so how can he be improving?
Reading this made my head spin. I don't recall anyone say he wouldn't or was incapable of improving.
LloydBraun wrote:But..but..I was told by our experts on this board that Wiggins doesn't have what other highly drafted rookies have demonstrated after 25 games, so how can he be improving?
Reading this made my head spin. I don't recall anyone say he wouldn't or was incapable of improving.
So the new story is somehow he just improved significantly over the last 4 or 5 games. I said before that the Wiggins bandwagon jumpers were just catching him in a slump. Now he appears to be back out of it. Some of the comparisons were based against the entire season for the other players, and the 20 game stats were much more comparable. Lebron James was shooting 39% from the field after 20 games in his rookie year.
Imagine what his numbers would look like if he was getting the foul calls he deserves. You could add 10% pts to his TS% and probably another 4 or 5 pts to his totals. That should eventually happen the more he goes to the hole.
LloydBraun wrote:But..but..I was told by our experts on this board that Wiggins doesn't have what other highly drafted rookies have demonstrated after 25 games, so how can he be improving?
Reading this made my head spin. I don't recall anyone say he wouldn't or was incapable of improving.
So the new story is somehow he just improved significantly over the last 4 or 5 games. I said before that the Wiggins bandwagon jumpers were just catching him in a slump. Now he appears to be back out of it. Some of the comparisons were based against the entire season for the other players, and the 20 game stats were much more comparable. Lebron James was shooting 39% from the field after 20 games in his rookie year.
Imagine what his numbers would look like if he was getting the foul calls he deserves. You could add 10% pts to his TS% and probably another 4 or 5 pts to his totals . That should eventually happen the more he goes to the hole.
Huh?
Really?
Seriously?
Is this some anti-Minnesota conspiracy talk? Or, just anti-Wiggins?
LloydBraun wrote:But..but..I was told by our experts on this board that Wiggins doesn't have what other highly drafted rookies have demonstrated after 25 games, so how can he be improving?
Reading this made my head spin. I don't recall anyone say he wouldn't or was incapable of improving.
So the new story is somehow he just improved significantly over the last 4 or 5 games. I said before that the Wiggins bandwagon jumpers were just catching him in a slump. Now he appears to be back out of it. Some of the comparisons were based against the entire season for the other players, and the 20 game stats were much more comparable. Lebron James was shooting 39% from the field after 20 games in his rookie year.
Imagine what his numbers would look like if he was getting the foul calls he deserves. You could add 10% pts to his TS% and probably another 4 or 5 pts to his totals . That should eventually happen the more he goes to the hole.
Huh?
Really?
Seriously?
Is this some anti-Minnesota conspiracy talk? Or, just anti-Wiggins?
Am I wrong? Even JimPete is harping on it on a nightly basis, and he is the anti-homer when it comes to color guys in the league.
LloydBraun wrote:But..but..I was told by our experts on this board that Wiggins doesn't have what other highly drafted rookies have demonstrated after 25 games, so how can he be improving?
Reading this made my head spin. I don't recall anyone say he wouldn't or was incapable of improving.
So the new story is somehow he just improved significantly over the last 4 or 5 games. I said before that the Wiggins bandwagon jumpers were just catching him in a slump. Now he appears to be back out of it. Some of the comparisons were based against the entire season for the other players, and the 20 game stats were much more comparable. Lebron James was shooting 39% from the field after 20 games in his rookie year.
Imagine what his numbers would look like if he was getting the foul calls he deserves. You could add 10% pts to his TS% and probably another 4 or 5 pts to his totals . That should eventually happen the more he goes to the hole.
Huh?
Really?
Seriously?
Is this some anti-Minnesota conspiracy talk? Or, just anti-Wiggins?
Am I wrong? Even JimPete is harping on it on a nightly basis, and he is the anti-homer when it comes to color guys in the league.
Be realistic. The hyperbole/homer optimism is too much in this case. It doesn't make sense.
Harden leads the league in free throw attempts. 9.2... with a sophisticated game and handle to draw those fouls at a ridiculous rate. Plus, a winning team that gets a few more freebies at the end of wins.
Wiggins is at 4.3 per game. Not bad for a rookie without much of a handle. You expect him to get 7 more attempts per game... and shoot 11+ attempts per game to lead the rest of the league by a wide margin? And he's not simply because of "bad calls?"
Remember, he's only shooting 69% from the line. So he'll need to get there at least 7 more times to make 5.
sjm34 wrote:
Am I wrong? Even JimPete is harping on it on a nightly basis, and he is the anti-homer when it comes to color guys in the league.
Be realistic. The hyperbole/homer optimism is too much in this case. It doesn't make sense.
Harden leads the league in free throw attempts. 9.2... with a sophisticated game and handle to draw those fouls at a ridiculous rate. Plus, a winning team that gets a few more freebies at the end of wins.
Wiggins is at 4.3 per game. Not bad for a rookie without much of a handle. You expect him to get 7 more attempts per game... and shoot 11+ attempts per game to lead the rest of the league by a wide margin? And he's not simply because of "bad calls?"
Remember, he's only shooting 69% from the line. So he'll need to get there at least 7 more times to make 5.
I would think the 4-5 more points is with the expectation he'll get his FT% up over 80 like most players with his talent level. I think we can realistically expect him to get a couple more attempts at the line when he's attacking.
AbeVigodaLive wrote:Does Martin really have much of a role here by the time he finally returns... if he does? The team is clearly in the run for a high lottery pick. Any misguided dreams of "competing" are long gone. And it's not like Martin is a great mentor for young guys. So why bring him back at all... unless it's to set the stage for trading him?
Do you really think Martin would raise a huge stink if he was asked to milk his injury even longer?
I have no idea. But I guess I assumed Martin would return to a starting role. I could be wrong on that. But that's what I've been thinking and that's why I was wondering how that might change things for guys like Bazz and Wiggins.
Also, as you noted, I think it makes sense to showcase Martin for potential trades. He been a decent player. I would like to think he would have some value when healthy. Maybe they could flip him for something like a true backup Center and a 2nd round pick?
- sjm giving Wiggins 4-5 more points a night based on... nothing really. Refs have missed some fouls on him, but he gets whistles on some softies too. I think his rate is OK right now. He's just not making enough of them.
- Carlos: trade Martin for a backup backup center and a 2nd round pick? Why in the hell would that be a good idea? He's our best shooter on a team that has no shooting besides him. He's an efficient 20 PPG scorer. He's paid very reasonably. To me, he's way more valuable than a third center and a 2nd round pick. I'm 100% down with keeping Martin.
Camden wrote:Things that made me go "huh" in this thread.
- sjm giving Wiggins 4-5 more points a night based on... nothing really. Refs have missed some fouls on him, but he gets whistles on some softies too. I think his rate is OK right now. He's just not making enough of them.
- Carlos: trade Martin for a backup backup center and a 2nd round pick? Why in the hell would that be a good idea? He's our best shooter on a team that has no shooting besides him. He's an efficient 20 PPG scorer. He's paid very reasonably. To me, he's way more valuable than a third center and a 2nd round pick. I'm 100% down with keeping Martin.
Have you been paying attention this season? We are in a youth movement/rebuild. Martin will be 32 next year. We have several young Wing players. Wiggins/Bazz are going to play. At some point we need to see what we have in GR3. And LaVine probably needs a look at SG too. I'm not seeing a need for Kevin Martin. Especially on a team that need to improve on defense.
What we do need is size. Specifically, at PF and Center. That's why I threw out one idea of show casing Martin for a trade when he's healthy. To me, if we can flip him for another piece we can use going forward - it's worth it. As to Martin's actual value? None of us know. It depends on how he looks when he gets back and other teams' needs.
