Minnesota Sports Forum

FNG wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 8:56 am Thanks to Bleedspeed for teeing up this thread. Perhaps we can limit discussions of Ant's personal issues to this thread, and only discuss his basketball performance in others.

It's a complicated issue. Can we enjoy watching a player whose personal behavior is despicable? Can we listen to and enjoy Michael Jackson's music? Can we watch a movie produced by Harvey Weinstein? Heck, even though it happened hundred of years ago, can we appreciate the art of DaVinci (who was accused of molesting young boys)? My opinion is yes...we need to separate the horrid behavior of the man from the skill which we enjoy, while at the same time condemning their poor behavior.

I agree with some here who wonder how each of us would act if we were 23 year old celebrities with millions of dollars. And I agree that Ant is not alone in making poor choices. But there is some evidence that Ant's behavior is much worse than even the average NBA player, and we need to recognize that and call it out...hopefully only in this thread. He seems to have no remorse for his repeated out of wedlock pregnancies, and his texts reflect a person with no empathy or concern for the welfare of others. He's such a dichotomy though, because it's so easy to like the guy at the same time...his childlike enthusiasm is quite endearing. But two things can be true at the same time...he is both a lovable charismatic young man, while also displaying horrible narcissistic non-empathic qualities.

But this is a basketball board, so while I abhor Ant's off-court behaviors, my main admittedly selfish concern is how does his character impact the Timberwolves. And I've ben making the same case for over a year now...my concern is that Ant might love the "NBA life" more than he loves winning, and this may hold him back. I contrasted his on-court behavior during the Laker game with that of two real winners...Davis and James. Ant seemed more interested in yakking it up with his summer Olympic teammates than he did in winning...and they in contrast seemed to be swatting him away like an annoying bug. I've said it before and I'll say it again...I worry that Ant may lack the gravitas needed to reach his enormous ceiling. I look back at the behavior of the top 100 players of all time, and Ant seems different to me. Wilt for example may have been banging a different woman ever night, but when he got on the court, he was all business. You never saw him chatting up his opponents on the court during he game...he just wanted to destroy him.

We don't know for sure how Ant's "social life" might be impacting his on court play. But late night dalliances and paternity concerns could be a reason why he seemed to tire so quickly during the playoffs. And his narcissism probably has a lot to do with his moments of incessant dribbling when a teammate is wide open...he can't see him, because at times he is focused only on scoring. I'll continue to cheer for Ant because he is our best player and best chance for a championship. But I don't respect his off-court (and sometimes his on-court) behavior at all, and hope that he grows up and reaches his potential.

Coolbreeze44 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 1:42 pm

FNG wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 8:56 am Thanks to Bleedspeed for teeing up this thread. Perhaps we can limit discussions of Ant's personal issues to this thread, and only discuss his basketball performance in others.

It's a complicated issue. Can we enjoy watching a player whose personal behavior is despicable? Can we listen to and enjoy Michael Jackson's music? Can we watch a movie produced by Harvey Weinstein? Heck, even though it happened hundred of years ago, can we appreciate the art of DaVinci (who was accused of molesting young boys)? My opinion is yes...we need to separate the horrid behavior of the man from the skill which we enjoy, while at the same time condemning their poor behavior.

I agree with some here who wonder how each of us would act if we were 23 year old celebrities with millions of dollars. And I agree that Ant is not alone in making poor choices. But there is some evidence that Ant's behavior is much worse than even the average NBA player, and we need to recognize that and call it out...hopefully only in this thread. He seems to have no remorse for his repeated out of wedlock pregnancies, and his texts reflect a person with no empathy or concern for the welfare of others. He's such a dichotomy though, because it's so easy to like the guy at the same time...his childlike enthusiasm is quite endearing. But two things can be true at the same time...he is both a lovable charismatic young man, while also displaying horrible narcissistic non-empathic qualities.

But this is a basketball board, so while I abhor Ant's off-court behaviors, my main admittedly selfish concern is how does his character impact the Timberwolves. And I've ben making the same case for over a year now...my concern is that Ant might love the "NBA life" more than he loves winning, and this may hold him back. I contrasted his on-court behavior during the Laker game with that of two real winners...Davis and James. Ant seemed more interested in yakking it up with his summer Olympic teammates than he did in winning...and they in contrast seemed to be swatting him away like an annoying bug. I've said it before and I'll say it again...I worry that Ant may lack the gravitas needed to reach his enormous ceiling. I look back at the behavior of the top 100 players of all time, and Ant seems different to me. Wilt for example may have been banging a different woman ever night, but when he got on the court, he was all business. You never saw him chatting up his opponents on the court during he game...he just wanted to destroy him.

We don't know for sure how Ant's "social life" might be impacting his on court play. But late night dalliances and paternity concerns could be a reason why he seemed to tire so quickly during the playoffs. And his narcissism probably has a lot to do with his moments of incessant dribbling when a teammate is wide open...he can't see him, because at times he is focused only on scoring. I'll continue to cheer for Ant because he is our best player and best chance for a championship. But I don't respect his off-court (and sometimes his on-court) behavior at all, and hope that he grows up and reaches his potential.

The one thing that sticks out to me is how his energy level fell off a cliff in the Dallas series. I don't buy it was due to the back he fell on, he didn't show any signs of injury. He just couldn't match what a 30's something Kyrie was doing. I don't think we will ever know if his off-court life was a reason, but it could have something to do with it.

Wolvesfan21 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 1:49 pm

Coolbreeze44 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 1:42 pm

FNG wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 8:56 am Thanks to Bleedspeed for teeing up this thread. Perhaps we can limit discussions of Ant's personal issues to this thread, and only discuss his basketball performance in others.

It's a complicated issue. Can we enjoy watching a player whose personal behavior is despicable? Can we listen to and enjoy Michael Jackson's music? Can we watch a movie produced by Harvey Weinstein? Heck, even though it happened hundred of years ago, can we appreciate the art of DaVinci (who was accused of molesting young boys)? My opinion is yes...we need to separate the horrid behavior of the man from the skill which we enjoy, while at the same time condemning their poor behavior.

I agree with some here who wonder how each of us would act if we were 23 year old celebrities with millions of dollars. And I agree that Ant is not alone in making poor choices. But there is some evidence that Ant's behavior is much worse than even the average NBA player, and we need to recognize that and call it out...hopefully only in this thread. He seems to have no remorse for his repeated out of wedlock pregnancies, and his texts reflect a person with no empathy or concern for the welfare of others. He's such a dichotomy though, because it's so easy to like the guy at the same time...his childlike enthusiasm is quite endearing. But two things can be true at the same time...he is both a lovable charismatic young man, while also displaying horrible narcissistic non-empathic qualities.

But this is a basketball board, so while I abhor Ant's off-court behaviors, my main admittedly selfish concern is how does his character impact the Timberwolves. And I've ben making the same case for over a year now...my concern is that Ant might love the "NBA life" more than he loves winning, and this may hold him back. I contrasted his on-court behavior during the Laker game with that of two real winners...Davis and James. Ant seemed more interested in yakking it up with his summer Olympic teammates than he did in winning...and they in contrast seemed to be swatting him away like an annoying bug. I've said it before and I'll say it again...I worry that Ant may lack the gravitas needed to reach his enormous ceiling. I look back at the behavior of the top 100 players of all time, and Ant seems different to me. Wilt for example may have been banging a different woman ever night, but when he got on the court, he was all business. You never saw him chatting up his opponents on the court during he game...he just wanted to destroy him.

We don't know for sure how Ant's "social life" might be impacting his on court play. But late night dalliances and paternity concerns could be a reason why he seemed to tire so quickly during the playoffs. And his narcissism probably has a lot to do with his moments of incessant dribbling when a teammate is wide open...he can't see him, because at times he is focused only on scoring. I'll continue to cheer for Ant because he is our best player and best chance for a championship. But I don't respect his off-court (and sometimes his on-court) behavior at all, and hope that he grows up and reaches his potential.

The one thing that sticks out to me is how his energy level fell off a cliff in the Dallas series. I don't buy it was due to the back he fell on, he didn't show any signs of injury. He just couldn't match what a 30's something Kyrie was doing. I don't think we will ever know if his off-court life was a reason, but it could have something to do with it.

I watched the Netflix thing and his diet isn't still great, despite seemingly having a chef cooking for him. Saw him eating chips and pizza and (maybe, my speculation) playing games till who knows how early in the morning. Sure not as bad as alcohol and smoking or other hard drugs, but he's not fully 100% in as of last year yet.

He certainly looked wrecked in that Dallas series. I'm not sure I've seen a player more tired then he was. Was it that injury? Was he a little sick maybe? Was it simply staying up late eating junk food and playing video games? IDK.

BloopOracle wrote: ↑Fri Oct 25, 2024 1:54 pm He's a friendly dude who can't keep his dick in his pants, the homophobic clip was a bit rough but other than that what's the big deal? I just don't get the ominous view towards him.

Wolvesfan21 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 1:49 pm

Coolbreeze44 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 1:42 pm

FNG wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 8:56 am Thanks to Bleedspeed for teeing up this thread. Perhaps we can limit discussions of Ant's personal issues to this thread, and only discuss his basketball performance in others.

It's a complicated issue. Can we enjoy watching a player whose personal behavior is despicable? Can we listen to and enjoy Michael Jackson's music? Can we watch a movie produced by Harvey Weinstein? Heck, even though it happened hundred of years ago, can we appreciate the art of DaVinci (who was accused of molesting young boys)? My opinion is yes...we need to separate the horrid behavior of the man from the skill which we enjoy, while at the same time condemning their poor behavior.

I agree with some here who wonder how each of us would act if we were 23 year old celebrities with millions of dollars. And I agree that Ant is not alone in making poor choices. But there is some evidence that Ant's behavior is much worse than even the average NBA player, and we need to recognize that and call it out...hopefully only in this thread. He seems to have no remorse for his repeated out of wedlock pregnancies, and his texts reflect a person with no empathy or concern for the welfare of others. He's such a dichotomy though, because it's so easy to like the guy at the same time...his childlike enthusiasm is quite endearing. But two things can be true at the same time...he is both a lovable charismatic young man, while also displaying horrible narcissistic non-empathic qualities.

But this is a basketball board, so while I abhor Ant's off-court behaviors, my main admittedly selfish concern is how does his character impact the Timberwolves. And I've ben making the same case for over a year now...my concern is that Ant might love the "NBA life" more than he loves winning, and this may hold him back. I contrasted his on-court behavior during the Laker game with that of two real winners...Davis and James. Ant seemed more interested in yakking it up with his summer Olympic teammates than he did in winning...and they in contrast seemed to be swatting him away like an annoying bug. I've said it before and I'll say it again...I worry that Ant may lack the gravitas needed to reach his enormous ceiling. I look back at the behavior of the top 100 players of all time, and Ant seems different to me. Wilt for example may have been banging a different woman ever night, but when he got on the court, he was all business. You never saw him chatting up his opponents on the court during he game...he just wanted to destroy him.

We don't know for sure how Ant's "social life" might be impacting his on court play. But late night dalliances and paternity concerns could be a reason why he seemed to tire so quickly during the playoffs. And his narcissism probably has a lot to do with his moments of incessant dribbling when a teammate is wide open...he can't see him, because at times he is focused only on scoring. I'll continue to cheer for Ant because he is our best player and best chance for a championship. But I don't respect his off-court (and sometimes his on-court) behavior at all, and hope that he grows up and reaches his potential.

The one thing that sticks out to me is how his energy level fell off a cliff in the Dallas series. I don't buy it was due to the back he fell on, he didn't show any signs of injury. He just couldn't match what a 30's something Kyrie was doing. I don't think we will ever know if his off-court life was a reason, but it could have something to do with it.

I watched the Netflix thing and his diet isn't still great, despite seemingly having a chef cooking for him. Saw him eating chips and pizza and (maybe, my speculation) playing games till who knows how early in the morning. Sure not as bad as alcohol and smoking or other hard drugs, but he's not fully 100% in as of last year yet.

He certainly looked wrecked in that Dallas series. I'm not sure I've seen a player more tired then he was. Was it that injury? Was he a little sick maybe? Was it simply staying up late eating junk food and playing video games? IDK.

rapsuperstar31 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 5:30 pm

Wolvesfan21 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 1:49 pm

Coolbreeze44 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 1:42 pm

The one thing that sticks out to me is how his energy level fell off a cliff in the Dallas series. I don't buy it was due to the back he fell on, he didn't show any signs of injury. He just couldn't match what a 30's something Kyrie was doing. I don't think we will ever know if his off-court life was a reason, but it could have something to do with it.

I watched the Netflix thing and his diet isn't still great, despite seemingly having a chef cooking for him. Saw him eating chips and pizza and (maybe, my speculation) playing games till who knows how early in the morning. Sure not as bad as alcohol and smoking or other hard drugs, but he's not fully 100% in as of last year yet.

He certainly looked wrecked in that Dallas series. I'm not sure I've seen a player more tired then he was. Was it that injury? Was he a little sick maybe? Was it simply staying up late eating junk food and playing video games? IDK.

That sounds like speculation, I've eaten pizza, chips, gummy bears and run 2:50 marathon the next day, eaten junk food and ran 24 hour ragnar relays on very little sleep just fine.

FNG wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 8:56 am Thanks to Bleedspeed for teeing up this thread. Perhaps we can limit discussions of Ant's personal issues to this thread, and only discuss his basketball performance in others.

It's a complicated issue. Can we enjoy watching a player whose personal behavior is despicable? Can we listen to and enjoy Michael Jackson's music? Can we watch a movie produced by Harvey Weinstein? Heck, even though it happened hundred of years ago, can we appreciate the art of DaVinci (who was accused of molesting young boys)? My opinion is yes...we need to separate the horrid behavior of the man from the skill which we enjoy, while at the same time condemning their poor behavior.

I agree with some here who wonder how each of us would act if we were 23 year old celebrities with millions of dollars. And I agree that Ant is not alone in making poor choices. But there is some evidence that Ant's behavior is much worse than even the average NBA player, and we need to recognize that and call it out...hopefully only in this thread. He seems to have no remorse for his repeated out of wedlock pregnancies, and his texts reflect a person with no empathy or concern for the welfare of others. He's such a dichotomy though, because it's so easy to like the guy at the same time...his childlike enthusiasm is quite endearing. But two things can be true at the same time...he is both a lovable charismatic young man, while also displaying horrible narcissistic non-empathic qualities.

But this is a basketball board, so while I abhor Ant's off-court behaviors, my main admittedly selfish concern is how does his character impact the Timberwolves. And I've ben making the same case for over a year now...my concern is that Ant might love the "NBA life" more than he loves winning, and this may hold him back. I contrasted his on-court behavior during the Laker game with that of two real winners...Davis and James. Ant seemed more interested in yakking it up with his summer Olympic teammates than he did in winning...and they in contrast seemed to be swatting him away like an annoying bug. I've said it before and I'll say it again...I worry that Ant may lack the gravitas needed to reach his enormous ceiling. I look back at the behavior of the top 100 players of all time, and Ant seems different to me. Wilt for example may have been banging a different woman ever night, but when he got on the court, he was all business. You never saw him chatting up his opponents on the court during he game...he just wanted to destroy him.

We don't know for sure how Ant's "social life" might be impacting his on court play. But late night dalliances and paternity concerns could be a reason why he seemed to tire so quickly during the playoffs. And his narcissism probably has a lot to do with his moments of incessant dribbling when a teammate is wide open...he can't see him, because at times he is focused only on scoring. I'll continue to cheer for Ant because he is our best player and best chance for a championship. But I don't respect his off-court (and sometimes his on-court) behavior at all, and hope that he grows up and reaches his potential.

guest81 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 8:44 pm

FNG wrote: ↑Sat Oct 26, 2024 8:56 am Thanks to Bleedspeed for teeing up this thread. Perhaps we can limit discussions of Ant's personal issues to this thread, and only discuss his basketball performance in others.

It's a complicated issue. Can we enjoy watching a player whose personal behavior is despicable? Can we listen to and enjoy Michael Jackson's music? Can we watch a movie produced by Harvey Weinstein? Heck, even though it happened hundred of years ago, can we appreciate the art of DaVinci (who was accused of molesting young boys)? My opinion is yes...we need to separate the horrid behavior of the man from the skill which we enjoy, while at the same time condemning their poor behavior.

I agree with some here who wonder how each of us would act if we were 23 year old celebrities with millions of dollars. And I agree that Ant is not alone in making poor choices. But there is some evidence that Ant's behavior is much worse than even the average NBA player, and we need to recognize that and call it out...hopefully only in this thread. He seems to have no remorse for his repeated out of wedlock pregnancies, and his texts reflect a person with no empathy or concern for the welfare of others. He's such a dichotomy though, because it's so easy to like the guy at the same time...his childlike enthusiasm is quite endearing. But two things can be true at the same time...he is both a lovable charismatic young man, while also displaying horrible narcissistic non-empathic qualities.

But this is a basketball board, so while I abhor Ant's off-court behaviors, my main admittedly selfish concern is how does his character impact the Timberwolves. And I've ben making the same case for over a year now...my concern is that Ant might love the "NBA life" more than he loves winning, and this may hold him back. I contrasted his on-court behavior during the Laker game with that of two real winners...Davis and James. Ant seemed more interested in yakking it up with his summer Olympic teammates than he did in winning...and they in contrast seemed to be swatting him away like an annoying bug. I've said it before and I'll say it again...I worry that Ant may lack the gravitas needed to reach his enormous ceiling. I look back at the behavior of the top 100 players of all time, and Ant seems different to me. Wilt for example may have been banging a different woman ever night, but when he got on the court, he was all business. You never saw him chatting up his opponents on the court during he game...he just wanted to destroy him.

We don't know for sure how Ant's "social life" might be impacting his on court play. But late night dalliances and paternity concerns could be a reason why he seemed to tire so quickly during the playoffs. And his narcissism probably has a lot to do with his moments of incessant dribbling when a teammate is wide open...he can't see him, because at times he is focused only on scoring. I'll continue to cheer for Ant because he is our best player and best chance for a championship. But I don't respect his off-court (and sometimes his on-court) behavior at all, and hope that he grows up and reaches his potential.

Comparing what ant did to what weinstein and mj did is ridiculous. Not even close to the same ballpark