Ayo is back!

[D-Loser25]

They had to get him back, but that's a big number. I'm just sad they chose Randle over NAW and we're still dealing with that choice

Bingo. You absolutely nailed the source here. I was advocating for Naw over Randle. Then we could have traded for a PF instead of Ayo last year. Stupid choices have consequences. I’d much rather have NAW at his current contract than this. Much. Everyone could see NAW trending up to what he did this year, but we chose Randle over him. Terrible.

Show me the posts where everyone (actually anyone) saw NAW becoming a 20ppg scorer. I'll wait.

I never said I saw that specifically. I said that I preferred him at his expected contract over Randle for sure (and maybe Naz also, in terms of value for the contract). Anyone who knows basketball knows that NAW was trending up each year. Randle was trending down. There’s also been some kind of weird unwarranted loyalty from finch and maybe TC toward Randle. At some point there needs to be some accountability for TC not being able to identify the one player clearly trending up and the other player clearly trending down.

[kekgeek]

They had to get him back, but that's a big number. I'm just sad they chose Randle over NAW and we're still dealing with that choice

Bingo. You absolutely nailed the source here. I was advocating for Naw over Randle. Then we could have traded for a PF instead of Ayo last year. Stupid choices have consequences. I’d much rather have NAW at his current contract than this. Much. Everyone could see NAW trending up to what he did this year, but we chose Randle over him. Terrible.

Show me the posts where everyone (actually anyone) saw NAW becoming a 20ppg scorer. I'll wait.

Also Naw efficiently, Rebs, Asts, Asts/TO is super comparable to when he was on the wolves Per 36 to his Per36 this year with the hawks, the only difference is the volume went up with the hawks. He also fell off in the playoffs again.

I wish Naw was on the team but I think we are sort of crazy thinking the wolves were going to take Naw over Randle after Randle massively outplayed Naw a year ago in the playoffs.

I’m not a Randle guy but he was a borderline all star until the trade deadline. Man mental heath sucks sometimes

[Monster]

I’m gonna argue NAW is a slightly better overall player. Maybe that’s wrong, idk, maybe call it a tie. NAW is on 4/60 contract (3/45 for the next 3 years). With Randle now gone, we’re left with NAW vs AYO as the comparison. Looks pretty bad, value-wise, if you ask me. Plus we’d still have the 4 2nds. I hope that AYO surprises me, but I think it’s more likely that TC has fooled a lot of people into thinking he’s good at his job, when he’s average at best.

One of the four 2nds was one they got for the sign and trade of NAW to Atlanta.

Something to consider. NAW has a player option for year 4. How much does he get paid if he is playing well and opts out?

I didn't see Ayo play enough to really compare these guys and say which guy is better. I think Ayo has a better offensive ceiling actually which depending on how well he does or doesn't defend could make him more valuable. Again I'll say this wish we had both guys on the roster.

[Phenom]

The real disappointment is not trading NAW the previous trade deadline. We can thank Kevin Durant for that.

[Monster]

Bingo. You absolutely nailed the source here. I was advocating for Naw over Randle. Then we could have traded for a PF instead of Ayo last year. Stupid choices have consequences. I’d much rather have NAW at his current contract than this. Much. Everyone could see NAW trending up to what he did this year, but we chose Randle over him. Terrible.

Show me the posts where everyone (actually anyone) saw NAW becoming a 20ppg scorer. I'll wait.

I never said I saw that specifically. I said that I preferred him at his expected contract over Randle for sure (and maybe Naz also, in terms of value for the contract). Anyone who knows basketball knows that NAW was trending up each year. Randle was trending down. There’s also been some kind of weird unwarranted loyalty from finch and maybe TC toward Randle. At some point there needs to be some accountability for TC not being able to identify the one player clearly trending up and the other player clearly trending down.

"Everyone could see NAW trending up to what he did this year" that is specifically what you said which is why I asked. NOBODY saw that coming. Yes people thought he was valuable and trending up but not that. Also a few months earlier before the season there were people worried about his 3 point shot etc etc. It wasn't a slam dunk the guy was going to be as valuable as he was for the Wolves his last season there. Instead he won and very deservedly so most improved player of the year.

[D-Loser25]

Show me the posts where everyone (actually anyone) saw NAW becoming a 20ppg scorer. I'll wait.

I never said I saw that specifically. I said that I preferred him at his expected contract over Randle for sure (and maybe Naz also, in terms of value for the contract). Anyone who knows basketball knows that NAW was trending up each year. Randle was trending down. There’s also been some kind of weird unwarranted loyalty from finch and maybe TC toward Randle. At some point there needs to be some accountability for TC not being able to identify the one player clearly trending up and the other player clearly trending down.

"Everyone could see NAW trending up to what he did this year" that is specifically what you said which is why I asked. NOBODY saw that coming. Yes people thought he was valuable and trending up but not that. Also a few months earlier before the season there were people worried about his 3 point shot etc etc. It wasn't a slam dunk the guy was going to be as valuable as he was for the Wolves his last season there. Instead he won and very deservedly so most improved player of the year.

lol wow. Everything is measured in points per game for you, isn’t it? For being a casual fan who only sees PPG, you sure spend a lot of time on here lol. Can’t believe I’m sitting here typing about this…
Yeah, I thought NAW could be a successful two way starter on a decent team. I guess I dropped the ball on my PPg projection for NAW. In all seriousness, 20 is probably a bit higher than I would have guessed… maybe 16 or 17, but assuming his volume and opportunities just increased for whatever reason. I did not see 20, so you’re right, he exceeded my greatest expectations and dreams

[D-Loser25]

I never said I saw that specifically. I said that I preferred him at his expected contract over Randle for sure (and maybe Naz also, in terms of value for the contract). Anyone who knows basketball knows that NAW was trending up each year. Randle was trending down. There’s also been some kind of weird unwarranted loyalty from finch and maybe TC toward Randle. At some point there needs to be some accountability for TC not being able to identify the one player clearly trending up and the other player clearly trending down.

"Everyone could see NAW trending up to what he did this year" that is specifically what you said which is why I asked. NOBODY saw that coming. Yes people thought he was valuable and trending up but not that. Also a few months earlier before the season there were people worried about his 3 point shot etc etc. It wasn't a slam dunk the guy was going to be as valuable as he was for the Wolves his last season there. Instead he won and very deservedly so most improved player of the year.

lol wow. Everything is measured in points per game for you, isn’t it? For being a casual fan who only sees PPG, you sure spend a lot of time on here lol. Can’t believe I’m sitting here typing about this…
Yeah, I thought NAW could be a successful two way starter on a decent team. I guess I dropped the ball on my PPg projection for NAW. In all seriousness, 20 is probably a bit higher than I would have guessed… maybe 16 or 17, but assuming his volume and opportunities just increased for whatever reason. I did not see 20, so you’re right, he exceeded my greatest expectations and dreams

Edit - didn’t even realize NAWs stats were THAT good last year. Two way player. Geez, TC is lucky that he likes to hide in the small markets, mortgaging all of our future picks on his big swings, because if he was making these misses (Dilly trade, Kat trade, letting Naw walk, resigning Randle) in a place with higher expectations, he would’ve been out by now.

[WildWolf2813]

I really don't need to relitigate all of this, but hypothetically could they not have gained that flexibility automatically this off season at the latest if they had chosen not to extend him. Except they'd have Naw, the assets given up for Ayo and the money to sign Ayo anyway if they wanted?
At least that would be one of the potential outcomes. Another is that Randle wouldn't have exorcized his option and they would have had that flexibility last summer, and with what you've learned about Randle I'm beginning to think he would have taken it personally if no extension has been offered and would have chosen FA

Basically extending him cost us 5 slots in this draft. That's all.

You only woulda kept NAW had Randle opted out, which wasn't happening.

I'm almost certain you're not correct about that, and as I said, he might have opted out with how salty he gets about any trade rumour he's involved in. It was also possible for them to keep all three players it would have just been tight. It would have made sense for them to do that tho if they knew Randle would be off the books.

They also probably don't do the Ayo trade, meaning they still have those 2nds and maybe don't do the weird Conely trade that basically cost them the 21st pick this year.

The externalities are kind of endless and obviously not just limited to this most recent trade. It's not entirely worth it to go over all of it, but I think it worth questioning their judgement about in house talent when nearly every bet they made about Randle, and by extension Naw has gone sideways.

- Dilly, Clark and TJ were comically unable to replace Walker
- Randle being this mercurial and basically skipping town after the season ended is a bad look when you put so much on his shoulders, and constantly gas him up. I'm just weary of front office judgement here. They can't predict the future obviously but if this is who he is, than why extend him? Especially when the whole point of the Kat trade was to gain flexibility.
- Naw being able to legitimately play point guard for a playoff team is also a pretty rough look when they are now so desperately searching for one.

Complaining about each of these on their own and you could accuse me of hindsight bias, but with so many of these things going exactly the wrong way is suggestive that some people in that building are not great at accessing their internal talent.

This isnt really just a bitch session. I'm not just crying that TC and Finch sucks, but there are just so many little things that raise ones eyebrow

I promise you he wasn't opting out. There wasn't a 3 year $100 mil deal waiting for him. The Nets a year ago were trying to tank. Now they're trying to avoid the relegation zone. Things changed and we keep getting caught in the middle of these changes.

If I could sum up TC in one word, it's Irresponsible. He's playing roulette with an NBA team and if he loses, he gets fired, walks away and does something else with his life. We're stuck with the ruins of a NBA team if he screws up and he's not mindful of that.

The Randle trade tonight is not indicative of their foolishness. Bringing him back would have.

[D-Loser25]

"Everyone could see NAW trending up to what he did this year" that is specifically what you said which is why I asked. NOBODY saw that coming. Yes people thought he was valuable and trending up but not that. Also a few months earlier before the season there were people worried about his 3 point shot etc etc. It wasn't a slam dunk the guy was going to be as valuable as he was for the Wolves his last season there. Instead he won and very deservedly so most improved player of the year.

lol wow. Everything is measured in points per game for you, isn’t it? For being a casual fan who only sees PPG, you sure spend a lot of time on here lol. Can’t believe I’m sitting here typing about this…
Yeah, I thought NAW could be a successful two way starter on a decent team. I guess I dropped the ball on my PPg projection for NAW. In all seriousness, 20 is probably a bit higher than I would have guessed… maybe 16 or 17, but assuming his volume and opportunities just increased for whatever reason. I did not see 20, so you’re right, he exceeded my greatest expectations and dreams

Edit - didn’t even realize NAWs stats were THAT good last year. Two way player. Geez, TC is lucky that he likes to hide in the small markets, mortgaging all of our future picks on his big swings, because if he was making these misses (Dilly trade, Kat trade, letting Naw walk, resigning Randle) in a place with higher expectations, he would’ve been out by now.

Watch… this guy will trade for Durant (or Morant or Fox) tomorrow night and finish off his tenure with the dumbest move yet.

[Monster]

"Everyone could see NAW trending up to what he did this year" that is specifically what you said which is why I asked. NOBODY saw that coming. Yes people thought he was valuable and trending up but not that. Also a few months earlier before the season there were people worried about his 3 point shot etc etc. It wasn't a slam dunk the guy was going to be as valuable as he was for the Wolves his last season there. Instead he won and very deservedly so most improved player of the year.

lol wow. Everything is measured in points per game for you, isn’t it? For being a casual fan who only sees PPG, you sure spend a lot of time on here lol. Can’t believe I’m sitting here typing about this…
Yeah, I thought NAW could be a successful two way starter on a decent team. I guess I dropped the ball on my PPg projection for NAW. In all seriousness, 20 is probably a bit higher than I would have guessed… maybe 16 or 17, but assuming his volume and opportunities just increased for whatever reason. I did not see 20, so you’re right, he exceeded my greatest expectations and dreams

Edit - didn’t even realize NAWs stats were THAT good last year. Two way player. Geez, TC is lucky that he likes to hide in the small markets, mortgaging all of our future picks on his big swings, because if he was making these misses (Dilly trade, Kat trade, letting Naw walk, resigning Randle) in a place with higher expectations, he would’ve been out by now.

Casual fan? You didn't even know what his stats were this year!?! Lol I watched NAW play a game live and in person this year. I'm pretty far from a casual fan.